The Search for Noah's Ark and the Aliens in the Book of Enoch Why Files

originally posted by: FlyersFan
Arizona.edu - Forget About Noahs Ark, There was no World Wide Flood

Most biblical and ancient Near Eastern scholars argue that the flood is a mythical story adopted from earlier Mesopotamian flood accounts. These earlier accounts include the 17th century BCE Sumerian flood myth Eridu Genesis,[5] the 18th century BCE Akkadian Atra-Hasis Epic,[6] and the Epic of Gilgamesh,[7] which are some of the earliest known examples of a literary style of writing. The most complete version of the Epic of Gilgamesh known today is preserved on 12 clay tablets from the library of Assyrian king Ashurbanipal (685-627 BCE). This extant Akkadian version is derived from earlier Sumerian versions. In the story, Gilgamesh and his companion, a wild man-beast named Enkidu, travel the world on a number of quests that ultimately displease the gods. After the death of Enkidu, Gilgamesh embarks on a journey to learn the secret of eternal life by visiting the immortal flood hero, Utnapishtim. Utnapishtim tells Gilgamesh how the god Ea (equivalent to the Sumerian god Enki) revealed the gods' plan to destroy all life with a great flood, and how they instructed him to build a vessel in which he could save his family, friends, and livestock. After the flood, the gods repented for destroying the world and made Utnapishtim immortal.

These flood stories appear to have been transmitted to the Israelites early in Israel's history. Contact between the Assyrians and the Israelites is known from the conquest of Israel and its capitol, Samaria, in 721 BCE by Assyrian King Shalmaneser V (727-722 BCE),[8] and from the attempted conquest of Jerusalem by the Assyrian King Sennacherib (704-681 BCE). These stories were apparently modified to conform to a monotheistic faith, but retained characteristics such as the destruction of nearly all living things via a flood, the salvation of a select few people and animals by the construction of a boat, and the regret of the deity for the flood, prompting a promise not to do so again. Thus, like many of the early stories in Israel's primordial history,[9] the flood story appears to be an adaptation and integration of a previously known myth into the theology of Israel.

That's certainly true but there could have been major floods throughout the history and considering the age of the planet which is about 4.5 billion years old.

originally posted by: theatreboy

There is evidence of world wide floods.

No, there is evidence of floods world wide. Not quite the same thing. There were massive, catastrophic, floods all over the world in 2023, for example. I don't recall seeing Noah, though.

Not enough water on or in the planet for the story to be true as told.

Live Science - Did Noahs Flood Really Happen

The one thing we know for sure from geology is that a global flood never happened," said David Montgomery, a professor of geomorphology at the University of Washington in Seattle and author of "The Rocks Don't Lie: A Geologist Investigates Noah's Flood" (W. W. Norton & Company, 2012). "If you look at it as literally a global flood that covered the world's highest mountains, I'm sorry, there's just not enough water on Earth to do that," he told Live Science.

If the "heavens" opened and all of the water in the atmosphere came down at once as rain, the planet would be submerged — but only to a depth of about 1 inch (2.5 centimeters), according to the U.S. Geological Survey. That's not enough water to justify a canoe, let alone a massive ark.

But what if more than the water in the "heavens" were considered? If all the world's glaciers and ice sheets were to melt, then sea levels would rise by more than 195 feet (60 meters), according to NASA, which would add a bit more water. Moreover, a 2016 study published in the journal Nature Geoscience estimated that there's 5.4 million cubic miles (22.6 million cubic kilometers) of groundwater stored in the upper 1.2 miles (2 km) of Earth's crust, which is enough to cover the land to a depth of 590 feet (180 m). That's a lot of water, but there are cities thousands of feet above sea level, and Mount Everest, the highest mountain on Earth, is more than 29,000 feet (8,849 m) above sea level. On top of that, geologists don't see evidence for a global flood in the rock record.

Talk Origins - Problems with a Global Flood

Implications of a Flood

A global flood would have produce evidence contrary to the evidence we see.

How do you explain the relative ages of mountains? For example, why weren't the Sierra Nevadas eroded as much as the Appalachians during the Flood?

Why is there no evidence of a flood in ice core series? Ice cores from Greenland have been dated back more than 40,000 years by counting annual layers. [Johnsen et al, 1992,; Alley et al, 1993] A worldwide flood would be expected to leave a layer of sediments, noticeable changes in salinity and oxygen isotope ratios, fractures from buoyancy and thermal stresses, a hiatus in trapped air bubbles, and probably other evidence. Why doesn't such evidence show up?

