Are humans just organic combustible engines?

Everything with an engine requires the same stuff to make it run efficiently.
And the comparisons to the human body are very similar.

An engine needs fuel, like a human needs food.

An engine needs water/coolant like a human need h2o.

An engine needs to breathe, air comes in, air goes out though an exhaust. Engines have filters to help clean the incoming o2 and humans have lungs and tiny cilia that filter the o2 as well.

Oil can be the blood of an engine

All the hoses on an engine that transport the oil and gas function the same as veins and arteries.


Our waste from food goes in the toilet. While an engines waste is let out through an exhaust.

Electricity....engines need a battery and alternator , humans are electrically charged as well.

It seems there is a clear blue print needed to create something that can power on. You cannot have something functioning without those basic necessities.

I dont know where I am going with this, but it seem like humans were created by a designer using these basic necessities

Any thought?

a reply to: Bloodworth

I have always used your example as a counter argument of why it wouldn’t make sense to argue that humanity was created by a higher race.

Why would create something so energy inefficient?

The only argument that I come think of is that if we were designed by a higher race the intent was for us to be easily discarded. A slave race easily replaceable.

a reply to: Bloodworth

Yes , and they are Very Depressed about it . The " Inner Man " Cries Out for Some Form of Salvation , but to No Avail......

a reply to: Bloodworth

Okay, but why would you give what is essentially a machine any degree of self awareness or "consciousness" and the capacity to feel fear, or grief, or desire? What is the point of a mind or a soul inside of an engine?

originally posted by: Bunch
a reply to: Bloodworth

I have always used your example as a counter argument of why it wouldn’t make sense to argue that humanity was created by a higher race.

Why would create something so energy inefficient?

The only argument that I come think of is that if we were designed by a higher race the intent was for us to be easily discarded. A slave race easily replaceable.

You are actually wrong, the body is created beautifully and elegantly, we see it's flaws but they are there for a reason, we have intellect and that see's our flaws and thinks it can do better but a perfect form would NEVER have to do better, no art, no philosophy, no science, no inventive creativeness and no adaptation.

Sometimes perfection is hidden by imperfection and we judge both wrongly, our body's are a temporary state but one that has value.

Think of us as star seeds, we are the children or rather the seed that will if we ever stop the virus of anti humanism and population culling lunatics from ever having there way go out beyond our world and colonise not only other worlds but space itself spreading the intricate web of our ecosystem onto a billion dead worlds bringing them to life and each becoming a new earth perhaps some day to also send out it's star seed's.

We are not yet ready, the earth is not yet ripe and we need to reach a level of technological, philosophical and population to begin a great expansion of our race, as long as we kill our own, limit our population and blame bad use of our resources on people instead of corporations however our world may very well fail.

Unless our world seed's the stars it may as well have never been for even if it was able to sustain life for another two billion years which it actually might not be since there may be as few as five or six hundred million years left before it becomes another Venus through the slow but incessant natural aging and heating up of our star a G2 star already - at least - half way through it's life cycle and unless SHE sends her children into the heaven's returning the gift of panspermia carried by it's true carrier SENTIENT space faring life then her entire existence was in vain and non shall remember our once beautiful world with only the fading and attenuating signals from her short lived technological civilizations to say she ever existed.

So I believe sentient life is a given, we were created not by accident but by design and that design may be as old as life within the universe itself, we are the seed that is meant to take this life as others may once have brought it here to other worlds and to sow new Eden's upon them not only to save our earth on a billion other worlds but to honour our unseen father from whom we all stem and for whom our body is an elegant self adapting tool that some think inelegant and a failure but that is actually a wonderful marvel created to drive the development of our inventive intelligence and given need's that we need to fight or feed, longings for the impossible and all toward that one goal regardless of if we make it not, to reach other worlds and to create a billion new Eden's perhaps even in space itself or on artificial worlds around distant stars.

We do not hear the music because we are only a tiny part of the chorus that is beyond our personal perception.

You speak from a deep loneliness but in fact you are not alone, I am not saying you have not friends or family because you most likely have very good ones but because you seem to have turned away from peering into the unknown as if it scares you or you are angry with the incomprehensible being that may be your creator.

I put it to you that the very creator of whom I speak came to you as just a man, he suffered for you and shared your mortality and your frailty to the point of death to show you there is more than this, he wants us ALL to see his finished work and we all have more work to do, if not in this lifetime then in the greater creation.

But believe as you shall.


Humans were never made to live underground but all around the world people do, people live under water onboard submarines, they live in the air aboard aircraft though we have neither wings nor gill's, we have mind.

