Crisis - Norway Funeral Homes Overwhelmed With The Dead

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

So no, I wouldn't give it to males on this group. And definitely I wouldn't vaccinate children.
In addition I would vaccinate ANYONE below the age of 50 with these potentially hazardous products.

I'm not sure what 84% represents here. I'm always warry of percentages with nothing to show what they mean. We could say there is 100% increase because it was 1 and now 2, as example.

It did say this in the study..

Risk for both all-cause and
cardiac-related deaths was substantially higher 28 days following COVID-19 infection. The risk associated
with mRNA vaccination should be weighed against the risk associated with COVID-19 infection.

So I guess pick your poison.

You can read the link I have posted again. It's directly from the Department of Health in Florida.

The main point is that in Florida now the mRNA vaccines are not recommended for the 18-39 age group of males. Which is another blow to the 'safe and effective' narrative presented about these vaccines.

But wasn't that political, because of Gov. De Santis and his Surgeon General, Dr. Joseph Ladapo? (and also has been rolled back since then)?

And it was all supposed to be about the risk of myocarditis, which is about 106 in a million (0.0106%):

Myocarditis Cases Reported After mRNA-Based COVID-19 Vaccination in the US From December 2020 to August 2021 - JAMA

Seems excessive when the mortality rate from COVID (the disease) for children is ten times that.

Couple this with the other pieces of research and the results which show that young boys 12-17 are at more risk from vaccine-induced myocarditis rather than getting hospitalised with Covid.

Have in mind the JCVI committee in the UK that didn't recommend vaccinations for the 5-11 age group and you have created a clear picture where in
a large part of the population the risks outweigh the benefits of vaccination

A large part of the JVCI decision was due to the availability of the vaccines and a concern to vaccinate the older and most at-risk part of the population, before vaccinating children and other low risk groups.

So not to go around in circles. Those under the age of 50 with no comorbidities are in no need of these products. I think this is clear. Especially if they have had Covid already.

If they have had COVID already, they don't need to have the vaccine for some months afterward.

But also, as long as there is a population of newly infected people, the disease will be endemic. To wipe out the disease, it requires that there is a very high coverage of those with a strong immune response to the pathogen.

originally posted by: Asmodeus3
a reply to: chr0naut

The infection fatality rate of Covid-19 has been estimated long time ago before the vaccines were rolled out to be around 0.15%.

And how many people are infected with SARS-CoV-2 at any one time? Medical cases and mortalities we can observe and count directly, but how many are infected?

This makes the IFR for the most part based upon an estimated number. I much prefer my data to be actuals and measurables.

Using case fatality rates is both misleading and not the best representation of how a disease performs. It's not a good number in a few words.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

Conclusions: All systematic evaluations of seroprevalence data converge that SARS-CoV-2 infection is widely spread globally. Acknowledging residual uncertainties, the available evidence suggests average global IFR of ~0.15% and ~1.5-2.0 billion infections by February 2021 with substantial differences in IFR and in infection spread across continents, countries and locations

Seroprevalence refers to testing for a pathogen or antibodies in donated blood supplies. It is not even used for measurement or detection of COVID-19 in known symptomatic cases. As it is inadequate as a test for COVID-19 in individual clinical cases, it's inadequacies are multiplied when collecting statistical data for what is primarily a respiratory disease.

I note that you haven't used a single link for some of the numbers you used.

That is because I have previously linked to sources for those numbers, in previous posts in this thread.

The ideas that lockdowns and vaccines will stop the virus and we will somehow achieve herd immunity are debunked long time ago. There is no herd immunity to SARS-CoV-2 as the vaccines cannot prevent or significantly reduce transmission and infection. Everybody will get infected.

In New Zealand, two separate outbreaks of COVID-19 were eliminated entirely, and this was prior to the vaccines. So it isn't impossible, because it happened - twice.

And for almost all previous pandemics, which now no longer threaten lives but the pathogen lives on, herd immunity has overtaken the pathogens. There are at a minimum several hundred examples of diseases which were once deadly and in epidemic numbers, which have been defeated by herd immunity.

By February 2021 around 1.5 to 2 BILLION people were estimated to be infected (see link above). By now almost everyone has been infected. The vaccines did very little or nothing to prevent transmission and infection.

You used that word "estimated". That's not very scientifically rigourous, is it?