How are the polar ice caps even possible? Such a mass of water as the Flood would have provided sufficient buoyancy to float the polar caps off their beds and break them up. They wouldn't regrow quickly. In fact, the Greenland ice cap would not regrow under modern (last 10 ky) climatic conditions.

Why did the Flood not leave traces on the sea floors? A year long flood should be recognizable in sea bottom cores by (1) an uncharacteristic amount of terrestrial detritus, (2) different grain size distributions in the sediment, (3) a shift in oxygen isotope ratios (rain has a different isotopic composition from seawater), (4) a massive extinction, and (n) other characters. Why do none of these show up?

Why is there no evidence of a flood in tree ring dating? Tree ring records go back more than 10,000 years, with no evidence of a catastrophe during that time. [Becker & Kromer, 1993; Becker et al, 1991; Stuiver et al, 1986]

originally posted by: WaESN

originally posted by: theatreboy

There is evidence of world wide floods.

No, there is evidence of floods world wide. Not quite the same thing. There were massive, catastrophic, floods all over the world in 2023, for example. I don't recall seeing Noah, though.

I think they speak of great floods of biblical proportions which are almost certainly not true.

a reply to: Annee

I think you got that wrong!

It's the old days things were hard to hide and control, today it's one button and the digital trace of a news story vanishes...now a days it takes active countermeasures from someone to save it, a printed newspaper doesn't shred itself once over the counter.

That's not saying I disagree. truth will eventually come out we do live in interesting times after all.

originally posted by: McGinty

originally posted by: FlyersFan

originally posted by: theatreboy
Blind trust in science is no better than blind trust in Bidens foreign policy.

Truth is truth.

If that were true ATS wouldn’t need to exist 😉

True.

There may not be enough water on earth for a global flood.

However, if one might control the moon, it can be done.

If the moon were closer to earth, we would have higher tides.

. . . if the moon were half the distance from Earth as it is now, the tides would be eight times higher,

Source: What would happen if the moon were twice as close to Earth?

How about even closer? That would be a wall of water travelling across the earth every day.

So how might one move the moon?

Well, how about to translate orbital energy into rotation?

As the moon begins to rotate, the orbital speed would decrease, meaning the moon would draw closer to the earth.

Enough flooding?

Translate rotation back into orbit. The moon looses all its rotation and resumes its position.

ETA: maybe something akin to electron shells. But my physics/chemistry is crap ; )

Unbreathable Air

The conventional flood story states that the flood waters came from rain that lasted 40 days and 40 nights (Genesis 7:12).[note 1] Rain appears when the atmosphere can no longer support water in the vapor phase and it becomes saturated. Normally, the atmosphere is on the brink of saturation, and the variations in temperature and pressure caused by weather fronts are capable of altering the threshold at which precipitation will form quite easily. What about the amount of water vapor suspended in air needed for the 4.5 billion cubic kilometers of water needed for the global flood? The water vapor currently in the air is only around 2 to 3 percent on average, with a maximum of 4% limited by temperature and pressure.[6] The change in atmospheric conditions required to support enough vapor for 112 million cubic kilometers of rain per day — about 120,000 times more than the current daily rainfall worldwide[7] — would have rendered the air unbreathable.

Indeed, the atmosphere really couldn't sustain that much water even under the most extreme temperature and pressure conditions the planet can produce. If the conditions were right for that much water to be in the atmosphere, humans and virtually every other animal would have drowned through the simple act of breathing, as well as turning the earth into the equivalent of a pressure cooker with atmospheric pressure at nearly a thousand psi instead of the standard 14.7 or so that we have today. In fact, the pressure would have to be at least a thousand atmospheres to fit the 15 kilograms of water per cubic meter required to produce that much rain, which is 1) greater than the pressure at the bottom of the ocean and 2) enough to crush a human so five of them would fit in a soda can. Barring the goddidit escape hatch (a tried and tested fallback for creationists everywhere), this is impossible.

No food for the animals after the flood. IMPOSSIBLE.

