Could Some Fast Radio Bursts Be From Extraterrestrial Civilizations?

Just viewed an interesting video about the possibility that some fast radio bursts (FRB's) may not have a natural origin, particularly ones with a regular periodicity to them. One class of FRB's are known to be generated by magnetars, which are young neutron stars with extremely strong magnetic fields, but there are many observations of FRB's which don't appear to come from such sources, and don't otherwise have an explanation for them. FRB's have been found in ancient globular clusters where there should no longer be magnetars, as magnetars are only formed from short-lived giant stars collapsing into neutron stars, and that any such neutron stars that become magnetars lose their magnetic character in a matter of decades.

Some observed FRB's have a periodicity of 157 days, which would suggest a orbit around an earth-like sun in the habitable zone, somewhere between the orbits of Mercury and Venus, i.e. within the habitable zone. Such bursts of radio energy could be used to propel ships in a fashion similar to light sails, except use an electric field instead. To create such a field would require just about all the solar energy intercepted by an object twice the size of the earth at a point in the habitable zone, and would be enough to accelerate a two million ton ships up to 50% of the speed of light, and smaller ships to higher speeds. Once accelerated, a ship would have to slow down at the other end of its journey using a large electromagnetic parachute-like sail to capture the energy of outgoing charged particles from the destination star, or use a similar such beam as constructed at the origin system.

Avi Loeb and an associate have calculated that the size of a solar power station to generate enough energy for such radio beams would be twice the size of the earth. In one star system, HD139139, several objects of this size have been found that have non-constant orbit periods, suggesting they aren't planets.

These non-magnetar generated FRB's are seen throughout the universe in other galaxies and globular clusters as well as within our own galaxy. In fact there are over 10,000 sources of FRB's in the Milky Way not associated with a natural source, i.e. a magnetar. Could some fraction of these be part of a galactic network of such beams?

Avi Loeb has a paper on the subject,

An Audacious Explanation for Fast Radio Bursts

And here is a good video on it as well:



Of course these mysterious FRB's may just have some as yet undiscovered natural causes, but it is an interesting idea to consider.

a reply to: MrInquisitive

If you are thinking communication, radio is way too slow. Any meaningful conversation over even a few light minutes is not possible. All these transmissions are from as long in the past as the transmitter is away from the receiver. A thousand light-years away, it was sent a thousand years ago. Radio is limited to the speed of light. .

If you are thinking navigation beacons, why? There are enough natural beacons within the galaxies to track where you are.

Now if it is spam, you might have something. "Hay guys, we are here and would like to meet with you." The problem is if the visitors just decide to take over the place. I dout anyone would broadcast for this purpose. Unless they are dumb. How would they build such a transmitter if they are that dumb.

Are you saying the transmitters are being maintained for thousands of generations? That is what it would take to keep them working.

Anyone else think of any other use for a super radio transmitter that is not just a natural phenomena?

If you are thinking communication, radio is way too slow. Any meaningful conversation over even a few light minutes is not possible. All these transmissions are from as long in the past as the transmitter is away from the receiver. A thousand light-years away, it was sent a thousand years ago. Radio is limited to the speed of light. .

Mate you have to think beyond what it is you think you know , Living in the Box that we as Humans call the ' Laws of Physics ' leaves you spinning in place but Science is forever evolving .

a reply to: asabuvsobelow

If you want to think outside the box, then why radio? How about subetha waves? Gravity wave? Even on Star Trek the sup space radio worked through the engine field and not normal space.

Radio is so known physics and technology. Kind of yesterdays technology. The only advances are in speed of information and not speed of travel.

a reply to: beyondknowledge2

Maybe a "danger" beacon?

Obviously they could be, yes. Quite what their use would be I don’t know. I would think any sufficiently advanced civilisation capable of harnessing the power you would need for a fast radio burst, would have figured out a better way of communicating. Unless these are not communication attempts, but the signal of something more alarming, like the destroying of suns.

