Pope Francis, universal religion and the end times

originally posted by: hopeisasound
a reply to: AlwaysoneandTogether

Facepalm was the first word that came to my mind too after I read your reply, lol. Did you just speak on behalf of the entire planet when you said “openly acknowledged fact…”? Openly acknowledged as fact by whom? I swear, people watch some kid on the internet spew out some zeitgeist crap about osiris and people buy into it. Not remotely the same. Our “school textbook” as you like to call it is completely reliable and yes we read the nonsense the state puts in YOUR textbooks too, lol. I urge you to re-examine your understanding of scripture before God gives you up completely to your own deception. Respectfully.

Interesting, thanks for tagging respectfully on the end of that, civilised discourse on ATS seems to sometimes be in short supply and I’ll take it at face value that the respect is meant sincerely.

You can go ahead and google the Council of Nicaea.

The bible is comprised of older texts yes? Edited by the church yes?

These doctrines then created a two millennia blight on our species (rounding up slightly there lol).

Whatever good the Christian church might have done the world was extinguished with the first person murdered in its name.

Do you deny the crimes committed? Does anyone deny the inquisition? That’s not a pointed question I’m genuinely interested…

Let’s look at a freer population dumping christianity; would same sex marriage have been accepted by the church 50 years ago? Homosexuality? What does it tell us? It could be argued that the stance of the church has moderated to be more caring and inclusive. The OP makes the point about diluting the faiths, this simple rollback is an enlightened move. It’s such a shame genocide isn’t as easily rolled back. Why is the stance of the church shifting? Perhaps because the pope isn’t an idiot and can see the past conflict of freedom versus faith. The writing IS on the wall…

I personally think that the hypocrisy displayed by an institution with sooooo much blood on its hands is finally resonating with a population that hasn’t been intimidated into attending a Sunday collection plate party.
Indeed there was a recent article projecting christianity to loose predominance in the US, to this I say excellent. The sooner this institution and those like it are consigned to history the more enlightened humanity will become. FYI I’m cool with faith in some of the kinder aspects of christianity. When they bring people together for positive ends that’s beautiful but why the rules? Faith doesn’t need a set of rules…

Freedom and self determination, something the church has never wanted to give us…

I have faith, I have belief but not in a cult, if denying ignorance results in someone else’s ’god’ passing judgement on or abandoning me believe me, I’m totally cool with that.

Now, if I’ve understood the faith correctly christianity now just preaches love and forgiveness yes?
So (apologies for just assuming christian is how you self identify) you’ll forgive my point of view surely?
I certainly do you and yours.

Also another question if I may, what do you think the future holds for the church, and if it is to have a future, what needs to change.

With love

originally posted by: 19Bones79
a reply to: neoholographic

The pope is running a business that has survived for roundabout 2 millennia.

Who knew that 'the customer is always wrong' would be such a successful business model?

You don't have to look back even a 100 years to see how 'gods representative on earth' has played the odds to ensure their survival.

They see dark times ahead, they hoard their treasure on earth instead of turning to god.

They see diversity infesting everything else, they move with the times to survive.

They even cosied up to the nazis so I do not understand when people are shocked that the oldest, largest pedophile network on the planet decides to roll with the times once more.

The easiest way to prophecy and create strife and turmoil is to create a rigid belief structure that the faithful mind cannot let go of.

Then, when the time is right as decided by TPTP, everything that people believed in, even their way of life gets flipped upside down.

It has happened with every new age that the elite has brought forward

There were other major religions before Christianity that now only exist in history books.


This is a formula upon which the church also built its foundation (literally) on the ruins of the religions they replaced.

The problem remains how do you convince decent people who connect their decency to the very thing that will ensure they are thrown into turmoil?

The book of revelations is an abstract blueprint of this very situation that has been grooming believers to faithfully expect what is coming.

Instead of some divine revelation, tptb have scripted it to usher in the end of this age and the dawn of a new one.

You can't say that to a believer because their beliefs have been crafted on divine hope, and they will play their part according to that script, just like tptb intended.

I wish believers could see this but once again there is a failsafe built into the belief structure that instantly dismisses my words as either demonic or that of a confused non-believer.