And there are still some people I know who have not had COVID-19. My son is one of them. It has been calculated using the known rate of infections, that if the disease were allowed to go unchecked, that the world would have been infected by 2025. Since the infection rate has been reduced by various mitigations, and with more infectious strains likely in the future, I would guess that no-one has enough data to second guess when everyone will have had the disease.

Additionally, there are those that have had more than one bout of COVID, so that would indicate that even 'naturally acquired' immunity is far from total. Alongside of those that have had multiple bouts of COVID, there are those who have had none. So, this is where actual measured cases are superior measurement rather that any estimation based upon simplified and reductionist ideas

Here is my thread on the subject

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Someone else is still claiming that herd immunity can be achieved and that in his country it was achieved by the end of 2021.

It's just a fantasy.

No, it may have once been possible, but some idiots kept telling everyone to do nothing, for some reason. I don't know why. They can't be getting anything out of it.

Those who haven't been exposed to the virus need to get exposed. This is how populations get either herd immunity (when it is possible) or very good protection i.e cellular immunity through natural infection or vaccination. These vaccines are crippled so natural immunity is the only possible way for the vast majority of us who are still here and have survived primary infection.

But what of the deaths and hospitalizations that will occur when people get exposed to the virus?

Imagine if people could get an immune response without actually getting sick! I wonder how you might do that?

It's funny how covid skipped 2020 for increasing all cause mortality and then just as it's dissipating with a much weaker variant it magically increases all cause mortality by 20-30% but only in highly vaxxt countries.

Seems legit.

originally posted by: v1rtu0s0
It's funny how covid skipped 2020 for increasing all cause mortality and then just as it's dissipating with a much weaker variant it magically increases all cause mortality by 20-30% but only in highly vaxxt countries.

Seems legit.

Boink!

Excess mortality: Deaths from all causes compared to average over previous years - Our World in Data

Keep it up!

a reply to: chr0naut

Please stop trying to use logic and common sense.....it's a losing battle

originally posted by: PhyllidaDavenport
a reply to: chr0naut

Please stop trying to use logic and common sense.....it's a losing battle

Even though I am a skeptic, I'm an optimistic kind of guy. I live in hope.

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: v1rtu0s0
It's funny how covid skipped 2020 for increasing all cause mortality and then just as it's dissipating with a much weaker variant it magically increases all cause mortality by 20-30% but only in highly vaxxt countries.

Seems legit.

Boink!

Excess mortality: Deaths from all causes compared to average over previous years - Our World in Data

Keep it up!

Not sure how the bill gates funded our world in data site validates its data but I'm guessing great reset proponents like gates would want to hide depopulation inconvenient truths.

Q3 2021 for example shows a 150-200% increase for 25-64.

rumble.com...


Anyway, how are you enjoying the natural immunity data?

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

You can read the link I have posted again. It's directly from the Department of Health in Florida.

I did read their links and I don't understand their method to get to 84%.

The main point is that in Florida now the mRNA vaccines are not recommended for the 18-39 age group of males. Which is another blow to the 'safe and effective' narrative presented about these vaccines.

Ok... so what? we talked numbers already. If Fl wants to do that then go at it. If we say the vaccines are not in the "safe and effective" range, then no drug is as I posted already common drugs with much higher risks. As I have said like 100 times now, no one should take ANY drugs if the illness is low risk already. Fl deems the virus as extreme low risk for that age group, so why risk anything if not needed in the first place. You keep jumping on all this and I just do not get your point.

Couple this with the other pieces of research and the results which show that young boys 12-17 are at more risk from vaccine-induced myocarditis rather than getting hospitalised with Covid.

Are you sure? I posted the numbers and myocarditis is like 1 to 2 per 100k, death from the virus for that age group is 3 per 100k. hospitalization would be higher still, and the vast majority of the myocarditis cases is mild and quickly treatable.

The reality here is all of it is extremely small, even though the virus is slightly worst.

So not to go around in circles. Those under the age of 50 with no comorbidities are in no need of these products. I think this is clear. Especially if they have had Covid already.

So the problem with all this is you will not define what you would say is reasonably acceptable of xx per 100,000 for either the virus or vasccine.

You suggest the vaccine is super dangerous with a 2 per 100k illness but blow off something like 50 to 200 per 100k with virus deaths in different age groups as part of your 18 to 50.

So, what is the per 100k that you see as no longer low risk, and does that apply for both vaccine and virus?

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

You can read the link I have posted again. It's directly from the Department of Health in Florida.