Far more likely to be a natural phenomenon really.

originally posted by: beyondknowledge2
a reply to: MrInquisitive

If you are thinking communication, radio is way too slow. Any meaningful conversation over even a few light minutes is not possible. All these transmissions are from as long in the past as the transmitter is away from the receiver. A thousand light-years away, it was sent a thousand years ago. Radio is limited to the speed of light. .

If you are thinking navigation beacons, why? There are enough natural beacons within the galaxies to track where you are.

Now if it is spam, you might have something. "Hay guys, we are here and would like to meet with you." The problem is if the visitors just decide to take over the place. I dout anyone would broadcast for this purpose. Unless they are dumb. How would they build such a transmitter if they are that dumb.

Are you saying the transmitters are being maintained for thousands of generations? That is what it would take to keep them working.

Anyone else think of any other use for a super radio transmitter that is not just a natural phenomena?

Perhaps I didn't make it clear enough, but this energy source could be used as a form of spaceship propulsion, to accelerate large spacecraft up to 0.5c, and smaller spacecraft even faster. Think of using the analogy to a solar sail that uses electromagnetic force. Was not suggesting it is used for interstellar communication. Did you look at the article or video I linked to?

a reply to: MrInquisitive

Yes I'm fairly sure that there have been FRB's and Gamma bursts that may be the excess energy required for stellar and interstellar travel. However, what would be the clincher in that regard would be one whose source moves measurably in location. A static burst from a single location suggests a mundane, but fairly high energy, origin.

a reply to: beyondknowledge2

Yes I looked at them. I find an energy burst as a source of power rather rediculas. So you can utilize a solar sail with a burst of energy? It would not be able to utilize the energy in a useful way as it would not be constant.you would have trouble not loosing the sail as the bursts would be quite violent to be affective. I think the original Orion drive would be more like what would produce the bursts. The fact the sources don't move rules that out though.

As far as the suggested danger, lighthouse beacon, why such long range. Any radio beacon would reach a few lightyears.
You would be going so fast you could not react or you will be warned of something you might encounter within a lifetime or so. It would not be useful to bother with the range produced.

Why would anyone want to destroy a star? The bursts of energy would not make a dent in the energy produced by a star. It might shorten it's life by a few days within it's life of millions of years.

More likely just natural background noise.

originally posted by: beyondknowledge2
a reply to: beyondknowledge2

Yes I looked at them. I find an energy burst as a source of power rather rediculas. So you can utilize a solar sail with a burst of energy? It would not be able to utilize the energy in a useful way as it would not be constant.you would have trouble not loosing the sail as the bursts would be quite violent to be affective. I think the original Orion drive would be more like what would produce the bursts. The fact the sources don't move rules that out though.

As far as the suggested danger, lighthouse beacon, why such long range. Any radio beacon would reach a few lightyears.
You would be going so fast you could not react or you will be warned of something you might encounter within a lifetime or so. It would not be useful to bother with the range produced.

Why would anyone want to destroy a star? The bursts of energy would not make a dent in the energy produced by a star. It might shorten it's life by a few days within it's life of millions of years.

More likely just natural background noise.

Just to be clear, it wouldn't be a solar sail per se, but analogous to one, which would use the electromagnetic force of the pulse instead of photons or other charged particles.

You have a very good point, though, regarding the length of these pulses, as they would need to be fairly continuous to provide the acceleration suggested as I understand it, unless the energy is somehow captured by the spacecraft and then converted into some other sort of propulsive source. I also don't understand how periodic sources that repeat, say every 157 days, would work to provide the propulsive force necessary.

As I understand it,Orion drive propulsion would be based on many hundreds of 5 kt explosions. Don't see how they would generate anywhere near the energy of a FRB.

I wasn't suggesting that manufactured FRB's would be used to destroy a star, although they could cause some big damage to a planet in a nearby star system. Perhaps there are Death Stars blasting planets in interstellar wars all over the place...

And you are absolutely correct that these currently unexplained FRBs may be from one or more types of natural origins, which have yet to be discovered, which is what I stated at the end of the OP.