Social Media/Media Companies Must Boycott European States Assaulting The Liberty of Free Speech

originally posted by: DAVID64
a reply to: chr0naut

It's fine that other countries have their own laws, but they are trying to enforce those laws on people in other countries. The UK says it will come after Americans or anyone else for breaking their laws.

What if you did or said something that was perfectly legal in New Zealand, but the US said " We don't like that and we're coming to arrest you".

But the US does that all the time. For instance:

- The American prosecution of Julian Assange was the prosecution of a non American, who was compliant with the laws of Australia (where he resided and had his citizenship), and whose website was hosted outside of the USA.

- The American prosecution of Kim Dotcom (New Zealand resident) for alleged distribution of US copyrighted material on his Megaupload site hosted in New Zealand, and that was legally compliant with New Zealand law.

- Not to mention hundreds of wars where the US was not directly threatened, and yet the US has fought against other nations ignoring their sovereignty.

- And let's not forget Gitmo, with hundreds of non-citizens 'renditioned' from foreign countries held without trial, and even tortured! How can you believe that America is anything less than a tyranny?

When Twitter was owned and operated by Liberals and censored Conservatives, everything was fine. Now that Musk owns it and they no longer have control of the narrative, it's suddenly a threat to Democracy.

Seems like pretty much anything that goes against their agenda is a threat to Democracy.

Social media are privately owned and they all pander to the sensational, as a way to attract people to advertising. 70% of the sites are probably collaborative fiction and advertising. They do not have the legal constraints of the news media, due to source anonymity, so a lot of the content is untrue.

Public reliance on social media for vital information, as if it just can't simply be untrue, represents the dumbing-down of the populace.

originally posted by: 5thHead

originally posted by: chr0naut

other countries do not consider lies and fraud to be classified as free speech, as is done in the USA.

Of course they do. That's how their leaders got in and remain in power.

It's the truth that they want censored.

In Australia and New Zealand, where I have been involved in the vote process, there are a lot of double checks, legislation, and observance of the process, to ensure it validity.

They won't even allow voting machines in those countries, and voting for all registered voters is mandatory. You get fined if you don't turn up to vote with proof of identity and get your name crossed off the electoral roll as having voted.

No dead people allowed.

Full chain of custody of ballots.

Multiple observers to ensure that one ballot = one vote, and that the anonymous ballots are faithfully recorded.

a reply to: BasicResearchMethods
Remember that these are not books removed from all State of Florida schools libraries. It is a compilation of instances from individual counties and districts, as it is each school district that ultimately addresses what books are available based on parental objections or suggestions.

I was wondering more what the economic penalty to Europe would be if these platforms went offline. Britain is on the verge of financial collapse, seems the riots were overstated intentionally as a distraction.

a reply to: worldstarcountry

The issue is not the extent of the ban but that someone with state authority is banning books like Fahrenheit 451. That's far scarier than someone trying to limit my access to videos of Tommy Robinson talking balls again.

Looking at how Europe's economy is structured, the loss of Xitter would be of little significance even if people didn't have VPNs.

Like J6, the British riots were not an eruption of the violence we all have in our hearts but a series of political events driven by populist politicians and the shady money behind them. They are a symptom of a cancer in the body politic. Even when the symptoms fade, the problem - inequality of wealth, the marginalisation of the white working class and the underfunding of public services in the regions etc - the sickness remains. Let's see if Starmer's centrist government does better than the Looney Tunes government it replaced.

We'll file "Britain is on the verge of financial collapse" under "needs fact checking".

originally posted by: chr0naut
a reply to: worldstarcountry

So, you suggest that countries who don't have the same laws, should be boycotted by the media companies?

Wouldn't that be limiting the freedom of expression of those in other countries?

Also, other countries do not consider lies and fraud to be classified as free speech, as is done in the USA.

The problem with not allowing "lies and fraud" to be "free speech" is many, but I don't even think you know what you are saying. If by lying you mean slander or libel, those are also illegal in the US. If by fraud, you mean the legal definition, that is an exact action that sometimes has speech involved.

Now by "lies and fraud", you mean posting an opinion you don't like, I assume, which yes, people are allowed to have opinions you don't like. The amount of fascists on this forum is alarming.