I did read their links and I don't understand their method to get to 84%.

The main point is that in Florida now the mRNA vaccines are not recommended for the 18-39 age group of males. Which is another blow to the 'safe and effective' narrative presented about these vaccines.

Ok... so what? we talked numbers already. If Fl wants to do that then go at it. If we say the vaccines are not in the "safe and effective" range, then no drug is as I posted already common drugs with much higher risks. As I have said like 100 times now, no one should take ANY drugs if the illness is low risk already. Fl deems the virus as extreme low risk for that age group, so why risk anything if not needed in the first place. You keep jumping on all this and I just do not get your point.

Couple this with the other pieces of research and the results which show that young boys 12-17 are at more risk from vaccine-induced myocarditis rather than getting hospitalised with Covid.

Are you sure? I posted the numbers and myocarditis is like 1 to 2 per 100k, death from the virus for that age group is 3 per 100k. hospitalization would be higher still, and the vast majority of the myocarditis cases is mild and quickly treatable.

The reality here is all of it is extremely small, even though the virus is slightly worst.

I'm gonna go with the worlds most published cardiologist on this one.

Covid mRNA vaccines does not produce mucosal compartment immunity in the respiratory tract .

From dr. Cambell video...



Time to pause covid mass vaccination

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: JohnMFINGWayne

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: jerryznv

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: M5xaz
a reply to: v1rtu0s0

This is so grave and huge that it is a 100% certainty that populations will eventually realize they have been lied to.
Can't hide mass genocide for long

Blowback will be massive

Globalists will hang from every lampost...

No, those who, in the light of all the deaths from this disease, continue to suggest that the disease itself is benign, advise people to avoid the vaccines (several different ones), advise others to not wear masks (and to ridicule the mere concept of doing so), to advise against social distancing, or any move that has been tried to reduce the spread of the pandemic. Those people probably should be held liable for the outcomes we are seeing.

But hanging people from lamp posts is purely evil and criminal, and is an indicator of the immorality and innate evil of these types of people.

I am dumber for having read your comment...but not quite as bad as you posting it!

Are you really that brainwashed? Propaganda worked well on you!!!

How about the person who funded the development of this virus? You're following their marching orders to the letter!!!

Who funded the development of all the other viruses that went epidemic or pandemic before SARS-CoV-2?

And where is the evidence of the genetic engineering required? The failed samples, the papers on components of the final virus, the banks of incubator machines with human cell cultures, and the sequencing machines to find out which ones were successful?

The only important numbers people need to see is the profit in 2021 the big hitters made while everyone else fell further into debt.
"Pfizer Made $36.8 Billion from Covid-19 Vaccine in 2021"
"Moderna earned $12.2 billion in profit in 2021"
"Johnson & Johnson annual revenue for 2021 was $93.775B, a 13.55% increase from 2020"

It says it all right there... and you know those billions of dollars didn't just appear out of thin air. Nor all those fresh cadavers in the morgue.

You'd sort of expect companies that make vaccines against a pandemic disease to make some kind of profit.

"you'd" who? Anyone that got the vaccine I've talked to actually expect companies giving out millions of free vaccines to lose money. They were under the impression that pharmaceutical companies are doing everyone a HUGE humanitarian favor for the good of the people and not themselves.

It was always a big surprise explaining, the billions of dollars in profit, to anyone who pays attention to Fox or CNN because the mainstream media outlets were actually preaching strongly how much the economical impact is disastrous and how everyone is losing money. And there is nothing to gain on anyone's behalf... everyone is in damage control mode.

Instead, we find out our pharmaceutical companies are actually in cahoots with the CCP, with facilities in China with big pharma CEOs selling shares TO THE CCP (in the U.S. this would be called "insider trading"). Doesn't seem like a big deal at first, but taking into consideration China is communist, any facility in China is under complete control by their government. Not to mention... after putting the virus under a microscope, it was discovered to actually be 100% synthetic.

The only people expecting these sort of wild ordeals, that casual public do not even pay attention to, are "conspiracy theorists". o_O

originally posted by: v1rtu0s0

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: v1rtu0s0
It's funny how covid skipped 2020 for increasing all cause mortality and then just as it's dissipating with a much weaker variant it magically increases all cause mortality by 20-30% but only in highly vaxxt countries.

Seems legit.

Boink!

Excess mortality: Deaths from all causes compared to average over previous years - Our World in Data

Keep it up!

