Parents are not to be trusted

originally posted by: halfoldman
[snip]

And this has what to do with the topic?

The topic is the government saying parents are not to be trusted, only Biden, the teacher's union and the Dept of Education can be trusted with the nation's children.

a reply to: The2Billies

are you serious? Did you just type without actually reading what I wrote?

originally posted by: CoyoteAngels
a reply to: Peeple

I have a college degree in Information Technology. I minored in math. My son tutored math to other students in high school.

Neither of us could figure out some of the damn math homework in middle school, my grandsons brought home. It was a confused mess of English terms but few explanations of the actual math. It was like someone was teaching it but didn't understand it, so couldn't teach in any other way but by verbal description. it was a mess. It was example light, no solutions given. Not from a text book. It was pamphlet type handouts.

Homework should not take hours and hours every night. If it does, you may as well be homeschooling. What do they do at school all day? Get indoctrinated?

I am in college to become a k-5th teacher. The problem lies where the students are left to their own devices to figure out problems. It is incouraged as a teacher that you Llow for collaboration among students to try to find the answer on their own. They should work at a level that is not frustrating but right where they are challenged. They are then sharing with the class how they came up with the solutions that work for them. So there is no real teaching of any one method to solve a problem. This is also true for science and engeneering. I think it is sort of silly because some equations need to be solved in a specific way. I ended up getting myself into trouble in high-school because of a simpler equation I had learned one way and the teacher told me that I needed to do it their way because when this other equation came up what I am doing now will make it wrong.
It is a difficult concept to grasp for me as I am 44 and just doing this. I had learned what the text calls the " traditional" way. I think I will do a flipped classroom where lecture is on the computer and when they come to class we will practice as a group. I believe it will be less strain on parents and allow more time in class to help students understand while they are practicing to eliminate misconceptions.
Oh, and the traditional method of teaching ( explicit teaching for math) should only be on a tiered level. So, if you are having difficulty or IEP you would teach TRADITIONALLY. I think the let the kids try is a great way to do formative assessment of what they know so I know where to start teaching properly. It has its placebut not the whole time. With so many methods kids get confused.
It is apparent that kids get confused on topics where it is so open with multi answers. If I ask my class of four year olds to draw any animal they like at the zoo, I will have at least half the children confused. Even If I have a book and zoo toys set out for refrence, they mY still sir at the table confused. They will say I can't draw it. In these instances I will have conversations about the animal and the drawing for the child. They then can do it and 'in some instances, spend alot of time on there art.
And No I am not one of those teachers trying to manipulate kids self identity. I think that is repulsive. I am not sure where I will go to teach k-5 , but not an area where bs is being taught to kids. Believe it or not even in california there are areas where people do not have crud pit ideology. They try hard at my school to indoctrinate me. It ain't happinin'.

a reply to: cre8chaos

Im in CA. The schools where I am are a mess.

originally posted by: CoyoteAngels
a reply to: cre8chaos

Im in CA. The schools where I am are a mess.

Right now I work at a private pre-k. It's amazing. I have heard horror stories of the head start and kidango programs from old co-workers . The universal prek, ( in public schools),have been implemented. People who I know have transfered from private pre k to public pre k are seeing a huge difference on every front. The teachers I know are all saying how they are not being treated well by parents and children. There is problems with the district. Many of the parents who have younger siblings still in the center I teach, many of the parents site the child being bullied. Those children are not as happy. The teachers may be trying to do well but have double the ratio in a small classroom I am thinking I may stay private.

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: network dude

On purpose, yes it is true I don't. I watched my sister and my mother and aunts #ing it up hard and said: better not.
Also didn't feel the urge to give my genes a prolonged suffering in this world of the bat# crazy apes.

I don't often give advice to nuclear engineers, but you do you.

a reply to: underpass61

Clandestine...was more rudimentary, daily indoctrination. "Yes, Sister!"... and "Thank You, Father"... we just didn't get it ...we do now.

a reply to: The2Billies

thats why I'm probably homeschooling my kids when I have them. I'm pretty well educated and work in education, and not poisoned by current leftist thought

a reply to: Peeple

A generation of dumb entitled brats raising kids because of social norms and actually mentally incapable to take care of anyone more complicated than a goldfish.

