Thank You Germany & France...for the knife in the back!

Originally posted by LA_Maximus
The EU needs to make a choice....China or America.

I really would like to say something about everything else you said, but really have to go to bed now. Only this: I don't think there's much of a choice for all of us. China is the third-biggest nuclear power already since a very long time. The technology may be old and Russian, but that doesn't make it any less dangerous. In my view, there is (politically) only one solution: not to p. them off and try to be most diplomatic. To try to fight them would be suicide, new wepons or not. We have to avoid a new cold war and, of course, a hot war with the Chinese. So we (of course not we but our representatives) have to think real hard this time - unlike they do normally, to avoid a planetary crisis of unseen dimensions. Best would be America too would declare China as an untouchable political entity (of whatever kind) and we both should never try to push them in any direction we want, but try to draw them back if they are going too far - carefully. There are progressive people in China too, much more spiritual as in the West anyway, and if the time is right, they will overcome the today's system there. No need to intervene, you only reach the opposite. It's a fault of Western thinking: we want everything now. But history takes time. And to be honest with you: I hate my people doing this - trying to sell weapons to the Chinese, mostly because of the disobedience of human rights over there and because of the Chinese occupation of Tibet. But as I said some pages before, it's all about business, and our politicians are puppets of the industry like anywhere else. So normal people have to think for themselves. We as humans - country lovers or not - should always consider human life as the most valuable thing in the world, therefore we should act careful not to hurt or even kill other people. If this is recognized one day by every country and every belief in the world, this planet would be a better place. In every day life, we can do something, not change world politics maybe, but try to live more peacefully and make our own decisions. After all, this is the Christian way and normally the way of any other religion, even Islam, though you can't see it clearly today. But - other topic and I really have to go now.

America is the Greatest nation on God's Green Earth and Im not ashamed to say it.

**a minor warning - i'm tired and cranky don't take this too seriously but the general tone of this should be accurate**

What a gigantic load of complete and utter nonsense. Infact i don't think it could get any bigger, actually, as Stewie Griffin said, 'Oh my god he's got so big he's collapsed in on himself'. To proclaim your 'nation' (a nebulous idea at best) the greatest in the world because 'God said so' is ridiculous. And don't say it was opinion, if it was you should have said so, you stated it as fact, which it quite clearly isn't.

What i can't seem to understand about this thread is that, as a few people have been pointing out, Europe has been selling weapons to China even while the embargo was in place but some people choose to ignore this. They will also happily ignore the fact that America also sells weapons to China, infact twice as much as Europe. Also the embargo was only part of an overall 'scheme' (in the real sense not the pinky and the brain sense) there was also a Code of Conduct, which will still be in place even if the embargo is lifted (which it hasn't and mightn't be for a while).
The idea that Europe would sell high tech weaponary to China is a nonsense, what do you think European leaders are? brain dead? (maybe i shouldn't ask that question...).

[/rant]...

Originally posted by new_falcon_XXI

Originally posted by Ryanp5555
Perfection is something that we will not achieved through our own(mans) actions.

Very true, speaking of all today's people. But still I think your founding fathers had something greater in mind, some kind of society not even close to what you can see all over the world in present times. That's the dream I'm talking about. The promise (in this case) is not: you give it, you fullfill it, but the dream behind, which every human being craving for freedom dreamt of. It was only written by Americans, nobody says you have to bring it. The disappointment is, not even in America most of the people can live this dream but think they do, because "they" say so. (feel free to change "they" with government, media, companies, school or whatever comes to your mind)

I am not going to argue that. I believe that this countries fore fathers would be a little sickened with the greed and such that has taken place here. I am too. But, I don't think that the world should hate us because of this. Everyone gets caught up in something, such is the err of man.

To the rhetorical question asker, find me one person who would rather live in such oppression and poverty, and someone who knows what they are talking about not for the basis of debate or religious belief someone who has experienced both, than in the United States and I will say I was wrong. Until you do so, don't bother asking such a dumb question, because as you do know that question was pretty f'n dumb.

Dear all,

The founding fathers of the US knew that countries are always imperfect and should never believe they are finished.

How do I know this?

Look at the pyramid on a dollar bill.

Cheers

BHR

Originally posted by LA_Maximus
Thank You Germany & France...for the knife in the back!

What? A knife in the back? We Germans and the French never promised that we will support you in Iraq.

Originally posted by LA_Maximus
Thank You Germany...we protected you for generations and this is how you repay America?

Rubbish. You never protected us Germans. If you did tell me when.

Originally posted by LA_Maximus
Thank You France....our boys bled to death on the beaches of Normandy and this is your gratitude?

Their soldiers were dying for the liberty of the US in the 18th century.

