Alright. How about this reason as to why someone might take the vax:

a reply to: Hamburgler

Sounds like you were coerced into taking the shot?

I will never take it. It makes no sense to me. I have a functioning immune system.. I have no comorbidities. If prefer to take my chances in the control group and deal with it naturally.

originally posted by: Hamburgler

I suppose I just don’t see taking a stand against the vax as being all that productive.

I don't see the point in promoting the vaccines at this point either. I don't believe there is a significant number of people who are "on the fence." The people who wanted it already have it. The people who didn't want it before aren't going to change their minds over doughnuts or lottery tickets. So who is trying to convince who? It's not like people who have taken the shots can stick a needle in their arms and suck it out if they change their minds.

The tactics are steadily progressing away from the "carrot" to the "stick." If people won't be persuaded by TV doctors, politicians, celebrities, or peer pressure, then it's time for them to move on to punishing people for not taking the vaccines. Take away their ability to work, travel, socialize, shop, etc.

I think we can all see where this is going. Eventually, governments will have to take away the right of the people to choose. For their own good, of course.

Reasons to take any vaccine? The risk of death or permanent harm from a disease greatly outweighs the risk of injury from the vaccine, and the vaccine is proven to have a high degree of efficacy. I don't believe that's the case for me. I don't have any of comorbididy issues associated with 85% of COVID-19 deaths and I've already survived it and so according to multiple studies I'm less likely to get it again than even fully vaccinated individuals. When one of the protien subunit vaccines like Novavax is approved I'll probably get one.

MRNA vaccines I strongly suspect will be shown to contribute to an increase in autoimmune diseases such as MS, psoriasis, Rheumatoid arthritis, lupus, Guillain-Barre syndrome (which we've seen associated with mRNA already) Chronic inflammatory demyelinating polyneuropathy, etc. Training an already overactive immune system to attack something your body produced is a monumentally dumb idea, especially since it doesn't even come close to 100% efficacy. Dying from the cure sounds goth as hell, it's just not for me.

originally posted by: Sparkymedic
a reply to: Hamburgler

Sounds like you were coerced into taking the shot?

I will never take it. It makes no sense to me. I have a functioning immune system.. I have no comorbidities. If prefer to take my chances in the control group and deal with it naturally.

Coerced is a bit strong/hyperbolic. It was a choice when weighing a number of trade offs.

I don’t take any pharmaceutical medication unless it’s 100% necessary - and I haven’t got a flu shot in years - so going from that to the mRNA shot gave me pause. I have had all of my “normal” vaccinations growing up as have all of my children. I simply prefer more natural means of healing, typically.

Do I think I would have probably been fine without the vax? Yeah, probably. But, I’m fine with the vax too and don’t have to worry about restrictions, older family members, my employer, etc.

Right or wrong, I suspect life will get harder for those who are unvaccinated by choice in the coming months. I don’t support that being the case but I can already see that, fact-based, it’s happening. When I weight the very small potential of complications (basis points compared to shots administered), the lack of restrictions it provides me and the comfort it gives to some people who are close/important to me… I got the shot.

a reply to: canucks555

My problem with this position is that, if it was a bioweapon, then the same agencies and mechanisms used to create the weapon are the ones who created the "vaccine" against the weapon.

Not a fan of trusting anyone who plays both sides.

originally posted by: VictorVonDoom

originally posted by: Hamburgler

I suppose I just don’t see taking a stand against the vax as being all that productive.

I don't see the point in promoting the vaccines at this point either. I don't believe there is a significant number of people who are "on the fence." The people who wanted it already have it. The people who didn't want it before aren't going to change their minds over doughnuts or lottery tickets. So who is trying to convince who? It's not like people who have taken the shots can stick a needle in their arms and suck it out if they change their minds.

The tactics are steadily progressing away from the "carrot" to the "stick." If people won't be persuaded by TV doctors, politicians, celebrities, or peer pressure, then it's time for them to move on to punishing people for not taking the vaccines. Take away their ability to work, travel, socialize, shop, etc.

I think we can all see where this is going. Eventually, governments will have to take away the right of the people to choose. For their own good, of course.

I agree. I’d say the low hanging fruit as far as people who will get vaccinated has been picked - jumping the shark with incentives doesn’t really help.

