President Busch Iraq Medal to David Smith is a Satanic Symbol?

I find this thread insulting and distasteful as well. All these conspiracy theories are fun until you start really hurting people with such wild accusations.

Yes the pentiacal has been used by many, so one should note that a satanist could use it the same. But do want to note again there is nothing evil in the symbol, any good or evil will be in who uses it how.

Many different symbols have been used for many different things. That could be a whole nother thread

Playing devils advocate here...

I dont think PV is trying to say that the award is a sick and twisted thing,

he is under the delusion that it is a satanic symbol, and finds it to be a disgusting way to decorate a respected award.

so please everyone, try not to take anything over personal...

I dont think anyone would say it wasn't a great honor to recieve such a respectable medal...
or that anyone would say anyone who has one is anything but deserving of the honor it bestows...

so no one is calling anyones family members names here...

perhaps PV could clarify that "if" the symbol is satanic it would be a terrible symbol to associate with such a high honor...

You know, it sickens me when someone would liken the Medal of Honor to a symbol of satanism.

Generals and Presidents salute a Medal of Honor recipient because of the sacrifices that individual has made.

ATS has somehow moved from conpiracies to comedies.

Well, its because sometimes people aren't MISinformed when they say some symbols might have a negative meaning.

Isn't this possible? If there are 100 symbols in the world, wouldn't atleast some of them have a positive and negative meaning?

I can only think of one symbol that has been OUTRIGHT villified, and its not the upside down star, its the


The Pentagram, however, has LONG been acknowledged to symbolize the 5 elements, Fire, Water, Wind, Earth, and Spirit. The 5 points also symbolize a man, with the highest point (in the upright Pentagram) symbolizing Spirit.

But upside down, it represents, can you guess?
Man's perverse nature. For example, war.

Any one wants to know why its called satanic? Its just because it has a NEGATIVE CONNOTATION, and this is why it is associated with its ilk.

Search for Eliphas Levi to see that the upside down Pentagram is not by any means a new symbol for what I stated above.

I forget where the symbolism of this star was first discussed in ats,
[edit: ah , here it is www.abovetopsecret.com... ]
however I think that generally it was stated that the star is 'upside down' for non satanic reasons, and that the medal existed before the 'upside down star' was really even associated with satanism anyway.


edit to add: also the idea that 'they' planned to have this guy die when he just happened to be 33 and his son was also 11 just to emphasize that 'they' are in control to people willing to 'understand' the symbolism seems hard to swallow.

edit to add also: I don't see why it should sicken anyone about this. The star is in a bizzare and unexpected position to some, and any conspiracy is bound to offend anyone. No reason to let your stomach turn over it. This guy died a hero. He died saving his comrades. Its inevitable that some people are going to find something wrong in it.

[edit on 6-4-2005 by Nygdan]

[edit on 7-4-2005 by Nygdan]

I would only imagine that it would be satanic if it was made by a satanist.

close, it might be considered satanic if it was USED BY a satanist. Symbols
are neither positive or negative. Their meaning comes from how they are
used and how they are interpreted in their use. The inverted Pentegram
was for many years used in some forms of Wicca to denote the second degree
or second year of learning. most changed this when it became associated
with Anton LeVey's Satanic Church.

It was also the first symbol considered for the Olympic logo.

As someone mentioned it has many meanings, Venus both The Goddess and the planet which traces it in an 8 year cycle. It was also used by christianity
to symbolize the 5 wounds of christ.

Originally posted by stalkingwolf

I would only imagine that it would be satanic if it was made by a satanist.

close, it might be considered satanic if it was USED BY a satanist. Symbols
are neither positive or negative. Their meaning comes from how they are
used and how they are interpreted in their use. The inverted Pentegram
was for many years used in some forms of Wicca to denote the second degree
or second year of learning. most changed this when it became associated
with Anton LeVey's Satanic Church.

It was also the first symbol considered for the Olympic logo.

As someone mentioned it has many meanings, Venus both The Goddess and the planet which traces it in an 8 year cycle. It was also used by christianity
to symbolize the 5 wounds of christ.

Regardless, an upside-down star, on its own, is NOT satanic. In order to at least be associated with the popular media-inspired satanic symbol, it would have to be enclosed in a circle, with all points touching the perimiter of said circle.

Wondering why its upside down? Simple: if it was right side up, it would have to be suspended from a single point, making it extremely fragile, and all loose and dangly. The Two points at top provide balance and strength to the fastening.

When it comes to a Five pointed star, you can really only have one point up, or two points up, every other turn of it is just lop sided and unbalanced.

Also to clarify "Satanism" is pretty much a late 20th century creation of Anton LaVey.
Prior to him, "dark" occult practicioners used hundreds of other symbols, and the reverse pentagram was never, even in LaVey's church, considered a means of evil. To think that the inverse pentagram is evil denotes you have been brainwashed by modern media hype and misinformation.

That specific medal they are showing is the Army Medal of Honor from what I've read. The others are similar and all of them use the same basic layout and it's only the details that change and/or how they are set together.