Look what the church got away with over thousands of years and yet people still flock there to dangle with concepts such as 'purity' and 'forgiveness'.

I am angry at the purveyors of religion for so completely duping people who only have the noblest of intentions and I am sad for the believers that are fatally trapped in their web of beliefs.

Who can separate the abuser and the victim in this case?

We cannot even begin to address reality and how to move forward because people are stuck in a construct.

You can't imagine my words to be true and yet you can instantly dismiss Islam because it is not your path and your path says it is the only path.


Here is the impossible path:

Humanity needs to free itself from the constructs of the elite without being played against each other while they get richer.

You cannot do this if you refuse to walk out of your self imposed prison.

Extremely well said

originally posted by: AlwaysoneandTogether

originally posted by: hopeisasound
a reply to: AlwaysoneandTogether

Facepalm was the first word that came to my mind too after I read your reply, lol. Did you just speak on behalf of the entire planet when you said “openly acknowledged fact…”? Openly acknowledged as fact by whom? I swear, people watch some kid on the internet spew out some zeitgeist crap about osiris and people buy into it. Not remotely the same. Our “school textbook” as you like to call it is completely reliable and yes we read the nonsense the state puts in YOUR textbooks too, lol. I urge you to re-examine your understanding of scripture before God gives you up completely to your own deception. Respectfully.

Interesting, thanks for tagging respectfully on the end of that, civilised discourse on ATS seems to sometimes be in short supply and I’ll take it at face value that the respect is meant sincerely.

You can go ahead and google the Council of Nicaea.

The bible is comprised of older texts yes? Edited by the church yes?

These doctrines then created a two millennia blight on our species (rounding up slightly there lol).

Whatever good the Christian church might have done the world was extinguished with the first person murdered in its name.

Do you deny the crimes committed? Does anyone deny the inquisition? That’s not a pointed question I’m genuinely interested…

Let’s look at a freer population dumping christianity; would same sex marriage have been accepted by the church 50 years ago? Homosexuality? What does it tell us? It could be argued that the stance of the church has moderated to be more caring and inclusive. The OP makes the point about diluting the faiths, this simple rollback is an enlightened move. It’s such a shame genocide isn’t as easily rolled back. Why is the stance of the church shifting? Perhaps because the pope isn’t an idiot and can see the past conflict of freedom versus faith. The writing IS on the wall…

I personally think that the hypocrisy displayed by an institution with sooooo much blood on its hands is finally resonating with a population that hasn’t been intimidated into attending a Sunday collection plate party.
Indeed there was a recent article projecting christianity to loose predominance in the US, to this I say excellent. The sooner this institution and those like it are consigned to history the more enlightened humanity will become. FYI I’m cool with faith in some of the kinder aspects of christianity. When they bring people together for positive ends that’s beautiful but why the rules? Faith doesn’t need a set of rules…

Freedom and self determination, something the church has never wanted to give us…

I have faith, I have belief but not in a cult, if denying ignorance results in someone else’s ’god’ passing judgement on or abandoning me believe me, I’m totally cool with that.

Now, if I’ve understood the faith correctly christianity now just preaches love and forgiveness yes?
So (apologies for just assuming christian is how you self identify) you’ll forgive my point of view surely?
I certainly do you and yours.

Also another question if I may, what do you think the future holds for the church, and if it is to have a future, what needs to change.

With love

Sigh…The council of Nicaea, really? Lol. I don’t need Google for that tired (and outdated) objection. The very fact that you’ve mentioned the council of Nicaea tells me you are (respectfully) ignorant of not only the Bible and how it came to be compiled and “edited” as you assert but it’s also telling of how far you’ve actually studied and looked into these things for yourself. Respectfully.

The Bible we have today is translated DIRECTLY from the earliest manuscripts. We can check our English Bibles against the ORIGINAL Greek and Hebrew manuscripts. It’s not some big game of telephone, changing little by little with each translation. It goes back to the original every time. Not from one to the next.

