So we've got it. What to do now? (Covid 19)

originally posted by: The GUT
High-dose ivermectin, if found to be safe and well tolerated, might offer a promising new tool for malaria elimination.

Eating your shoe would probably be well tolerated as well, but it wont cure you of COVID.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

Yeah, because I like rolling the dice when it comes to medical, financial and legal advice.

I don't consider using my own faculties as rolling the dice. However, it is true that sometimes we have to take conflicting information and make a best guess. That's life. Injecting unproven & hastily-brought-to-market Mrna technology is rolling the dice big time I'd say.

Deciding to add a very promising treatment option with a safety profile greater than Tylenol isn't much of a dice roll in comparison, eh?

You think they post this for feels or because following the advice of internet randos could be harmful?

No, I think they post it because it makes sense. What it doesn't do is cover the holes in your leaky argument.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

We'll, if I were you I'd certainly rely on my homebrew remedies over a trained and licensed physician. Or you could doctor shop until you find someone who agrees with you. Either way, YOU aren't a physician and your medical advice and everyone else's on here is anecdotal.

Trained and licensed physicians will normally stop short of giving medical advice on an online forum that isn't specifically for medical advice.

I almost told them to call their own doctor, but that kind of advice usually gets me flamed on here. I felt that I should at least warn them about fake ivm and hcq.

originally posted by: SinDefiant
So my wife and I tested positive for covid today. We've been careful but it's just one of those things. I'm going to get some zinc for sure. Was thinking about getting ivermectin and/or hydrochloroquine. Wanted to know what you guys think. We've got 2 8 month old twin babies so going down isn't really an option we need to take this on our feet.

Please, read this thread now.

Pass this information to everyone you know.

originally posted by: The GUT
I don't consider using my own faculties as rolling the dice.

I consider following your and everyone else's here anecdotal and un-expert advice to be rolling the dice.

originally posted by: tamusan
Trained and licensed physicians will normally stop short of giving medical advice on an online forum that isn't specifically for medical advice.

Of course, they're not cretins.

I almost told them to call their own doctor, but that kind of advice usually gets me flamed on here. I felt that I should at least warn them about fake ivm and hcq.

I've literally seen people give out deadly medical advice on here over the 15 years I've been posting.

originally posted by: StaticVoid

Eating your shoe would probably be well tolerated as well, but it wont cure you of COVID.

But Ivermectin just might. Might. But you be the judge. Treat the following information as suspect but please do dig in yourself. That's what I've been doing.

I'm open to any new information that suggests it has little to no efficacy. I always reserve the right--and intellectual integrity--to follow the truth wherever it leads.

So if turns out that this drug with an exceptional safety profile isn't effective I'll own it. But here ya' go---dig in and see what you think.

Summary of the Evidence for Ivermectin in COVID-19

a reply to: The GUT

And that paper was rejected.

The editors of Frontiers in Pharmacology have taken down an article about the use of the antiparasitic drug ivermectin in COVID-19 patients. The paper, which was written by members of an organization called the Front Line COVID-19 Critical Care Alliance (FLCCC), had been provisionally accepted and posted in abstract form by the journal in January, but was ultimately rejected this Monday (March 1). The editors determined that it contained unsubstantiated claims and violated the journal’s editorial policies.

www.the-scientist.com...

originally posted by: StaticVoid
a reply to: The GUT

And that paper was rejected.

I didn't give you a link to one paper. It's dishonest and foolish of you to cherry pick and think it would go unnoticed.

Are you gonna read any of them? Because if not you're a lightweight when it comes to personal research and due diligence and you shouldn't be lecturing anyone else on research methodologies.

When I got it, it got bad, and I had trouble breathing, due to COPD.
For me, putting onions in the arches of my feet, under socks, and cutting one up and having it in the bedroom, overnight, made me be able to breath the next day.

a reply to: The GUT

Its not cherry picking, its what we've been discussing, the scientific method in action. The research was published, peer reviewed, and rejected on basic scientific principles. QED

a reply to: The GUT

Summary of the Evidence for Ivermectin in COVID-19

I find this source to be far more reputable than the FLCCC alliance. You can scroll down and see what they have to say about ivm.

Infectious Disease Society of America: Guidelines on the treatments and management of patients with covid19

originally posted by: StaticVoid

Its not cherry picking, its what we've been discussing, the scientific method in action. The research was published, peer reviewed, and rejected on basic scientific principles. QED

As should be any study that has flawed methodology. But there are many studies that are solid. And yes you are cherry-picking. Flagrantly. But your reputation here is your own responsibility.

Do you have a problem looking at them and considering the evidence?

Because so far it's obvious you know very little about the pros vs cons and the excellent research that has survived peer review.

originally posted by: The GUT

originally posted by: StaticVoid

Its not cherry picking, its what we've been discussing, the scientific method in action. The research was published, peer reviewed, and rejected on basic scientific principles. QED

As should be any study that has flawed methodology. But there are many studies that are solid. And yes you are cherry-picking. Flagrantly. But your reputation here is your own responsibility.

Do you have a problem looking at them and considering the evidence?

Because so far it's obvious you know very little about the pros vs cons and the excellent research that has survived peer review.

How about you point them out then rather than casting judgement on me? You posted a link, I countered it, this is how logical debate works.

Thank you all for your advice. I read the first post and pdf then ran out to get the vitamins. By the time I got back it was time to help the babies get ready for bed. After that I forgot about the post but I have read all the new posts today and will be following the advice. I am of course going to a physician but I can't just sit and do nothing until the appointment date.

originally posted by: StaticVoid

How about you point them out then rather than casting judgement on me? You posted a link, I countered it, this is how logical debate works.

