Carl Sagan Predicted The Mess 2021 Would Be 25 years Ago

I've always thought Carl Sagan was a genius from as a child sharing in his journeys of the imagination around the Cosmos in his TV series to now as I see this video of Sagan and the quote read out from his book published shortly before he died , Sagan shares his fearful view of the future America in his children's or grandchildren's time which looking around at the world today his words seem to hit the nail firmly on the head as what has come to be , but not just in America.

First part of the video is Carl Sagan's opinion on Star wars the quote in question is from 2.35 and read by MSNBC's Brian Williams.


It's a shame he didn't live long enough to see the advances in astronomy that we now take for granted.

3 weeks until JWST pictures.

That's as accurate as could possibly be predicted.

a reply to: gortex

Here's the transcript. (from you-tldr.com... )

CARL SAGAN COULD NOT HAVE PREDICTED 2021 BUT HE DID SEE IT COMING. HE WROTE THE FOLLOWING BACK IN 1995, AND WE QUOTE.

"I HAVE A FOREBODING OF AN AMERICA IN MY CHILDREN’S OR GRANDCHILDREN’S TIME, WHEN THE UNITED STATES IS A SERVICE AND INFORMATION ECONOMY, WHEN NEARLY ALL THE MANUFACTURING INDUSTRIES HAVE SLIPPED AWAY TO OTHER COUNTRIES, WHEN AWESOME TECHNOLOGICAL POWERS ARE IN THE HANDS OF A VERY FEW AND NO ONE REPRESENTING THE PUBLIC INTEREST CAN EVEN GRASP THE ISSUES. WHEN THE PEOPLE HAVE LOST THE ABILITY TO SET THEIR OWN AGENDAS OR KNOWLEDGEABLY QUESTION THOSE IN AUTHORITY, WHEN, CLUTCHING OUR CRYSTALS AND NERVOUSLY CONSULTING OUR HOROSCOPES, OUR CRITICAL FACULTIES IN DECLINE, UNABLE TO DISTINGUISH BETWEEN WHAT FEELS GOOD AND WHAT’S TRUE, WE SLIDE, ALMOST WITHOUT NOTICING, BACK INTO SUPERSTITION AND DARKNESS. THE DUMBING DOWN OF AMERICA IS MOST EVIDENT IN THE SLOW DECAY OF SUBSTANTIVE CONTENT IN THE ENORMOUSLY INFLUENTIAL MEDIA, THE 30-SECOND SOUND BITES, NOW DOWN TO TEN SECONDS OR LESS, LOWEST COMMON DENOMINATOR PROGRAMMING, CREDULOUS PRESENTATIONS ON PSEUDOSCIENCE AND SUPERSTITION, BUT ESPECIALLY A KIND OF CELEBRATION OF IGNORANCE."

ROLL THAT AROUND FOR A WHILE. THOSE WERE AMONG HIS FINAL PUBLISHED WORDS. HE DIED TEN MONTHS LATER.

Regarding his 'Star Wars' comments: I guess he must not have realized it was just a movie, meant purely for entertainment...

a reply to: gortex
Love to listen to Carl Sagan's thoughts. He's so good with words and explanation, very rational but also open minded.

I think he would turn in grave if he knew what was going on currently.

The last words from the quote around 2:35 are so fitting. Feelz instead of logic. Like the vaccine.

didn't someone else say something about bringing back manufacturing to the US? Likely in a mean tweet.

originally posted by: network dude
didn't someone else say something about bringing back manufacturing to the US? Likely in a mean tweet.

Surely for that to happen, one would need a magic wand...

originally posted by: TDDAgain
a reply to: gortex
Love to listen to Carl Sagan's thoughts. He's so good with words and explanation, very rational but also open minded.

I think he would turn in grave if he knew what was going on currently.

The last words from the quote around 2:35 are so fitting. Feelz instead of logic. Like the vaccine.

Do you honestly believe that Carl Sagan would have been an anti-vaxxer?

a reply to: chr0naut

I think he might well have been against the massive push for a non sterilising experimental vaccine that could well cause the virus to mutate into a much worse variant.

a reply to: gortex

It’s not hard to predict how things will go when they’ve been deliberately designed to go that way. Sagan himself would agree.

a reply to: chr0naut
My post went completely over your head.

But it was to be expected.

originally posted by: surfer_soul
a reply to: chr0naut

I think he might well have been against the massive push for a non sterilising experimental vaccine that could well cause the virus to mutate into a much worse variant.

A sterilizing immunization is a myth - a perfection that is not possible.

Immunizations work by promoting rapid immune response to pathogens. This does not mean that our immune systems are perfect and kill all the pathogens before they begin to reproduce, all the time, which is what a sterilizing immunization would have to do.

Mutation is a fairly random event, and the thing that promotes new strains is the total number of infected host cells, and the duration of reproductions from which such mutations may occur. An average un-immunized person carries perhaps 20 times the peak viral load for three times as long as an immunized person, leading to a greater likelihood of hosting a mutation over that of an immunized person.

Considering also the arithmetic growth of epidemic spread of infections through populations, and how the reduction in transmission of the pathogen is one of the measured outcomes of immunization, the total number of infected persons are also a multiplier in the mutational success stakes.