The good of the church wiped out by the first person murdered in it’s name? I think I see the issue here. Anyone can claim with their lips to be a follower of Christ but the proof is in the pudding. I would argue anyone doing any kind of evil, including the inquisition and the crusades, isn’t a true follower of Christ. So it’s not true Christians that do these things. It’s “professing” Christians. I’m not Catholic btw, so we are on the same page with the Catholic a church.

Christianity just teaches love and forgiveness???? That would depend on your definition of love I suppose. By God’s definition a resounding YES. By most’s definitions, no way. Have you ever talked with a real Christian? We believe same sex marriage is wrong for a plethora of different reasons and the true church is not changing its stance on that. The Pope is a turd. Reject religion and embrace Christ and his teachings.

I can honestly say based on your reply that you don’t understand the Christian faith correctly nor do you properly understand Church history or the Bible or our theology. I wish I wasn’t on my phone right now lol, I want to address each one of your points! But as to not derail the thread further and due to the fact that maybe based on your current understanding of Christianity, it probably wouldn’t produce much fruit.

Not trying to be rude I promise. I may be snarky at times but I’m just being short for the moment due to my hate of posting from a phone!

a reply to: hopeisasound

Please enlighten me on Christs teachings about homosexuality.

There is none.

There is however:

Do unto others as you would have done unto you.

Judge not, lest ye be judged

Whatever you do to the least of them, so you do unto me.

Love one another, as I have loved you.

Christ never spoke on homosexuality, and I seem to remember Let he who is without sin throw the first stone.

We are all sinners, we are all imperfect, we are all fallible, and to pretend we are not is in error.

A loving and committed relationship between two people committed to one another in LOVE UNTIL DEATH DO US PART (not lust or hedonistic fornication) should be celebrated, regardless of the genders involved in the union.

Even "christians" seem to forget the oath of marriage and get divorced, have adulterous relations and covet their neighbors wives but we do not chastise them for it for some reason.

Sincerely,

A Modern Progressive Catholic Married to an Atheist who didn't always walk the straight and narrow of the Church Doctrine but who loves Christ's Teachings and struggles every day to live and practice the lessons of the Gospels instead of merely recite them for arguments sake and believes that TRUE LOVE is a rare and wonderful blessing to those who find it.

originally posted by: GENERAL EYES
a reply to: hopeisasound

Please enlighten me on Christs teachings about homosexuality.

There is none.

Another Catholic who hasn’t read the Bible. Big surprise. I’m sorry but how can you in good conscience spout off this nonsense? Hooooooold on. Let me get my laptop and annoy everyone with my narrow minded Christianity…I’ll answer the rest first…

There is however:

Do unto others as you would have done unto you.

Yes, and?

Judge not, lest ye be judged

Why do you only post the part of the verse that you like?

Whatever you do to the least of them, so you do unto me.

Exactly.

Love one another, as I have loved you.

That’s what I’m saying! How can you be loving anyone when you blatantly lie to them about scripture? You should love them by being honest! Not just telling people what they want to hear because feelings.

Christ never spoke on homosexuality, and I seem to remember Let he who is without sin throw the first stone.

Yes, he did. Stay tuned for an annoying bible lesson…

And yet another verse out of context, cherry picked to try and make a point.

We are all sinners, we are all imperfect, we are all fallible, and to pretend we are not is in error.

Agreed

A loving and committed relationship between two people committed to one another in LOVE UNTIL DEATH DO US PART (not lust or hedonistic fornication) should be celebrated, regardless of the genders involved in the union.

Says who? You or Jesus?

Even "christians" seem to forget the oath of marriage and get divorced, have adulterous relations and covet their neighbors wives but we do not chastise them for it for some reason.

Professing Christians yes.

Sincerely,

A Modern Progressive Catholic Married to an Atheist who didn't always walk the straight and narrow of the Church Doctrine but who loves Christ's Teachings and struggles every day to live and practice the lessons of the Gospels instead of merely recite them for arguments sake and believes that TRUE LOVE is a rare and wonderful blessing to those who find it.

Who defines true love? See, when you pick and choose what you like from the Bible like a buffet, god ends up looking more like you then you do him. Just saying.

edit on 20-9-2022 by hopeisasound because: Italics