Did you even look at the link? The best evidence is laid out with links to numerous studies. Dig in and then I'll be glad to hear & consider your thoughts on whether there's any merit--with little downside--to considering Ivermectin as part of one's treatment plan.

Currently, as of September 19, 2021, the totality of the evidence is as follows.

• IN-VITRO (BASIC SCIENCE): ivermectin has been shown to inhibit the replication of many viruses, including West-Nile, Zika, Dengue, Influenza, and most recently SARS-CoV-2 [1,2,3,4,5,6,7]

• IN-VIVO: ivermectin diminishes viral load and protects against organ damage in animal models of SARS-CoV-2 infection and has multiple, potent anti-inflammatory and immune- modulating properties [1, 2, 3]
For more information about the FLCCC Alliance and our Prevention & Treatment Protocols for COVID-19, please visit www.flccc.net
Page 2 / 3
• IN-SILICO: numerous computer modeling studies have found ivermectin to have one of the highest binding affinities to the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein

• PHARMACOLOGIC: unparalleled safety profile over decades, prior WHO guidelines report side effects that are “primarily minor and transient” and experts have found severe adverse events to be “unequivocally and exceedingly rare.” Further, the IC-50 against SARS-CoV2 in lung and adipose tissue easily achieved with standard dosing (Caly/Wagstaff personal communication)

• CLINICAL OBSERVATIONS/EXPERIENCE: numerous cases series, most notably one published from the Dominican Republic in June 2020 where over 3,000 consecutive patients presented to the ER, were treated with ivermectin, and only 16 were hospitalized and only 1 died. Also, innumerable doctors from multiple countries around the world report observing consistent clinical responses in treated patients with few treatment failures.

• OBSERVATIONAL CONTROLLED TRIALS (OCT): As of August 8, 2021, the results from 31 OCT’s including over 6,800 patients find that treatment with ivermectin reduces time to recovery, rates of hospitalization, and mortality, the latter finding best reported in the sophisticated propensity-matched study of Rajter et al. published in the major medical journal Chest.

• META-ANALYSES OF RANDOMIZED CONTROLLED TRIALS (RCT): 27 RCT’s including over 3,400 patients have been completed. Meta-analyses find that ivermectin reduces time to viral clearance, hastens recovery, and reduces mortality.

• OBSERVATIONAL AND RANDOMIZED TRIALS IN THE PREVENTION OF COVID-19: A series of 13 RCT’s and OCT’s consistently find that single or repeated ivermectin use strongly reduces the risk of contracting COVID-19, with an average level of protection of 86% with higher levels of protection found amongst the trials with more frequent dosing [1,2,3,4,5,6,7(Table 2), 8,9,10,11,12].

• EPIDEMIOLOGIC: ivermectin distribution campaigns in Peru led to far lower COVID-19 case- fatality rates in those regions with widespread use. Further, large “test and treat” programs conducted by increasing numbers of Health Ministries report up to 75% reductions in the need for hospitalization (Mexico City) and massive reductions in mortality (Misiones, Argentina and La Pampas, Argentina). Finally and most importantly, the Indian state of Uttar Pradesh (pop. 241 million) has effectively eradicated COVID via systematic and widespread use of ivermectin in both prevention and early treatment.

The reports most relevant to public health officials are from the national and regional health ministries that employed either distribution or “test and treat” programs with ivermectin:
• Mexico City – The IMSSS Health Agency compared over 50,000 patients treated early with ivermectin to over 70,000 not treated and found up to a 75% reduction in need for hospitalization.


Page 3 / 3
• Peru – A nationwide mass-distribution program called “Mega-Operación Tayta” (MOT), initiated at various times across 25 states of Peru in May 2020, led to a 74% drop in regional excess deaths within a month, with each drop beginning 11 days after each MOT region’s varied start times

• La Pampas, Argentina – Health Ministry compared over 2,000 patients they treated early with ivermectin to over 12,000 without treatment and found a 40% reduction in hospitalization and 35% less ICU or death in older patients

• La Misiones, Argentina – Health Ministry just analyzed the first 800 of 4,000 ivermectin treated patients and compared to the rest of the population over the same time period, they found a 75% reduction in need for hospital and an 88% reduction in death.

• Uttar Pradesh, India – Used a strategy of close surveillance combined with both ivermectin treatment of all positive cases and preventive treatment of all family contacts. On September 10, 2021, only 11 cases with no deaths were recorded in a population of 241 million.

As of August 31, of the previous 187,638 tests performed, only 21 were positive, an essentially zero positive rate or .01%.
Finally, in both “long-haul” COVID and post-vaccine syndromes, ivermectin is proving to be highly effective at eliminating symptoms based on the rapidly accumulating clinical experiences of the FLCCC and a number of allied experts that co-developed the I-RECOVER protocol, centered around the use of ivermectin in these syndromes.
CONCLUSION

Based on the totality of the existing evidence above, the FLCCC strongly recommends ivermectin be used in both the prevention and treatment of all phases of COVID-19 in both vaccinated and unvaccinated populations.

So far y'all are just bitching without apparently having done much, if any, reading of the peer-reviewed research. And then wanna criticize others for having the maturity & due-diligence to do so.

edit on 15-12-2021 by The GUT because: (no reason given)

a reply to: The GUT

All of the in vivo studies that FLCCC reference are of low quality. They are even citing newspaper articles. 

Aside from being from a journal that does not provide peer review for anything in their library, this paper in particular does not read like it was authored by someone with an advanced degree in anything:

Sharp reductions in c19 case fatalities and excess death in Peru......with Ivermectin

a reply to: tamusan

Yes. It's refreshing that all of the methodologies from the gold-standard double-blind on down are listed and explained.

It's all put together and labeled correctly so you know what weight, if any, to give to any particular study.

a reply to: SinDefiant

So how are you both doing today?