It is clear that immunization is by far the least likely source of worse variants of disease (although it can create a very slight statistical weighting towards immunization resistant strains).

Nor would I consider the mRNA immunizations experimental anymore. We are well past that.

As a scientist, with multiple pHD's and a wide scope of expertise, Sagan would be aware of these things.

a reply to: chr0naut

What a load of nonsense, as your a person of faith I see now how you twist the science to conform to your faith.

originally posted by: TDDAgain
a reply to: chr0naut
My post went completely over your head.

But it was to be expected.

Might that be because your post was ambiguous?

Like your ones on Germany re-committing to coal.

Do you think Sagan would have been so ambiguous about fossil fuel use?

originally posted by: surfer_soul
a reply to: chr0naut

What a load of nonsense, as your a person of faith I see now how you twist the science to conform to your faith.

Name a single perfectly sterilizing immunization.

a reply to: chr0naut

Nope. Because the media spawned FEAR and that's a feeling that led most to vaccinate and push and shun other's.

Ambiguous? You have to explain that in the correct thread to me. I think it will be stupid strawman argument of yours, logic is and was never you friend, so come at me.

originally posted by: TDDAgain
a reply to: chr0naut

Nope. Because the media spawned FEAR and that's a feeling that led most to vaccinate and push and shun other's.

Germany has had historic plagues that have decimated the population. COVID-19 has potentially been another one of those, however, over the years the human race has developed a number of effective methods discovered to reduce the impact.

An organized response, to protect against a potential threat, is entirely rational. Denial of risk, isn't.

The immunizations reduce fear by being a method to reduce the risk.

No-one is being shunned. All are invited to be immunized, and it is acknowledged that some people have valid medical grounds to not immunize.

That being said, an immunization campaign can only protect a population that is immunized - if no-one gets immunized, if they are vaccine-hesitant, they cannot be protected by the mere existence of immunization, somewhere.

Ambiguous? You have to explain that in the correct thread to me. I think it will be stupid strawman argument of yours, logic is and was never you friend, so come at me.

Carl Sagan, in his book "The Demon Haunted World", the one quoted in the source article to the OP, specifically spoke to 'vaccine hesitancy' and was opposed to it. To quote him directly: “If you want to save your child from polio, you can pray or you can inoculate... Try science".

Sagan's book "The Demon Haunted World" was specifically against such pseudoscience and quackery.

The book also listed out the logical fallacies quite clearly and i think you will find that my previous posts do not actually conform to "strawman" arguments, either.

Carl Sagan was also at the forefront of warning us about the immanent dangers of climate change. He wasn't a climate change denier at any stage of his life.

In a previous post, you praised Sagan, and yet you clearly hold to the very things that he quite spoke plainly against, this is contradictory, and does not indicate that I am the clueless one, here.

Have a read: The Demon-Haunted World From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Or, you could probably access the full .pdf of the book for free if you searched for it.

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: surfer_soul
a reply to: chr0naut

What a load of nonsense, as your a person of faith I see now how you twist the science to conform to your faith.

Name a single perfectly sterilizing immunization.

The body’s T cells do that when allowed to do their thing. You talk about covid as if it was some great plague even though the figures showed early on the vast majority 99.6% get over it just fine. That was before an experimental jab was pushed on populations that they admitted didn’t stop you from catching or passing on the virus!

Yet you think you can convince me and others it was necessary! Your only fooling yourself.

originally posted by: surfer_soul

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: surfer_soul
a reply to: chr0naut

What a load of nonsense, as your a person of faith I see now how you twist the science to conform to your faith.

Name a single perfectly sterilizing immunization.

The body’s T cells do that when allowed to do their thing. You talk about covid as if it was some great plague even though the figures showed early on the vast majority 99.6% get over it just fine. That was before an experimental jab was pushed on populations that they admitted didn’t stop you from catching or passing on the virus!

Yet you think you can convince me and others it was necessary! Your only fooling yourself.

People still get sick and die from diseases - all sorts of diseases. This is proof that even T cells aren't 100% sterilizing.

Also, a survival rate of 99.6% would imply a case-fatality ratio (CFR) of 0.4%. CFR's for untreated COVID-19 are highly variable, but nowhere have they been as low as 0.4%. The world average pooled CFR is 10.0%, with a high degree of confidence:

Case fatality rate of COVID-19: a systematic review and meta-analysis - PubMed

a reply to: chr0naut

IDK what your problem is and what you read into my words about climate change and all that.

An organized response, to protect against a potential threat, is entirely rational. Denial of risk, isn't.

Like denial about that the vaccine can do harm? Was denied from the beginning, now what? '%§' like you are responsible for the situation I and others are in. Because with your frothing mouth you were too a supporter of vaccine mandates.

I blame people like you for the damage that was done to people like me. Go pound sand.

a reply to: chr0naut

COVID-19 has potentially been another one of those

Bullsh!t.

Nearly all of the people that died in hospital were put on ventilators and subsequently murdered.

The rest that weren't killed on ventilators died from something else with covid.

How many people died in the safety of their own home with covid?

Genuine question.