Post Flood Animal Survival

After the flood, the animals on the ark would have faced extreme difficulties. Populations of less than 20 members are almost certainly doomed to extinction.[36] After the ark, there would have been 2 of most animals and 7[note 3] of a few select mammals plus 14 of all birds.[37] These animals would have faced some of the harshest conditions the world has ever known. A flood of 376 days[38] would have killed all plant life, while ocean currents between 40 to 80 meters per second would have swept everything away and buried the earth under a layer of sediment.[35] That's not even considering how long it would have taken the waters to recede. Because the entire planet is now water, the floodwater can't drain anywhere, and can only be removed with evaporation. Based on the 2mm/day evaporation rate of water, it would have taken *4 billion and 420 million* days for the floodwaters to all evaporate. If the earth is covered in water for 12.1 million years, everything we know and love as an animal is most definitely dead, including Noah.[39]

The post-flood herbivores would have had absolutely nothing to eat; most of them would have starved to death. Creationists claim that the great flood deposited meters of sediment all over the earth.[40] Seeds heavier than silt particles would have been the first to settle, buried far deeper than the few inches of depth that seeds need to sprout.[20] The few seeds that did get buried close enough to the surface to sprout would not provide nearly enough vegetation to sustain every herbivore on the ark. Many animals feed on large trees or their fruit, so these would have to fast a long time after the flood ended.[note 4]

The carnivores and omnivores on Noah's Ark would have a viable source of food, for a while at least: the other animals on the ark. The carnivores and the omnivores would have quickly eaten all the herbivores and then within a couple of months would turned on each other (The carnage!) and also eventually have starved to death. The creationist explanations for this make no sense; they claim that carnivores ate corpses, fungi, and even vegetables! Animals will rarely eat corpses more than a month old. The claim that these animals would have gladly eaten corpses that were over a year old and most likely buried under meters of sediment is beyond reason. Most carnivores are unable to eat vegetables (if it were then it would already be a part of their natural diet and thus they wouldn't be carnivores in the first place), and fungi do not grow too prolifically in the Middle East.

After the floodwaters subsided, the animals would have had severe trouble finding fresh water and would have died of dehydration. The flood would have salinated the soil, so all water runoff would have had high concentrations of salt. Most animals, unless they are specially adapted, cannot and will not drink salt water.[41]

The survivors of the ark would also have faced extreme difficulties breeding. The flood would have destroyed the structures necessary for reproduction. Avian species like the eagle require high trees to make their nests in.[42] These would not exist for many years after the flood, by which time the reproductive fitness of the birds would have deteriorated, leading to the extinction of that kind.

a reply to: FlyersFan

They’ve recently found huge amounts of fresh water under the Atlantic ocean. Maybe a bubble popped and a huge pressure flood of water came up out of nowhere.

a reply to: FlyersFan

Morning FlyersFan -

Yes, you and I have had these conversations before. I respect you, all other posts you have shared. However, I firmly believe Ron Wyatt was genuine and his findings were truth.

So, you and I will have to simply disagree on this topic.

All the best to you.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: BukkaWukka
a reply to: Annee

I suspect, that there are powers that be that stifle all such info and hide what has been found. Much like the giant skeletons that ended up in the Smithsonian and yet no one has any trace of them. Yet, newspaper clippings, eyesight testimonies of long gone times, still claim they existed.

Not buying it.

Nothing stays hidden in today's world.

That you know of.

originally posted by: FlyersFan
Noahs Ark and the World Wide Flood Story is just a myth and it never happened. Science and historical archeological evidence prove it. The science and the historical facts are all on this thread -

ATS Thread - Noahs Ark and the Biblical World Wide Flood Never Happened

Why must you be on this crusade against Noah's ark lol?!

There is way more to it, and I respectfully disagree, it did happen and Noah's ark is real.

I showed you the balls of Sulphur that a few different people have found and discussed which basically prove the story of Sodom and Gomorrah and the way that is connected to the debate of whether Noah's ark is real or not.

The original person who found those Sulphur balls was definitely on to something and being honest and truthful.

That same person has a really good case for finding Noah's Ark as well.

You will never look at the little intricate evidences though because you have to watch a long documentary with an open mind and put away your preconceived notions and prejudice towards certain people.

Like the fact that the land formation turns out to be the exact length of Noah's ark in Egyptian cubits.

I don't mean anything, just saying lol, I agree with most everything else you say

originally posted by: StokeGnar37
Why must you be on this crusade against Noah's ark lol?!)

Because the story is so damn stupid and easily debunked.

originally posted by: FlyersFan

originally posted by: StokeGnar37
Why must you be on this crusade against Noah's ark lol?!)

Because the story is so damn stupid and easily debunked.