We are NOT God yet we are proof that an intelligent mind can and will create, why then are some of us so in denial of the possibility that somewhere, somehow there are others like us perhaps far more advanced and far ahead of us and indeed that they may have played a very important role in our own existence to the point of even creating us along with all our flaws because they are NOT flaws they are drives.

We can convert the life of this world into energy and the life of this world convert's energy back into life, we are not just our body's but part of a much more complex and immense interplay of life that recycles the material of the earth and uses chemical reaction and light to convert energy and express it in a vast array of living form's.

And yet we have those among us that think this is by accident or just random happenstance chance, that a primordial pool of filthy chemicals got up and put on a cell wall someday and decided to replicate itself and then decided it was lonely so got together with others and formed multi celled organisms except this goes against the law of conservation of energy so it did not happen like that, it required intelligent design.

If the universe was infinite then yes somewhere somehow it not only could happen but would definitely happen BUT we think the universe is NOT infinite and in a finite structure the odd's against it happening by chance are beyond astronomical.

a reply to: LABTECH767

Think of us as star seeds, we are the children or rather the seed that will if we ever stop the virus of anti humanism and population culling lunatics from ever having there way go out beyond our world and colonise not only other worlds but space itself spreading the intricate web of our ecosystem onto a billion dead worlds bringing them to life and each becoming a new earth perhaps some day to also send out it's star seed's.

What you just described is called a virus. Spreading out across the galaxy infecting hundreds of worlds and turning them into copies of our own, populated with thousands of people just like ours so that we can consume their resources and repeat the entire process all over again. Yikes.

a reply to: TzarChasm

No it's called a flowering, a virus is a non living strand of genetic material in a protein shell, it has NO life of it's own and can only multiply by infecting LIVING cell's.

What I am talking about is humanity spreading out and becoming the gardeners of a billion worlds that have NO life until we give life to them.

That is NOT a virus sorry your definition need's some work.

IF we invaded and stole worlds that were already alive we WOULD be a virus.

But even then remember not all virus are bad and what if the meeting of one sentient race with another gave rise to a new sentient race as they bridged there differences and sought together to bring life to the universe, light to the darkness and song to the empty silence.

And as for your fear of us consuming the universe it merely a change of state of energy it is not consumed it is changed each change is merely the step toward another change.

What you would prefer is that we NOT find those barren worlds and leave them to never wake from there sleep, to leave them as dead body's orbiting a thousand lonely stars and that is endlessly bleak.

a reply to: LABTECH767

You mean harvesting life from the world we exploited and abused so we can repeat the process on another world because we failed to sustain the one we already had. I think we should stay on this rock until we learn our lessons before we acquire another habitable world to transform into a dumpster fire.

originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: Bloodworth

What is the point of a mind or a soul inside of an engine?

A car gets you from point A to point B because of its engine. Same thing with the soul and our body engine

a reply to: TzarChasm

We as are NOT yet ready I agree, I said the earth is not yet ripe, it is not yet time.

By then hopefully we will have learned from our mistakes and shaken off the same elite that have perpetrated this destruction through there own greed at worst or represent the worst of us and merely rode the wave of humanity's greed at best.

But I believe there is hope for the human race.

The earth is not a dumpster fire except were we have put those dumpsters and set fire to them, by then perhaps we will have learned our lessons, learned to not only live with nature but to enhance it a state of civilization that could actually sustain more than ten times the current number of people on the planet, we only think it is crowded because we congregate together in community's, city's, towns and before that villages.

The earth if properly managed could sustain both far more vast numbers of humanity and life, imagine city's with ecologically friendly sources of power, skyscrapers not built to house offices and bank's but vertical farms and even nature reserves, imagine something like an Eifel tower but built stronger and more elegantly and on a scale we have not yet built out of advanced materials with deck's that were angled to catch as much day light as possible and also supplemented by artificial lighting that followed the natural cycle of the day night, each deck home to a forest, savannah, prairie's for nature, fish farms in the sky and in the sea at the lowest leg's of the structure, many of them in harmony with the sea not polluting it but keeping it alive, decks with town's, city's and farm's, people.

Gossamer like threads joining them made from strong materials that allow people to travel between them.

Harvesting the very movement of the waves for energy and in so doing actually stabilising our moon's orbit and slowing it's recession from the earth by creating more drag upon it's tidal affect upon the oceans by harnessing all that energy to run such a civilization.

There is no such thing as it can not be done, we just need to work together as a race and recognise we are NOT apart from all other life but both meant to be it's custodians and it's guardians and as I suggest also far more.

I guess I have a much more down to earth view about human beings.

Everything we eat gets processed by bacteria in the gut, right? And what do those bacteria excrete when processing our "food"?

Yeah, our bodies live off of bacteria crap. Lovely picture, isn't it?

a reply to: LABTECH767

Far more than guardians or custodians? What does that mean?