Not sure how the bill gates funded our world in data site validates its data but I'm guessing great reset proponents like gates would want to hide depopulation inconvenient truths.

How We’re Funded - OurWorldInData

Q3 2021 for example shows a 150-200% increase for 25-64.

rumble.com...

What about the possibility that all these tens of thousands of government employees, doctors, academics, educators, and so forth, aren't lying, but instead, it's these three blokes in the video?

Anyway, how are you enjoying the natural immunity data?

It is clear that since lots of diseases exist and persist, that 'natural immunity' isn't a magic shield, and is 'leaky'.

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

So no, I wouldn't give it to males on this group. And definitely I wouldn't vaccinate children.
In addition I would vaccinate ANYONE below the age of 50 with these potentially hazardous products.

I'm not sure what 84% represents here. I'm always warry of percentages with nothing to show what they mean. We could say there is 100% increase because it was 1 and now 2, as example.

It did say this in the study..

Risk for both all-cause and
cardiac-related deaths was substantially higher 28 days following COVID-19 infection. The risk associated
with mRNA vaccination should be weighed against the risk associated with COVID-19 infection.

So I guess pick your poison.

You can read the link I have posted again. It's directly from the Department of Health in Florida.

The main point is that in Florida now the mRNA vaccines are not recommended for the 18-39 age group of males. Which is another blow to the 'safe and effective' narrative presented about these vaccines.

But wasn't that political, because of Gov. De Santis and his Surgeon General, Dr. Joseph Ladapo? (and also has been rolled back since then)?

And it was all supposed to be about the risk of myocarditis, which is about 106 in a million (0.0106%):

Myocarditis Cases Reported After mRNA-Based COVID-19 Vaccination in the US From December 2020 to August 2021 - JAMA

Seems excessive when the mortality rate from COVID (the disease) for children is ten times that.

Couple this with the other pieces of research and the results which show that young boys 12-17 are at more risk from vaccine-induced myocarditis rather than getting hospitalised with Covid.

Have in mind the JCVI committee in the UK that didn't recommend vaccinations for the 5-11 age group and you have created a clear picture where in
a large part of the population the risks outweigh the benefits of vaccination

A large part of the JVCI decision was due to the availability of the vaccines and a concern to vaccinate the older and most at-risk part of the population, before vaccinating children and other low risk groups.

So not to go around in circles. Those under the age of 50 with no comorbidities are in no need of these products. I think this is clear. Especially if they have had Covid already.

If they have had COVID already, they don't need to have the vaccine for some months afterward.

But also, as long as there is a population of newly infected people, the disease will be endemic. To wipe out the disease, it requires that there is a very high coverage of those with a strong immune response to the pathogen.

No it wasn't political at all. The data provided by the Department of Health in Florida shows clearly why mRNA vaccines are no longer recommended for 18-39 males.

Likewise the data for boys 12-17

The risks of vaccinations outweigh the benefits. That's why.

The JCVI in England knew that the risks of vaccination for the 5-11 year old kids could also outweigh any benefits.


Given there are several adverse reactions these vaccines could cause and they have caused as well as death then it's wise for the young and healthy avoid experimental, untested and potentially hazardous products.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

You can read the link I have posted again. It's directly from the Department of Health in Florida.

I did read their links and I don't understand their method to get to 84%.

The main point is that in Florida now the mRNA vaccines are not recommended for the 18-39 age group of males. Which is another blow to the 'safe and effective' narrative presented about these vaccines.

Ok... so what? we talked numbers already. If Fl wants to do that then go at it. If we say the vaccines are not in the "safe and effective" range, then no drug is as I posted already common drugs with much higher risks. As I have said like 100 times now, no one should take ANY drugs if the illness is low risk already. Fl deems the virus as extreme low risk for that age group, so why risk anything if not needed in the first place. You keep jumping on all this and I just do not get your point.

Couple this with the other pieces of research and the results which show that young boys 12-17 are at more risk from vaccine-induced myocarditis rather than getting hospitalised with Covid.

Are you sure? I posted the numbers and myocarditis is like 1 to 2 per 100k, death from the virus for that age group is 3 per 100k. hospitalization would be higher still, and the vast majority of the myocarditis cases is mild and quickly treatable.

The reality here is all of it is extremely small, even though the virus is slightly worst.

So not to go around in circles. Those under the age of 50 with no comorbidities are in no need of these products. I think this is clear. Especially if they have had Covid already.