We have to agree on something

originally posted by: NobodySpecial268
There may not be enough water on earth for a global flood.

There's plenty in the mantle. Just like it was written, the water came from below as well. A recent study in 2014 (link) found massive reservoirs of water deep beneath the earth's crust. This reservoir is holding enough water to fill the volume of the earth's oceans 3x over.






One researcher was quoted saying:

"We should be grateful for this deep reservoir... If it wasn't there, it would be on the surface of the Earth, and mountain tops would be the only land poking out."

This is exactly what was said to have happened to cause the global flood. Not only rain from the sky, but also the reservoirs of the deep were opened and water gushed out onto the surface of the earth:

originally posted by: FlyersFan
Not enough water on or in the planet for the story to be true as told.

So do you rescind this comment? It is peer-reviewed research that shows there is plenty of water under the earth's crust.

Define flood...

At the end of the last big ice age around 13000 years ago...(you know when earth had a few miles of ice stacked high over places like N.Y. and Europe) the ocean levels were around 600+ feet lower... There are cities submerged off of places like India and land bridges under a few hundred feet of ocean that once connected places like England and Europe while whole continents/large land masses are submerged.. Many past settlements were along a coastline as getting from one place to another was easier and safer by water; especially for trade goods.

Monument valley (America) was caused by an ice dam that broke (Canada) and caused one of the greatest releases of water the American continent has probably ever seen. Imagine being an Indian steeping out of your home for a morning pee and hearing a sound like no other while seeing a mountain of water several hundred feet high bearing down upon you and yours ! Kiss it good buy Pokeme Hontus !

I am of the opinion that Noah's Ark and other plagiarized fairy tales are just stories written by man to reinforce and put the fear of god in the uneducated/unknowing which the religious institutions use as control. Air-burst Comet or meteorite and a city destroyed...God did it to wipe out the sinful !! Tunguska anyone ? Evidently there was a huge impact 13000 years ago that helped rearrange and melt the ice sheets...

Religion has been just another way of coping with the unknown and giving solace to the afraid who believe if they tow the religious party line when they die it will be wonderful. 21 virgins comes to mind... Wonder what the Virgins think about all that ?

So define flood...

If religion gives you peace of mind and you are not one who wants to kill anyone who does not believe the way you are told to believe then fine. Just remember when the killing starts both sides think they have their god on their side... One side will lose.

originally posted by: 727Sky
Define flood...

At the end of the last big ice age around 13000 years ago...(you know when earth had a few miles of ice stacked high over places like N.Y. and Europe) the ocean levels were around 600+ feet lower... There are cities submerged off of places like India and land bridges under a few hundred feet of ocean that once connected places like England and Europe while whole continents/large land masses are submerged.. Many past settlements were along a coastline as getting from one place to another was easier and safer by water; especially for trade goods.

It's ironic because some of the little evidence for the ice age is actually proof of a global flood. They suppose 'erratics', which are essentially boulders on tops of places they shouldn't be, are due to glaciers from the ice age. Yet these erratics go far beyond the theoretical glacial maximum:



These erratics, or boulders found in the middle of nowhere / on mountain tops, are found in regions beyond the theorized reaches of the ice age. It makes more sense that they due to the flood:





and mostly everywhere else on the planet. Most people have seen out of place super large boulders somewhere at some point in their life. I see them on the peaks of various appalachian mountains. They are everywhere. And there is no better explanation than a global flood. Can't imagine how water can move boulders? Here's an example of water's effect on large rocks:



(at 15 seconds)

Makes more sense than glaciers pushing these monstrosities all the way to brazil:



I'm not sure why stock photo websites love holding mostly all the images of boulder erratics on the internet, but it shows that erratics are from flood waters rather than glaciers

a reply to: cooperton

Good point and info there, cooperton. I had forgotten about water below ground.

I think we need a physical mechanism that would lift the water out from below ground. A closer moon, and therefore an increased pull from above, might do that. It would be like gravity had weakened. Water might bubble up from below.

Just a theory of mine. The moon would make a good shield from all sorts of things like CMEs and solar flares, if the moon could be moved to intercept. I wonder if the lack of lunar rotation is the cause of the lack of lunar magnetic field.

A closer lunar orbit with lunar rotation might create a lunar magnetic field, which would affect the earth's magnetic field. Maybe strengthen the joint field to the point of regulating electromagnetic weather.

Like I said, just a theory I play around with sometimes. The moon as the ultimate shield.