Hydrogen powered vehicles could rival electric

I was studying this hydrogen fuel storage paste material which I found interesting it's a magnesium hydroxide in an oil solution with other additives and it forms into a pumpable solution or pastes that have higher energy density than a battery and is refillable and can be used to store energy that is produced by Alternative Energy methods like wind farms and solar and then the paste that forms is shipped out to be used as fuel.

www.electrive.com...

Most of the people that are looking at this have not also looked at this other technology unrelated which burns hydrogen in a super-efficient internal combustion engine and has a higher Energy Efficiency in the use of hydrogen than does a fuel cell using a PEM type of membrane.

www.greencarcongress.com...

If they skip the fuel-cell idea and go with this engine I can see this powering small vehicles scooters even drones and other small aircraft and doing it completely cleanly with nothing but a little bit of heat and water vapor for the most part exiting the vehicle.

Sorry, too much freedom to travel, we will be switching to batteries from China for that right.

a reply to: machineintelligence

Source

this is reacted with hydrogen

www.electrive.com...

Green hydrogen is gaining traction, but still has massive hurdles to overcome
PUBLISHED FRI, DEC 4 2020 8:00 AM EST
UPDATED FRI, DEC 4 2020 12:06 PM EST

www.cnbc.com...


But today, 99% of hydrogen is still made using fossil fuels, usually through a pollution-heavy process
Green hydrogen, which is produced using electricity from renewable resources, could be the key to curb our carbon footprint

Next..

Green hydrogen is made through a process known as electrolysis. Here, a device known as an electrolyzer splits a compound into its constituent elements using an electric current.

What is more efficient?

Make electricity and place right in battery?

Make electricity to make hydrogen to react with past that has a manufacturing process of “ At 350 degrees Celsius and five to six times atmospheric pressure”Then placed in cartridges for a reaction with water?

How do you stop the reaction in an emergency…

like this comment from the article

Magnesium powder AND hydrogen! No fire risk here then.

Right now they are at the proof of concept, now for a car, they need a prototype and loads of testing and making sure a crash isn't gonna cause a fire that could melt the pavement.

FWIW same applies to drones and scooters too, I want it to work it would be great if it does, but we are years from it being a viable reality and that's if it passes the safety guidelines.

Now to mention how much tap water is for fill up? You do know tap water isn't an unlimited resource? Many many people think water is exactly wah the next wars will be fought over.

I imagine there would-be Exxon or Texaco water and paste stations, and they will be charging something. It would be so regulated

As long as there's a huge risk of explosions for the rich and entitled I'm all for it.

a reply to: neutronflux

I read patents and published papers when I am checking out a technology. Their numbers work because it is cheaper to for instance gather the wind in the middle of the panhandle and make the fuel on the site of the wind farm. No wires from the grid need to be run for hundreds of miles to bring in a remote wind energy resource for instance. It is not the be-all-end-all of energy storage but the energy density is great and this engine could be powered on it for very lightweight, efficient air or land vehicles.

stop the water flow the reaction stops. We are talking about a solenoid for a solution to that not an issue.

a reply to: machineintelligence

Sorry. Still easier and safer to put the electricity right in a battery than a runaway reaction.

a reply to: machineintelligence

Where is the magnesium going to come from.

A strong chemical reagent, magnesium forms stable compounds and reacts with oxygen and chlorine in both the liquid and gaseous states. This means that extraction of the metal from raw materials is an energy-intensive process requiring well-tuned technologies.

www.electrive.com...

And that’s excluding the “ At 350 degrees Celsius and five to six times atmospheric pressure” for the finished process…


So…


Put the electricity in the car battery? Or use the electricity to make hydrogen, make magnesium, then make the paste?

a reply to: neutronflux

Where do you read runaway reaction? Just not seeing anything about that anywhere here.

a reply to: RickyD

How do you stop any chemical reaction in an instant?

Anyway… car crash with fire and ruptured paste cartridges? Be nice to put the fire out with water?