So the problem with all this is you will not define what you would say is reasonably acceptable of xx per 100,000 for either the virus or vasccine.

You suggest the vaccine is super dangerous with a 2 per 100k illness but blow off something like 50 to 200 per 100k with virus deaths in different age groups as part of your 18 to 50.

So, what is the per 100k that you see as no longer low risk, and does that apply for both vaccine and virus?

Don't worry if you can't understand their method. The important message is that The data provided by the Department of Health in Florida shows clearly why mRNA vaccines are no longer recommended for 18-39 males.

Likewise the data for boys 12-17 as I have shown earlier and according to the data.

The risks may well outweigh any benefits from the vaccination.


I can't trivialise deaths or say how many deaths are acceptable. The vaccines are not as safe and effective as they have been advertised and one of them (Astrazeneca) has begun withdrawn from the market after causing 'rare' very serious adverse reactions and deaths.

So it's about time that the mRNA vaccines are also withdrawn from the market. There are several calls for this given that they could cause a variety of issues and that often the risks of vaccination outweigh the benefits. Still the medium and long term effects are not known. The products should have never been released in the market. Medical negligence at the very least.

originally posted by: JohnMFINGWayne

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: JohnMFINGWayne

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: jerryznv

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: M5xaz
a reply to: v1rtu0s0

This is so grave and huge that it is a 100% certainty that populations will eventually realize they have been lied to.
Can't hide mass genocide for long

Blowback will be massive

Globalists will hang from every lampost...

No, those who, in the light of all the deaths from this disease, continue to suggest that the disease itself is benign, advise people to avoid the vaccines (several different ones), advise others to not wear masks (and to ridicule the mere concept of doing so), to advise against social distancing, or any move that has been tried to reduce the spread of the pandemic. Those people probably should be held liable for the outcomes we are seeing.

But hanging people from lamp posts is purely evil and criminal, and is an indicator of the immorality and innate evil of these types of people.

I am dumber for having read your comment...but not quite as bad as you posting it!

Are you really that brainwashed? Propaganda worked well on you!!!

How about the person who funded the development of this virus? You're following their marching orders to the letter!!!

Who funded the development of all the other viruses that went epidemic or pandemic before SARS-CoV-2?

And where is the evidence of the genetic engineering required? The failed samples, the papers on components of the final virus, the banks of incubator machines with human cell cultures, and the sequencing machines to find out which ones were successful?

The only important numbers people need to see is the profit in 2021 the big hitters made while everyone else fell further into debt.
"Pfizer Made $36.8 Billion from Covid-19 Vaccine in 2021"
"Moderna earned $12.2 billion in profit in 2021"
"Johnson & Johnson annual revenue for 2021 was $93.775B, a 13.55% increase from 2020"

It says it all right there... and you know those billions of dollars didn't just appear out of thin air. Nor all those fresh cadavers in the morgue.

You'd sort of expect companies that make vaccines against a pandemic disease to make some kind of profit.

"you'd" who? Anyone that got the vaccine I've talked to actually expect companies giving out millions of free vaccines to lose money. They were under the impression that pharmaceutical companies are doing everyone a HUGE humanitarian favor for the good of the people and not themselves.

It was always a big surprise explaining, the billions of dollars in profit, to anyone who pays attention to Fox or CNN because the mainstream media outlets were actually preaching strongly how much the economical impact is disastrous and how everyone is losing money. And there is nothing to gain on anyone's behalf... everyone is in damage control mode.

Instead, we find out our pharmaceutical companies are actually in cahoots with the CCP, with facilities in China with big pharma CEOs selling shares TO THE CCP (in the U.S. this would be called "insider trading"). Doesn't seem like a big deal at first, but taking into consideration China is communist, any facility in China is under complete control by their government. Not to mention... after putting the virus under a microscope, it was discovered to actually be 100% synthetic.

The only people expecting these sort of wild ordeals, that casual public do not even pay attention to, are "conspiracy theorists". o_O

It's the government, it's Bill Gates, it's the WEF, it's the WHO, it's the AMA, it's the Democrats, it's the RINO's, it's the entire nation of China, it's the Anunaki lizard people, it's pizza parlour owners, it's the universities, it's the music and movie stars, it's Klaus Schwab, it's the Rothschilds, it's the Illuminati, it's the Club of Rome, it's the Bilderburg group, it's the Freemasons, the Rosicruscians, the mega-churches, atheists, demons, the religious, indigo children, ghosts, the zombies, the greys, they're comin' thru the walls!, aggh gnnerg ftwer bllbbb...