As to banned books specifically in Florida, I went to school to be a Lit teacher and there are tons of books in Florida that are what we would call "softbanned" ie don't teach them unless you have enough clout at your school that it wouldn't get you fired. Anything by Ayn Rand was on there, Brave New World, 1984, both Ender and Bean's books (basically any od Card's works), Steinbeck, Siddhartha, Little Big Man, and the list goes on and on and on. It scares me that students don't learn these novels as they are timeless. I have a personal grudge as Atlas Shrugged is one of my favorites and the woman who taught me that book was my mentor who got me into wanting to teach lit in the first place.

a reply to: BasicResearchMethods
I saw the movie Fahrenheit 451 in a classroom in middle school in Hillsborough County school district. I also read 1984 that I found in a library sitting on a table in Hillsborough High school, but oddly enough not from the catalog. Just as insane elected officials run what we feel are insane policies in other states which we respectfully disagree with, sometime these small bible towns have a handful of over-zealous churchy type Karens who will refuse to have a single written depiction of an over sexual act or description of such in any school library. Essentially these parents may be the same type that helped get the ratings system on Music, movies and TV and video games. They are concerned with what is in literature accessible by their children under the guardianship of the school district for which they fund through taxes.

They may have the support of the majority of their tiny school districts which often can be measured in less than a thousand kids. The primary objection to 1984 is Wilson's run in with that nasty old hag with one eye in the alley I believe where I think he was going to pay to have his dipstick serviced. I believe every single objection is due to a graphical description of a sexual act, which may be a single line of text in the entire book. I do not object to this mentality at all, but I also do not promote this mentality. I am indifferent to it for the most part, with regards to things like 1984 or 451 just because it is usually on behalf of a concerned parent who has local community support.

In Florida, we let our small towns be small towns. That is their right, they choose what they want. Just the same larger districts need to accept a majority of parents may not want such graphic depictions of reproductive behavior in schools either.

But In any case, whats the big deal with a 7 day blackout?? They will all still have their own government funded and national private media to consume. Perhaps a one week blackout from social media would be healthy and benefit everyone?

originally posted by: BigDuckEnergy

originally posted by: chr0naut
a reply to: worldstarcountry

So, you suggest that countries who don't have the same laws, should be boycotted by the media companies?

Wouldn't that be limiting the freedom of expression of those in other countries?

Also, other countries do not consider lies and fraud to be classified as free speech, as is done in the USA.

The problem with not allowing "lies and fraud" to be "free speech" is many, but I don't even think you know what you are saying. If by lying you mean slander or libel, those are also illegal in the US. If by fraud, you mean the legal definition, that is an exact action that sometimes has speech involved.

Now by "lies and fraud", you mean posting an opinion you don't like, I assume, which yes, people are allowed to have opinions you don't like. The amount of fascists on this forum is alarming.

A lie is something that a deceiver knows is untrue, but tries to deceive another with. It is different to an erroneous belief or misconception.

As to banned books specifically in Florida, I went to school to be a Lit teacher and there are tons of books in Florida that are what we would call "softbanned" ie don't teach them unless you have enough clout at your school that it wouldn't get you fired. Anything by Ayn Rand was on there, Brave New World, 1984, both Ender and Bean's books (basically any od Card's works), Steinbeck, Siddhartha, Little Big Man, and the list goes on and on and on. It scares me that students don't learn these novels as they are timeless. I have a personal grudge as Atlas Shrugged is one of my favorites and the woman who taught me that book was my mentor who got me into wanting to teach lit in the first place.

So, despite all the noise some make about how the 1st Amendment protects free speech (usually those wanting to defend themselves against prosecution for unethical activities), the truth is that the Constitution is not universally applicable or overriding in the USA.

The problem with trying to censor human thought is that humans are inventive and creative and can usually deduce such censored topics for themselves.

As you are an educator, I would expect it to be far better for students to be able to challenge and critique questionable ethics in an adult responsible fashion, rather than being babied by authorities.

a reply to: chr0naut
I will again reiterate, many of these books are not banned by state action, but by parental action due to a specific or several specific lines of text referring to sexual acts, describing sexual organs or other what more conservative minded people would consider vulgar and objectionable. It really is not based on Orwellian dogmas or how to pretend there is no facism. It is just parents who do not want their grade school age kids reading about Wilson in 1984 going to a seedy nasty part of town to get his dipstick serviced, in specific school districts, not even across the entire state.

It really does not get more Democratic than that, parents within each district having a say of which books with graphical depictions, even if just one line out of a novel, will be made available on government property during the custodianship of their children, within their specific districts.

a reply to: worldstarcountry


Yes sir! That right there says a mouth full. The facts are people in the region get to decide if it is in the children's school. The Public Library downtown is full on free speech.

a reply to: worldstarcountry

Like I said, not particularly literate and with no sense of irony.