A Form of Slavery is on the Ballot for US Voters in Five States

Forgive me, ATS. I altered the headline a little bit. The headline is says that 'Slavery is on the Ballot...' Upon further reading I see that it means Slavery for the prison population in terms of free or forced labor is on the ballot. While I think that Slavery in any form is bad, I don't want to over-sensationalize the topic.

More than 150 years after slaves were freed in the US, voters in five states will soon decide whether to close loopholes that led to the proliferation of a different form of slavery – forced labor by people convicted of certain crimes.
None of the proposals would force immediate changes inside the states’ prisons, though they could lead to legal challenges related to how they use prison labor, a lasting imprint of slavery’s legacy on the entire United States.
The effort is part of a national push to amend the 13th Amendment to the US Constitution that banned enslavement or involuntary servitude except as a form of criminal punishment. That exception has long permitted the exploitation of labor by convicted felons.

Scrutiny over prison labour has existed for decades, but the 13th Amendment’s loophole in particular encouraged former Confederate states after the Civil War to devise new ways to maintain the dynamics of slavery.
They used restrictive measures, known as the “Black codes” because they nearly always targeted Black people, to criminalize benign interactions such as talking too loudly or not yielding on the pavement. Those targeted would end up in custody for minor actions, effectively enslaving them again.

So, while it is a form of slavery, it only applies to the prison population. Apparently, this labor clause for incarcerated people is still active even today in some States so now there is a push to amend it. What does ATS think?

www.scmp.com...

originally posted by: lostbook
Forgive me, ATS. I altered the headline a little bit. The headline is says that 'Slavery is on the Ballot...' Upon further reading I see that it means Slavery for the prison population in terms of free or forced labor is on the ballot. While I think that Slavery in any form is bad, I don't want to over-sensationalize the topic.

More than 150 years after slaves were freed in the US, voters in five states will soon decide whether to close loopholes that led to the proliferation of a different form of slavery – forced labor by people convicted of certain crimes.
None of the proposals would force immediate changes inside the states’ prisons, though they could lead to legal challenges related to how they use prison labor, a lasting imprint of slavery’s legacy on the entire United States.
The effort is part of a national push to amend the 13th Amendment to the US Constitution that banned enslavement or involuntary servitude except as a form of criminal punishment. That exception has long permitted the exploitation of labor by convicted felons.

Scrutiny over prison labour has existed for decades, but the 13th Amendment’s loophole in particular encouraged former Confederate states after the Civil War to devise new ways to maintain the dynamics of slavery.
They used restrictive measures, known as the “Black codes” because they nearly always targeted Black people, to criminalize benign interactions such as talking too loudly or not yielding on the pavement. Those targeted would end up in custody for minor actions, effectively enslaving them again.

So, while it is a form of slavery, it only applies to the prison population. Apparently, this labor clause for incarcerated people is still active even today in some States so now there is a push to amend it. What does ATS think?

www.scmp.com...

THIS POST CONTAINED ERRONEOUS INFORMATION.

I'M SO ASHAMED.

*whimper

a reply to: lostbook

The entire issue and the only reason Democrats care is that they get to use the word "Slavery" in a headline.


Can the same rules apply to captive school children forced to sell freaking candy bars, cookies, or popcorn?

a reply to: MykeNukem

But ending the loophole which allows forced or free labor "Slavery" upon the prison population wouldn't be a boost to the economy, me thinks. Unless I'm misunderstanding the context here...?

We're all slaves, thats the big joke, but there are prescribed layers to it. And following that prescription, we all almost wittingly tow the lines of arguing with each other about it. Which is the design, keep us away from TPTB.

originally posted by: lostbook
a reply to: MykeNukem

But ending the loophole which allows forced or free labor "Slavery" upon the prison population wouldn't be a boost to the economy, me thinks. Unless I'm misunderstanding the context here...?

Yes, I agree I misinterpreted that.

Adjusted, thanks.

originally posted by: lostbook
More than 150 years after slaves were freed in the US, voters in five states will soon decide whether to close loopholes that led to the proliferation of a different form of slavery – forced labor by people convicted of certain crimes.

Slavery is forced labor, but remember that mere imprisonment without the imposition of labor already constitutes "involuntary servitude."

Anyways the 13th Amendment is effectively null and void and unenforced. They just call it mental health, and lock people up just the same, without a proper criminal conviction; once the subject of mental health is brought up in court, all possibility of civil discourse or criminal procedures is lost; patients under "civil commitment" among other abominations of law and perversions of justice are only the prisoners of war of an incredibly hostile and extremely well armed military-psychiatric occupation.