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: Asmodeus3
a reply to: chr0naut

The infection fatality rate of Covid-19 has been estimated long time ago before the vaccines were rolled out to be around 0.15%.

And how many people are infected with SARS-CoV-2 at any one time? Medical cases and mortalities we can observe and count directly, but how many are infected?

This makes the IFR for the most part based upon an estimated number. I much prefer my data to be actuals and measurables.

Using case fatality rates is both misleading and not the best representation of how a disease performs. It's not a good number in a few words.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

Conclusions: All systematic evaluations of seroprevalence data converge that SARS-CoV-2 infection is widely spread globally. Acknowledging residual uncertainties, the available evidence suggests average global IFR of ~0.15% and ~1.5-2.0 billion infections by February 2021 with substantial differences in IFR and in infection spread across continents, countries and locations

Seroprevalence refers to testing for a pathogen or antibodies in donated blood supplies. It is not even used for measurement or detection of COVID-19 in known symptomatic cases. As it is inadequate as a test for COVID-19 in individual clinical cases, it's inadequacies are multiplied when collecting statistical data for what is primarily a respiratory disease.

I note that you haven't used a single link for some of the numbers you used.

That is because I have previously linked to sources for those numbers, in previous posts in this thread.

The ideas that lockdowns and vaccines will stop the virus and we will somehow achieve herd immunity are debunked long time ago. There is no herd immunity to SARS-CoV-2 as the vaccines cannot prevent or significantly reduce transmission and infection. Everybody will get infected.

In New Zealand, two separate outbreaks of COVID-19 were eliminated entirely, and this was prior to the vaccines. So it isn't impossible, because it happened - twice.

And for almost all previous pandemics, which now no longer threaten lives but the pathogen lives on, herd immunity has overtaken the pathogens. There are at a minimum several hundred examples of diseases which were once deadly and in epidemic numbers, which have been defeated by herd immunity.

By February 2021 around 1.5 to 2 BILLION people were estimated to be infected (see link above). By now almost everyone has been infected. The vaccines did very little or nothing to prevent transmission and infection.

You used that word "estimated". That's not very scientifically rigourous, is it?

And there are still some people I know who have not had COVID-19. My son is one of them. It has been calculated using the known rate of infections, that if the disease were allowed to go unchecked, that the world would have been infected by 2025. Since the infection rate has been reduced by various mitigations, and with more infectious strains likely in the future, I would guess that no-one has enough data to second guess when everyone will have had the disease.

Additionally, there are those that have had more than one bout of COVID, so that would indicate that even 'naturally acquired' immunity is far from total. Alongside of those that have had multiple bouts of COVID, there are those who have had none. So, this is where actual measured cases are superior measurement rather that any estimation based upon simplified and reductionist ideas

Here is my thread on the subject

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Someone else is still claiming that herd immunity can be achieved and that in his country it was achieved by the end of 2021.

It's just a fantasy.

No, it may have once been possible, but some idiots kept telling everyone to do nothing, for some reason. I don't know why. They can't be getting anything out of it.

Those who haven't been exposed to the virus need to get exposed. This is how populations get either herd immunity (when it is possible) or very good protection i.e cellular immunity through natural infection or vaccination. These vaccines are crippled so natural immunity is the only possible way for the vast majority of us who are still here and have survived primary infection.

But what of the deaths and hospitalizations that will occur when people get exposed to the virus?

Imagine if people could get an immune response without actually getting sick! I wonder how you might do that?

And yes medicine is not an exact science and so does epidemiology. Most of epidemiology is based on estimates with the use of plenty of statistics and modelling. That's why the IFR is more difficult to establish and contrary to what you have argued this is the most important number.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

IFR = 0.15%

Your other references to seroprevalence data show just lack of understanding of basic knowledge. Likewise when claims were made about herd immunity and how it is achieved when in reality herd immunity is impossible in the case of SARS-CoV-2

Similarly your claim that vaccine induced immunity gives you a better response is not true as natural immunity is superior and has been proven in the largest studies around i.e Israel, New York and California.

www.science.org...

Having SARS-CoV-2 once confers much greater immunity than a vaccine

The natural immune protection that develops after a SARS-CoV-2 infection offers considerably more of a shield against the Delta variant of the pandemic coronavirus than two doses of the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine, according to a large Israeli study.