Every time I see a topic about hydrogen fuel cells, my brain reflexively plays a highlights reel of the Terminator film.

I thought I remember seeing an old video regarding Bob Lazar back in the 80's when he develop a hydrogen energy car that ran on an electrolysis system and I believe he mentioned how he stopped the process if there was an emergency. So many things have been scrubbed off Youtube I can't find it with a quick check. I believe he won a contest or something and there was a story in a local paper about it.

I got into the automotive industry in 2001 and had to go through a ton of training about hydrogen powered vehicles. They were to be the primary vehicles on the road in a matter of a few years. Still haven't had to use that training.

And there is the problem with hydrogen, it doesn't solve any energy problems and it creates many of its own. "Green energy" people must face the facts: TANSTAAFL

The problem is hydrogen embrittlement, since the molecule is so small it will invade the metal of the cylinder and piston and cause them to become brittle over time until eventual catastrophic failure. The hydrogen can be locked up in some compound, but once you have pure H2 it gets in everything.

a reply to: machineintelligence

Kudo's. I have been posting about Hydrogen motors for years. I hope your OP reaches peoples minds. This has been around for me going on about 30 years or so since my alma mater made a car that runs on H2 and could be "on demand" from the patent.


Their idea at the time required the NASA device they use to make O2 for breathing and H2 for fuel cells. The company wanted 1 million$ for each one. They moved to cylinder H2 stored under pressure. Then modified a Solar concept to help them charge a battery that was creating the H2 gas to supplement a trip from coast to coast during the Obama admin IIRC.

Link

In March 2013, Ricketts and a team of current and former students made news nationwide when they successfully drove a modified Toyota Prius from the Atlantic at Tybee Island, Georgia, to a Pacific beach near Los Angeles—a five-day, 2,600-mile driving expedition—powered exclusively by hydrogen made from sun and water. Two hydrogen storage tanks attached underneath the car (along with tanks added to the backseat and hauled by a trailer) equipped Ricketts and team with the fuel necessary to complete the coast-to-coast trip.

Lithium Ion battery technology was developed in 1994.

We're so stupid, we haven't advanced this technology since then.

Go humanity! Yay us!

:|

I'm open to new ideas, but this doesn't look like it, yet.

Needs work.

originally posted by: odd1out
And there is the problem with hydrogen, it doesn't solve any energy problems and it creates many of its own. "Green energy" people must face the facts: TANSTAAFL

Well my 1st reply this thread, I have shared how they set up Solar panels helped the test run from coast to coast of a H2 powered motor by cracking water to get the H2 out for use in the motor.

n March 2013, Ricketts and a team of current and former students made news nationwide when they successfully drove a modified Toyota Prius from the Atlantic at Tybee Island, Georgia, to a Pacific beach near Los Angeles—a five-day, 2,600-mile driving expedition—powered exclusively by hydrogen made from sun and water. Two hydrogen storage tanks attached underneath the car (along with tanks added to the backseat and hauled by a trailer) equipped Ricketts and team with the fuel necessary to complete the coast-to-coast trip.

originally posted by: bounder
The problem is hydrogen embrittlement, since the molecule is so small it will invade the metal of the cylinder and piston and cause them to become brittle over time until eventual catastrophic failure. The hydrogen can be locked up in some compound, but once you have pure H2 it gets in everything.

Nissan came up with a way to change the heads to match the temperature changes with the H2 fuel and supposedly solved that issue already.

originally posted by: neutronflux
a reply to: machineintelligence

Sorry. Still easier and safer to put the electricity right in a battery than a runaway reaction.

not necessarily.

the content of the batteries themselves (be ion or acid) are dangerous and have very hazardous chemicals.

along with CAN go on fire.. remember the cell phone and laptop batteries?

hardly a small harmless flame isnt it.

when i was a volunteer firefighter we had a whole class on the dangers of battery powered vehicles in a crash.

im sorry but battery powered vehicles being "safe" is not true

there is no "safe free lunch" in EV .

scrounger