This^^^^^^^^

a reply to: network dude

In riding you learn early on how important it is to regularly have someone not involved look over what you and the horse are doing, because it is easier to see the errors.

It's not like you need a degree in parenthood to raise kids. Though I personally would prefer it if that were the case.
There are just things that people do because they're not thinking about it, transferring the 'family curse' from generation to generation.

a reply to: The2Billies

Lets have listen to what JP has to say about this shall we?

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: The2Billies

Bitching about the schools is like a perfect example: why are the schools responsible for your children to do well?
They aren't they are a place to learn social behaviour and absolutely rely on the parents to make sure the children are doing their homework and get the help they need if they have not understood things they should have.
What do parents do?
Complain about the teachers because they're Mr. & Ms. Dunning-Kruger who would fail utterly if they'd try to do their kids homework, if they could get their eyes long enough off the next screen, but live in a delusion bubble of them being the best, smartest etc...
That is the issue.

Good god... do you ever even bother to listen to what you are saying?

Its the parents fault they aren't learning because they don't check their homework???

You are correct about one thing though - there are most definitely some people that have no business having kids.

a reply to: tanstaafl

If your kid doesn't learn the issue is you don't practice enough with it.
I don't know what'd be so outrageous about that statement?
That is an universal truth.
Practice makes you better, which is what homework is.

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: tanstaafl

If your kid doesn't learn the issue is you don't practice enough with it.
I don't know what'd be so outrageous about that statement?

If you are paying exorbitant amounts of money to someone else to do the teaching, it is outrageous to put the blame for them not even bneiong able to do basic skills on the parents.

That said, in a way I actually do sort of agree with you, but only inso far as, if your kids aren't learning in the school, take them out and put them somewhere that actually does teach, in accordance with your own set of life principles.

That is an universal truth.

Yes - and the kids failure rate is first and foremost on the teachers in those schools, and secondarily on the parents for not being willing (or able in many/most cases) to take them out and put them somewhere that actually has real teachers who will teach.

Practice makes you better, which is what homework is.

Again you claim it is the fault of parents - or is it the schools that send the kids home with homework, the kids do it all wrong, then the school passes them anyway?

Let me ask you a question...

Why are you completely and totally ignoring the failure of the teachers and the schools, and laying all of the blame on the parents?

a reply to: tanstaafl

Dude if you have children you are responsible for their successful development. How you do that is up to you. But it is not, was never and will never be the gov or the teacher who takes that burden off you, no matter how much you want to blame them.
You had to have children but don't want to put the time and effort in to give them a great start and options for later: that is not the teachers' or the gov's fault.

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: tanstaafl

Dude if you have children you are responsible for their successful development.

I agree - but you are totally ignoring the fact the individuals have limited resources, and we are already taxed to death for the public fool system.

Now, anywhere that has reasonable School Choice laws that allow people to vote for the schools of their choice with their own tax dollars, your argument has 100% absolute merit.

But not in all of those (the vast majority) areas that have no School Choice. No, in our area, we are taxed heavily to pay for the public fool system (among other things), and according to you, on top of that we should have to try to find a way to either essentially Homeschool our kids, or pay an exorbitant amount of money for an alternative/private school?

How you do that is up to you. But it is not, was never and will never be the gov or the teacher who takes that burden off you, no matter how much you want to blame them.

Again, if that system was voluntary, you'd have an argument, but it isn't so you don't.

You had to have children but don't want to put the time and effort in to give them a great start and options for later: that is not the teachers' or the gov's fault.

See above repeated response to your repeatedly and demonstrably false proclamations.

So, are you going to just ignore and continue to refuse to answer my question?

Why are you completely and totally ignoring the failure of the teachers and the schools, and laying all of the blame on the parents?

originally posted by: tanstaafl

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: tanstaafl

If your kid doesn't learn the issue is you don't practice enough with it.
I don't know what'd be so outrageous about that statement?