The study demonstrates the power of the human immune system, the research impresses Nussenzweig and other scientists who have reviewed a preprint of the results, posted yesterday on medRxiv. It’s a textbook example of how natural immunity is really better than vaccination, says Charlotte Thålin, a physician and immunology researcher at Danderyd Hospital and the Karolinska Institute who studies the immune responses to SARS-CoV-2. To my knowledge, it’s the first time [this] has really been shown in the context of COVID

You are also mistaken as to how many people have been infected. By February 2021 there were about 1.5 to 2 BILLION infections. Almost two years after most people have been infected. From the link above.

Conclusions: All systematic evaluations of seroprevalence data converge that SARS-CoV-2 infection is widely spread globally. Acknowledging residual uncertainties, the available evidence suggests average global IFR of ~0.15% and ~1.5-2.0 billion infections by February 2021 with substantial differences in IFR and in infection spread across continents, countries and locations

a reply to: chr0naut


beckernews.com...

New scientific research shows that the vaccinated are more than twice as likely to be infected with Covid-19 than those who had a prior infection.

This research shows that Covid-19 vaccines are associated with more spread of the virus reveals that the Big Lie that vaccines “stop the spread” was even worse than at first glance. Public health officials’ arguments that “vaccine passports” would help protect communities from the spread of the virus turns out to be entirely fraudulent. The emotional appeal that Covid vaccines somehow protect your family members is now shown to be entirely without merit. The brazen claim that Covid-19 was a “pandemic of the unvaccinated” turns out to be completely bogus.

Not only natural immunity gives much better protection in comparison to vaccination in general terms but it seems that the vaccines can't even reach anywhere near the levels of protection natural infection provides.

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: v1rtu0s0

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: v1rtu0s0
It's funny how covid skipped 2020 for increasing all cause mortality and then just as it's dissipating with a much weaker variant it magically increases all cause mortality by 20-30% but only in highly vaxxt countries.

Seems legit.

Boink!

Excess mortality: Deaths from all causes compared to average over previous years - Our World in Data

Keep it up!

Not sure how the bill gates funded our world in data site validates its data but I'm guessing great reset proponents like gates would want to hide depopulation inconvenient truths.

How We’re Funded - OurWorldInData

Q3 2021 for example shows a 150-200% increase for 25-64.

rumble.com...

What about the possibility that all these tens of thousands of government employees, doctors, academics, educators, and so forth, aren't lying, but instead, it's these three blokes in the video?

Anyway, how are you enjoying the natural immunity data?

It is clear that since lots of diseases exist and persist, that 'natural immunity' isn't a magic shield, and is 'leaky'.

They arent all "lying" but most are caught in mass formation and are going along with the establishment. Its hard to deprogram the billions of dollars of propaganda thats been force fed into them. Some are lying to keep their jobs, or in their view ignoring it. Anyone who gets red pilled isn't going back either. Strange how there is no anti covid vaxx person who wishes they got it and the trend is only for people to awaken to the truth. There is only one direction that people go.

The motive or losing your job and putting your family at risk versus keeping your job while potentially making kickbacks from promoting or administering clot shots while keeping yourself hypnotized. I can see the easier choice here.

originally posted by: v1rtu0s0

I'm gonna go with the worlds most published cardiologist on this one.

Most published... You pulled that off his personal page... lol I guess that is how you set up your Appeal to Authority Fallacy.

I do agree younger healthy people do not need the vaccine since the variants out now are not much of anything to them, but here is your star player...

He falsely claimed that the COVID-19 pandemic was planned many years ago at a 2017 Johns Hopkins University symposium.
He falsely claimed that people who develop COVID-19 have “complete and durable immunity”, and that there is no benefit in vaccinating someone who recovered from COVID-19.
He falsely claimed that over 50,000 Americans died from the COVID-19 vaccine during his Texas Senate testimony in March 2021.
He falsely claimed that there is a “low degree, if any of asymptomatic spread” of COVID-19.
He promoted the use of hydroxychloroquine to treat COVID-19.
He falsely claimed that there was a global recall of the COVID-19 vaccines.
Just four months ago, Dr. Peter McCullough falsely testified to a Texas Senate Committee on Health & Human Services, that the COVID-19 vaccines were recalled after over 40,000 deaths were reported.

You and he are what we call the other side of extreme, so no wonder you to see eye to eye.