The US goverment wants user data from Signal messging app

So I found this article today...very telling.

The blog at Signal gives information that they have been subpoena'd for their user data (again) in a grand jury in California. No surprises there...but this time you can read the redacted documents and see what they can, and will use, against people if they so choose.

Read wisely:

"Signal still knows nothing about you, but inexplicably the government continues to ask.

Because everything in Signal is end-to-end encrypted by default, the broad set of personal information that is typically easy to retrieve in other apps simply doesn’t exist on Signal’s servers. Once again, this subpoena requested a wide variety of information we don’t have, including the target’s name, address, correspondence, contacts, groups, calls.

As usual, we couldn’t provide any of that. It’s impossible to turn over data that we never had access to in the first place..."

Source

I think we need more of this from tech companies.
Not less.

***AHEM****META

a reply to: havok

We got rid of Signal when they started having issues connecting, and now we use a way better encryption texting platform. You can't see anyone's info as it is encrypted. This is what happens when you marry a cyber security, and computer architect dude.

a reply to: havok

They get you going and coming. There is no way to escape the digital data ocean.

They have us all in a database, even if you don't realize they do. My elderly Mother got a call recently from her niece she hadn't seen in years, asking her about members of the family, because she had received a Facebook message from someone claiming to be related to her. Surprise surprise.

Thinking about testing your ancestry? Here's how police, researchers are using the results

All united, under the sun. For the good of it, or the bad.

a reply to: havok

Started using Signal recently, very little info asked for set up, and aside from the good reason stated in the OP, it isn't owned by Facebook, unlike Whats App

I require most of my contacts to use Signal if we're discussing anything sensitive. If they refuse to use Signal I don't contact them.

Security and privacy is a primary concern for me.

All these same reasons are why Signal and Protonmail is crucial in times like these. They can go further and use keyloggers from Apple software updates or Android patches, but that's not the point. Companies need to protect their users privacy, not sell it without any regard.

I too, am on the journey to convert everyone I talk to into Signals.

I wouldn't put too much trust in any - Signal hads been hacked by US gov and used as evidence according to these court docs: Signal extraction and messages used as evidence

All telecommunications passwords and encryptions are tapped. The UK have had a black box style monitoring system that collects 12 Petabytes per day for most countries in the world. The US has access to this and the UK has access to the US system.

Pretty sure the US name for their system is a not to subtly hint that they're using red and blue light in fibre-optic cables to create an 'event horizon' so it can be tapped in parralel but prevent the message scrambling/provider/people communicating from being able to tell any interception happened.

EDIT: It's a godsend for work talk and general low-mid level sensitivity business/finance but I'd advise against anything too sensitive as the government and intel services provide major companies with as much insider info/corporate espionage as possible as profit employment levels and the economy are a major part of National Security.

a reply to: bastion

Signal hads been hacked by US gov

There are no completely secure platforms...

a reply to: bastion

I read that document. Thanks for the link.

Problem is, that idiot was not deleting his messages and used the cloud to back up pictures and messages. He also used Telegram as well, and didn't use the auto-delete feature on either app. He was a fool and deserved to be caught. Trafficking weapons for gangs into NYC is no joke and deserves the worst punishment.

To me, it's still worth noting that even the court documents state the end-to-end encryption is there, if the user deletes their messages. Obviously, any agency can open a phone and check the messaging apps for current items.

I agree we shouldn't put all our trust into anything online, via smart phones or not, and always act as though someone is listening.

They do store everything. This we all know.

originally posted by: bastion
I wouldn't put too much trust in any - Signal hads been hacked by US gov and used as evidence according to these court docs: Signal extraction and messages used as evidence

All telecommunications passwords and encryptions are tapped. The UK have had a black box style monitoring system that collects 12 Petabytes per day for most countries in the world. The US has access to this and the UK has access to the US system.

Pretty sure the US name for their system is a not to subtly hint that they're using red and blue light in fibre-optic cables to create an 'event horizon' so it can be tapped in parralel but prevent the message scrambling/provider/people communicating from being able to tell any interception happened.

EDIT: It's a godsend for work talk and general low-mid level sensitivity business/finance but I'd advise against anything too sensitive as the government and intel services provide major companies with as much insider info/corporate espionage as possible as profit employment levels and the economy are a major part of National Security.

In that link it says that they had no access to Signal outside of the phone itself. They have no ability to hack into Signal to retrieve the texts because of the encryption. They retrieved the texts via the phone itself. Signal wont hand over anything, as it does not have record of anything.



Obviously, make of that as you will. You can only trust 'them' so much.

Wasnt Signal created by the original creators of whats app?

I havent had any issues with signal so far and as long as they maintain a stance like this Ill keep using it with family.

originally posted by: projectvxn
I require most of my contacts to use Signal if we're discussing anything sensitive. If they refuse to use Signal I don't contact them.

Security and privacy is a primary concern for me.

Same here

Even downloaded some sort of firewall app to block regular old text messages. have not figured out how to block non-Signal calls just yet

i was late, already pointed out that they had his phone or they wouldn't read sh.t.

a reply to: havok

Ahh cheers, hadn't seen that the guy was storing them on the cloud - was more distracted by the huge ammounts of weapons involved. That's ridiculously stupid of them and defeats the whole point of encryption. I've no issue with LEO using it to track gangs, pedos or similar pondlife but it has been abused to spy on journalists and to track down sources/whistleblowers.

I'm loosely involved in an org who have safe houses for battered wives of big time UK gangsters where the women can't go to police or women's refuges as the people involved are too well connected with police.

The response from Signal is fantastic and what far more companies need to be doing but end-to-end encryption has a fatal flaw where you add an extra 'end' and that recieves all the raw unencrypted data - the UK certainly has passive monitoring of this, I'm not sure about the US but they can get UK data and US law enforcement have the abiliity to secretly add themselves to conversations in such apps to monitor them.

The best way to do non face-to-face secure comms is have a pre-agreed post recieving filter/decryptor from A to B- i.especific polartsation,wavelength of light or sequence of equations required to process the data in order to stop or detect or prevent analogue, digital and quantum snooping - though using such methods is likely to attract far more attention and be far more time consuming then just using gmail or similar.

EDIT: Businesses and members of the public can gain access to SS7 and recieve targetted real-time spying on a phone users location and raw data for a small fee via private intelligence firms located in areas like the Channel Islands. IIRC Mossad use Rayzone's GeoMatrix software to spy on individuals/heads of state in other countries Link to GeoMatrix product page

Intelligent folks use one time pad ciphers and predistribute the code books long before they’d be needed.

In addition to their robust security features, it’s a great way to waste intelligence agencies time and resources. They are vast but limited.

Mass use of OTP is just another way to neuter and leash intelligence community dogs.