Medal of Honor
Description: A gold five pointed star, each point tipped with trefoils, 1 ½ inches wide, surrounded by a green laurel wreath and suspended from a gold bar inscribed "VALOR", surmounted by an eagle. In the center of the star, Minerva’s head surrounded by the words "UNITED STATES OF AMERICA." On each ray of the star is a green oak leaf.
www.thevietnam-database.co.uk...

Here's a pretty good picture of the design.
external image

I know some of you might be wondering what the deal is with the owl right there in the center of it as well as the reason behind the picture of the woman. As the discription above said, it is the Head of Minerva and if that doesn't ring a bell just keep reading.



Mi·ner·va
n. Roman Mythology
The goddess of wisdom, invention, the arts, and martial prowess. She came to be identified with the Greek Athena. (So in other words Minerva is basically the War Goddess, among other things.)

The owl is a Horned Owl & A Nocturnal Bird of Prey.
Also Known As: "The Bird of Minerva" & "Bird of Night".
Remeber also that Minerva is not only a War Goddess but also Goddess of Wisdom like the Owl is traditionally linked to as well.

[edit on 7-4-2005 by Nygdan]

Also, to further clarify, SOME times when people cry out that a symbol is inappropriate, they know what they are talking about.

Satanism may be created by Anton Lavey, yet how can people be referring to ANY of his work if they have never heard of him? Don't give him so much credit, when people say Satanism, they do not (average people) mean the Church of Satan as started by Lavey.

They (in their hurried tones, because they sincerely want to warn people) are saying it is a symbol of those who in secret have NO REGARD for his fellow man, while giving every outer appearance of doing so!

Thus, the outer appearance of the hand sign (two fingers up, three down in any form) is a signal to "those in the know", as is awarding a medal for 'sacrifice' with two points up, and three down.

I will leave the mystery of 2 and 3 for y'all to ponder, the first two Prime Numbers, the Pythagoreans considered numbers to have identities of their own. Of course 1 was unique, it had a singular identity, self-explanatory.

But two was considered to have two qualities (as would everything in the world that 'descended' from 2), as it was 1+1, as well as 2x1. So it had the quality of One, as well as the 'new' Two, which represented duality, polarity, I'm sure everyone can imagine for themselves.

Three, well, it was holy! It had three qualities, or three distinct vibrations you could say, 1+2 (encompassing and incorporating all those before it) as well as being 3x1, or 3 in 1. Hell, you could go so far as to call One the Father, and Two the Mother...

Putting 2 above 3, well, that is emphasising the DUALITY aspect, instead of the TRINITY, which is the third force that is created when two opposites meet (an interesting concept).

Here is a non-fragile Pentagram that has a POSITIVE connotation.
(the fact that symbols have connotations does not denote I am brainwashed )

so if the owl can be on the MoH i guess it can be on the dollar too? or is that still a spider?

Originally posted by NuTroll
so if the owl can be on the MoH i guess it can be on the dollar too? or is that still a spider?

An Owl IMO.

Also IMO, the meaning for the owl on the bill is pretty much what you'd imagine it to be.

"Intelligent"
"Watchful"
"Patient"
"Night (Dark) Predator"
"Hidden in plain sight"

Plus, they both seem to have the same response when being accused of their actions. "Head spins around looking at everyone else and shouting "Who?....Who?" But we all know "Who", it's YOU muthaf*cka, YOU!!!....YOU!!!

Here is some interesting info about the pentagram:

link

[edit to remove large quote of mojom's post]

Now we are getting somewhere, it is the WAR in Iraq that got him the medal plus 13 stars wich ties to a secret society.

We have death news constantly in the media and the-like, we are in a war thats going to be constant none stop as terrorists will always exist everywhere.

I have nothing against the family getting the medal,
but do find it very strange with a satanic looking symbol and 13 stars.

[edit on 7-4-2005 by Nygdan]

The 13 stars on the blue ribbon can stand for anything tho, like the 13 colonies.You'd also need 13 to have that specific pattern no?

Also the upside down star has been fairly well shown to have been incorporated into this design long before it was a "satanic" symbol. I again suggest reviewing this thread. I think its very worthwhile that anyone reading this thread review that one, since its about this very subject (tho not about this recent receipiant).

President Busch

Your Freudian slip is showing...

Regardless of all the reasons, support, etc., it is kind of funny that it's basically an inverted 5 pointed star....

PhantomViewer,

What are you even thinking?!?! This thread is sad....

Also, President Bush spells his name BUSH not BUSCH, hes a man, not a beer, i think you've had too many...

Nothing wrong with the pentagram.

It's not satanic.

Originally posted by akilles
The Pentagram, however, has LONG been acknowledged to symbolize the 5 elements, Fire, Water, Wind, Earth, and Spirit. The 5 points also symbolize a man, with the highest point (in the upright Pentagram) symbolizing Spirit.

But upside down, it represents, can you guess?
Man's perverse nature. For example, war.

OK. You've pointed out the 5 elements(not really the correct word but what the heck), listed only one of the negetives.

Hardly conclusive theory here.

BTW, if you come up with another 4, I'll bet any amount that I can add to that number. It's the nature of man, so the 5 points are basically meaningless.