I actually do sort of agree with you, but only inso far as, if your kids aren't learning in the school, take them out and put them somewhere that actually does teach, in accordance with your own set of life principles.

That is an universal truth.

Yes - and the kids failure rate is first and foremost on the teachers in those schools, and secondarily on the parents for not being willing (or able in many/most cases) to take them out and put them somewhere that actually has real teachers who will teach.

Practice makes you better, which is what homework is.

Again you claim it is the fault of parents - or is it the schools that send the kids home with homework, the kids do it all wrong, then the school passes them anyway?

Why are you completely and totally ignoring the failure of the teachers and the schools, and laying all of the blame on the parents?

Good point since in 13 Baltimore schools 100% of the children failed to be able to do even the most basic math on standardized tests. Yet those school districts teach CRT and the kids know it well. They are well versed that if you are white you are born an oppressor and if you're black you are born oppressed and nothing can ever change that. They also teach LGBTQP+ and the how to's of sex, which Baltimore kids are proficient at apparently. The school system there is run by Democrats as is the city.

Baltimore city has a teen birth rate twice as high as the state of Maryland and three times as high as the national average.

health.baltimorecity.gov... ... www.wmar2news.com...

That is what happens when Democrats run a city and school district. Kids learn all the liberal dictated morals and values of the day/moment of the far left at the expense of learning to read, write, and do math.

California schools run by Democrats are failing at a rapid rate. www.city-journal.org... ... californiaglobe.com... as they incorporated teaching elementary students how to masturbate and Jr Hi students how to fist and other sexual activities dailycaller.com... They ask 5 year olds if they feel like they are the wrong gender and secretly transition them behind their parents back.nypost.com...

CA and many other Dem run school districts enact policies and teach leftist liberal ideas such as:

it is necessary to teach 5-12 year olds how to have sex and how to be LGBTQP+;

it is essential to be aware of another persons racial identity at all times;

it is essential to be aware of another persons gender identity at all times;

the US was born in evil;
the US is an unrepentant horrible racist, sexist, homophobic, transphobic nation;
one must be ashamed of being a US citizen,

Indoctrination of liberal dogma, credos, doctrines, and canons,
is far more important than teaching children
to read, write, and do even basic math.

The above ideas are quite clear in Democratic Party run states and cities
who aren't prioritizing teaching children to read, write or do math,
rather prioritizing social leftist indoctrination.
Every single Blue state has a failing school system:
thinkingoregon.org...
www.washingtonpolicy.org...
www.azcentral.com...
www.the74million.org...
www.nbcwashington.com...
www.wsj.com...
www.themainewire.com...
www.commonwealthfoundation.org...
vermontdailychronicle.com...
thepublicsradio.org...
www.ctpost.com...
patch.com...
www.delawareonline.com... 4095966002/
www.washingtonexaminer.com...
www.washingtonexaminer.com...
www.wunc.org...


I THINK IT IS CLEARLY THE GOVERNMENT RUN PUBLIC SCHOOLS WHO ARE NOT TO BE TRUSTED, ESPECIALLY IN BLUE STATES!

a reply to: tanstaafl

oh wow imagine you'd have to actually take an interest in your kids and spend time with them.
what an unreasonable imposition...

Can't trust parents but you can trust the government.
It's the mantra of the left around here. And it's MARXISM.
kill the family unit. Make the government the supreme leader.

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: tanstaafl

oh wow imagine you'd have to actually take an interest in your kids and spend time with them.

Oh wow, imagine you'd actually try to use your brain to consider someone's argument as opposed to just regurgitating your same old already debunked claims.

what an unreasonable imposition...

Oh - and fyi, we've been homeschooling our 3 kids ever since the private school we were sending them to (Montessori) ceased in-school classes and wanted to continue charging us full price for full remote classes. They did agree to a ridiculously low 10% discount when a number of parents expressed displeasure at such a ridiculous demand, so we removed them and have been teaching them at home.

The points I've been trying to make to you that you are unable to grasp is that some people cannot afford either homeschooling (both parents work) or private schools (can't afford it financially since they are already paying for your public fool system).