It would be better to work than lay around in your cell all day.

a reply to: lostbook

But ending the loophole which allows forced or free labor "Slavery" upon the prison population

Which the prison population gets paid for...
And the key word is prison.
Don't do the crime if ya can't do the time .

Sponsored by "I am not a liberal loon foundation"

a reply to: lostbook

What is this push to eliminate deterrents from our society?

I like the idea that you fkd up and now you break big rocks into little rocks, or clean ditches to UNDERSTAND that breaking said rocks SUCKS and maybe prison isn't the place you wanna end up.

WE DESPERATELY NEED EXAMPLES AND POLICIES LIKE THIS MORE THAN EVER.

Prisoners get paid for work and free everything else right ?😎🌞

a reply to: lostbook

You mean chain gangs?

Sorry, but I'm all for them. There's nothing like seeing people doing a bit of hard labor to scare the kids straight.

a reply to: lostbook

You need a Constitutional Convention to change the US Constitution

a reply to: lostbook

I'm 100% against forced prison labor. All it does is incentivize putting people in prison. To much room for corruption.
For profit prison is deeply anti-freedom.

This shouldn't be a partisan issue.

originally posted by: scraedtosleep
a reply to: lostbook

I'm 100% against forced prison labor. All it does is incentivize putting people in prison. To much room for corruption.
For profit prison is deeply anti-freedom.

This shouldn't be a partisan issue.

Thing is, they don't force anyone into prison (yet), individual poor choices sort that out.

How do you feel about "community service", specifically court ordered weekend road cleanup for traffic violations?

a reply to: scraedtosleep

I have to agree with you. The entire prison industrial complex is off. Look at it this way. First the government pays the prisons 40K per year per prisoner. So you have a prison of say 5000 people, thats a windfall of 200 million. Now, the prison can turn around and keep you in your cell all day, which as a prisoner, you go nuts, or you can go to work at 15 cents an hour.
So now instead of hiring cooks, cleaners, laundry for the prison, which for 5000, you would need around 3-400 to staff it, you outsource it to the prison population, so instead of 400 @ 15/hr its 400 @ .15/hour. New cost savings. Secondly, you create industries that you provide labor for, 4500 @ .15/hr that you are billing 4500@ 7.50/hr means you are getting 7.35/hr of revenue on the 4500. That's an extra 70 million dollars in labor revenue, not including the mark up on the projects you are doing, such as building a road, cleaning roads, picking up trash, mowing lawns, whatever. That is 270,000,000 for a population of 5000 prisoners + the revenue on the industry projects they are leading. thats probably close to 400 Million. It pays to house inmates, it pays to keep a steady pipeline of them, and it pays to put them to work.

Minumum security has over 500k prisoners capable for work release, etc (500K @40K)+([email protected])+(Project revenue) you get the picture, there is a reason why every town, county, state, and federal government has prisons. its a 100 Billion dollar industry built to circumvent the current business model. How can a small business compete, when the prison industrial complex doesn't have to pay labor you do?

Camain

Camain

a reply to: lostbook

We're all slaves now muwhahaha!

a reply to: lostbook

just because you broke society's laws, doesn't mean you deserve free room and board. if you weren't in prison you'd have to figure someway to earn your keep.

if a prisoner is hard at work that means he's not as able to sit around thinking of ways he can start sh@@ with other prisoners or guards, and when he gets done at work chances are he's to tired to won't start none at night and just wants to eat and hit the rack.

work the hell out of them, just like they would have to if they were doing it in the outside world being a real human that isn't breaking the law and being a sh@@brid. it's punishment, not a country club.

a reply to: scraedtosleep

Sheriff, there is a lot of litter along Highway 8 where that Boy Scout troop was ran over by a semi 5 years back.
Don’t worry Mayor, some people might have been driving around with a busted taillight recently…


Forced prison labor doesn’t make trigger devices for nuclear warheads or anything mission critical. They don’t even put together plastic silverware, napkins, salt & pepper packets and hand wipes in the plastic sleeve for takeout orders. That is done by exploiting MR/DD adults paid on a per piece basis, generally by Goodwill. They also have them sort donations looking for sizes, repairs, stains, rifle through pockets, etc.

a reply to: lostbook

They don't pay for their food in prison. They don't pay for heating/air conditioning, laundry services, etc. They have TV's, weight rooms, opportunity for college degrees in some cases. It seems only fair they work for these things like the rest of us. They just can't roam around the world freely because they are locked up for a crime.