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: Bloodworth

What is the point of a mind or a soul inside of an engine?

A car gets you from point A to point B because of its engine. Same thing with the soul and our body engine

Do you remember having a body/vehicle before the life you are in right now? What did that look like? Were you a bad kitty and got reincarnated as a human?

originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: Bloodworth

Okay, but why would you give what is essentially a machine any degree of self awareness or "consciousness" and the capacity to feel fear, or grief, or desire? What is the point of a mind or a soul inside of an engine?

Only those with the power to create things with organic material like humans know why

How far are humans off from programming such robots?

originally posted by: Bunch
a reply to: Bloodworth

I have always used your example as a counter argument of why it wouldn’t make sense to argue that humanity was created by a higher race.

Why would create something so energy inefficient?

The only argument that I come think of is that if we were designed by a higher race the intent was for us to be easily discarded. A slave race easily replaceable.

Energy inefficient?

Humans on average have a decent lasting battery.

originally posted by: Bloodworth

originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: Bloodworth

Okay, but why would you give what is essentially a machine any degree of self awareness or "consciousness" and the capacity to feel fear, or grief, or desire? What is the point of a mind or a soul inside of an engine?

Only those with the power to create things with organic material like humans know why

How far are humans off from programming such robots?

We don't need those kind of robots because they essentially translate to slaves. Robots who possess consciousness, perhaps even human equivalent sentience, deserve human equivalent rights and human equivalent freedom. They are no longer robots they are people. That's why you don't give consciousness to a machine like a combustible engine.

It ones of those questions, of is it art imitating life, or life imitating art, with a pinch of truth being way more stranger then fiction. Nature usually has the best answers, just never gives the solutions.

It something I pondered about a few times, since where bio-electrical, mineralized mechanical machines with fragile hardware. Made up of trillion different parts like it was a solid-state something with the best OS, where as machines as we know are tenacious an robust where we even made up The Man of Steel.

Heck, even insects seem robotic with their exoskeleton, and if human size would do some incredible feats the rest of the animal kingdom couldn't do. A human sized Hercules Beetles is estimated to lift 60 tonnes(2000lbs per ton).

a reply to: Bloodworth

Everything with an engine requires the same stuff to make it run efficiently.

I dont know where I am going with this, but it seem like humans were created by a designer using these basic necessities

Yes , you are on the right track.
The human body is "the lesson" ,so to speak.
What we create ,(engine ) is also the lesson.

Balance: Unbalanced people fall and get hurt.
Unbalanced engines vibrate badly.
Lesson: Things that aren't balanced don't work too well
or last too long.

Harmony : All the engine parts are designed to work together .
All of your body parts are designed to work together.
Lesson: Working together is a good thing. "Bad parts" must be
healed (fixed ) or replaced.

Also , we are the five elements incarnate:

1. Wood : Fingernails and hair . (Not really cellulose like real
wood , but the best we can do.)
And they never stop growing (Like trees)
2. Earth: That would be our poo poo.

3. Metal: Iron in our blood , and cacium in our bones.
( Yes , calcium is considered a metal)
4. Fire:
Metabolism , Qi master starting fire, and those
poor souls who have spontaneously combusted .
(No, smoking DOES NOT count) but I
I guess we could thrown in being "hot and
bothered " due to hormones or menopause.

5:Water: The ol' Blood ,sweat and tears, urine, spit.

a reply to: TzarChasm

What is the point of a mind or a soul inside of an engine?

For the engine to be aware of its limited existence such that it feels compelled to replicate. That's why.

originally posted by: TzarChasm

originally posted by: Bloodworth

originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: Bloodworth

Okay, but why would you give what is essentially a machine any degree of self awareness or "consciousness" and the capacity to feel fear, or grief, or desire? What is the point of a mind or a soul inside of an engine?

Only those with the power to create things with organic material like humans know why

How far are humans off from programming such robots?

We don't need those kind of robots because they essentially translate to slaves. Robots who possess consciousness, perhaps even human equivalent sentience, deserve human equivalent rights and human equivalent freedom. They are no longer robots they are people. That's why you don't give consciousness to a machine like a combustible engine.

I agree we dont need those kinds of robots, but that doesnt stop science from attaining it.

Even with a conscious they are still robots that can be turned on or off and their conscious level can be adjusted.

You can program a robot to laugh when its leaking oil/blood and about to die. Or you can program a robot to cry when losing oil which would be more life like and create a bigger impact.

a reply to: Bloodworth

Yep -- fuel in, waste out.

Pretty much anything organic does this, animals, bugs, even plants produce waste via their dropped material. We're not special for it.