Originally posted by LA_Maximus
Un-employment is high in Germany and France

In Germany unemployment is high (around 10%) because of our Economy&Labour minister Wolfgang Clement and because of Poland. I don't know how is it in France.

Originally posted by LA_Maximus
and their socialist systems can't compete with the free market.....

In Germany and France there aren't any socialist systems.

Originally posted by AtheiX
In Germany and France there aren't any socialist systems.

hmm, my carte d'assurance maladie says otherwise.

What the american policymakers need to understand once and for all is that nobody on this planet wants a corrupt world policeman. We simply don't need it. Chinese, Russian, French, Germans, Belgians, Spanish, Italians, British, Africans, South-Americans, Indonesians, Indians, Pakistanis, Iranians, Iraqis, Palestinians, Koreans, nobody wants or needs the US. We have no problems amongst ourselves, the problems are created by the United States who doesnt want the world to unite, because it might not serve the maximization of their financial institutions profits, and who instead wants to export their ideology of greed and their lies. Two or three more years of international rowdyism, and we'll all be allied against you. (In fact we already are) Now if you stopped your thuggishness and tried to think instead of killing people that don't submit to you, that would be a first step towards reinsertion of the US into western civilization. Nobody will support your crazy subintelligent politicians, so quit complaining about lack of international support for your homicidal mania. Get a different system instead, one in which greed is not the top deity, and in which the journalists don't need to lie to you every day.


[edit on 23-5-2005 by Moretti]

Moretti,

I think what the world actually needs is a USA that acts responsibly and treats others as equals and with respect.

We need a USA that abides by international law.
A USA that honours its treaty commitments.
A USA that does not illegally interfere in other country's internal political processes.

Cheers

BHR

Originally posted by Infamous Zordak9

Originally posted by AtheiX
In Germany and France there aren't any socialist systems.

hmm, my carte d'assurance maladie says otherwise.

actualy i think the states is amonst the few countries that dosn't have some sort of medicare for all it's citisens, at least of the richer countries.

Originally posted by drogo

Originally posted by Infamous Zordak9

Originally posted by AtheiX
In Germany and France there aren't any socialist systems.

hmm, my carte d'assurance maladie says otherwise.

actualy i think the states is amonst the few countries that dosn't have some sort of medicare for all it's citisens, at least of the richer countries.

Its funny then that Cuba, can have free and compolsory education, free and universal health care, and turn out more doctors per capita than any other country... They even offered to educate 300 poor latinos from America - COMPLETELY FREE OF CHARGE, but the US turned them down...

Venezuela is catching up fast aswell - And these are tiny third world countries - WHY CANT THE US DO THE SAME?

Regardless of what some people feel about Castro and Chavez, it is impossible to deny that the Cuban people have freedoms that the US does not...

GhostSoldier,

The continued treatment of Cuba by the US is just one of many blights on the character of the nation.

It is something every American should be ashamed of.

Cheers

BHR

why will america and chine fight??? and what weapons do germany and france have??????

Seems to me the Yanks are concerned about trade rather than security and don't want Europe to benefit from a large market.

As we see with the Gallileo satellite system the US just can't understand that they don't run the world, that other countries may want to do things differently, and that 'yoo-es-ayy' may not have all the answers

No reason at all why we shouldn't arm China - the world would better with 2 superpowers and the EU should do it just on principle to demonstrate the fact we have freedom of action and we don't need George or Condy's permission.

I know the US can boss Brazil, Mexico etc etc about and make them comply - the EU's a much bigger & tougher proposition. Even with all the WTO etc cards stacked in your favour you haven't stopped Airbus sticking it to Boeing.

Originally posted by Moretti
What the american policymakers need to understand once and for all is that nobody on this planet wants a corrupt world policeman. We simply don't need it. Chinese, Russian, French, Germans, Belgians, Spanish, Italians, British, Africans, South-Americans, Indonesians, Indians, Pakistanis, Iranians, Iraqis, Palestinians, Koreans, nobody wants or needs the US. We have no problems amongst ourselves, the problems are created by the United States who doesnt want the world to unite, because it might not serve the maximization of their financial institutions profits, and who instead wants to export their ideology of greed and their lies. Two or three more years of international rowdyism, and we'll all be allied against you. (In fact we already are) Now if you stopped your thuggishness and tried to think instead of killing people that don't submit to you, that would be a first step towards reinsertion of the US into western civilization. Nobody will support your crazy subintelligent politicians, so quit complaining about lack of international support for your homicidal mania. Get a different system instead, one in which greed is not the top deity, and in which the journalists don't need to lie to you every day.

BRAVO! It's a pity we don't have many people like you in our country.