In so far as the labeling/outcasting of the unvaccinated, I’m not on board with that. I weighed my options and got the shot. Others weigh options on their own scales and make their own decisions. Plus, If you’re vaccinated, why would you care if someone isn’t (assuming the vax works as advertised)?

I could put my “alternate theory” hat on and say the vax has another purpose. I tend to agree with that, frankly, but I don’t think it’s for the purpose some fear. The populations with high vaccine adoption are ones you don’t want to eliminate if you’re a politician.

Unless the vax is to turn the compliant into corpses to cut the population in half and subsequently take out the balance - which I view is extremely, extremely unlikely - the shot is likely safe for most.

Said another way, I suspect those of us who got the jab(s) somehow benefit more than those who don’t - but I also think COVID has some more potentially sinister/deadly elements to it that many people ignore because, well, it frankly is pretty much like the flu for most people.

a reply to: Hamburgler

I can't think of a theory to explain this whole Covid / Vaccine thing that I would put money on, but I'm convinced things are not as advertised. There is an old truism that has saved me a lot of money and grief in life: Nobody has to track you down to give you a good deal.

If the Covid was as deadly and the vaccine was as great as we're being told, we wouldn't be getting the hard sell and the take it or else approach. People would be lining up like it was the Black Friday launch of a new video game system.

The only non crazy thing I've considered for the US and it's overly hard vaccine push is what will happen with international travel.

What would happen if the US was blacklisted for not having covid 19 under control?

Could it have a major effect on the economy?


a reply to: VictorVonDoom

a reply to: canucks555

Many people are reluctant to take a vaccine(s) because they'ves only been tested and rolled out for around a year. Which is not very long as far as vaccines go. That's the biggest reason I believe people don't want it, because that's definitely a concern.

I don't know why people insist that mRNA vaccines have only been around about a year. Recombinant vaccines have been studied for over 20 years. Here's a link to a patent that was issued in 2003. There are many others as well.

The present invention describes the assembly of recombinant transmissible virus and replicons that express heterologous genes which can be used to make vaccines against homologous and heterologous pathogens (Agapov, et al. (1998) Proc. Natl. Acad. Sci. USA 95:12989-12994; Balasuriya, et al. (2000)

patft.uspto.gov.../7279 327&RS=PN/7279327

I personally am not in the mandatory vax corner. I think people should be able to make up their own minds - but also take responsibility for the outcomes.

The amount of disinformation circulating about the vaccine is huge. The majority of people won't even bother to research an article as long as it agrees with their agenda. That's the arrogance of ignorance.

mRNA technology is the wave of the future for many diseases including cancer and heart disease. I doubt anyone with life-threatening cancer would turn down a treatment just because it was based on mRNA technology.

In any case, do your homework. You'll be glad you did.

a reply to: canucks555

Another factor that I don't hear much about, is smoking. I am under the impression, that they have made out a little better than average when it comes to getting infected. It wouldn't surprise me if they were more patient when considering their options...

a reply to: Phantom423

I haven't heard many people claim mRNA technology has only been around for a year.

In fact, the main argument against the mRNA vaccine is that it hasn't been approved in 20 years of research, because it could never pass animal trials...

Which is why we call those people who get the mRNA vaccine "guinea pigs."

That's a pretty major issue you're ignoring when you show a patent from 20 years ago.

originally posted by: canucks555
Many people are reluctant to take a vaccine(s) because they'ves only been tested and rolled out for around a year. Which is not very long as far as vaccines go. That's the biggest reason I believe people don't want it, because that's definitely a concern. It's scary to think what would happen if things went sideways..I understand that. Especially with kids and pregnant women.
But you know what else is (1000 times) scarier to me?
The possibility that this thing came out of a bio-lab. Wuhan.

If that were proven, that this thing is a weapon, then I personally have to protect myself from that.
The whole God made my body and this is just a type of flu philosophy goes out the window when you're dealing with a possible man-made weapon. Intentionally released or not.
If you think about it like that, like the virus isn't natural, then you feel as though you might not want to be subjected to a disease not made by nature, but by scientists in a lab, then that should raise some concerns.
Unless you believe that there is some kind of world de population agenda (which to me doesn't make sense as the deep state need boots on the ground to make money) -then I can't see any reason that our own governments would try to intentionally harm us with a vaccine.
They need us around.
I don't want to be exposed to a (possible) bio weapon. Ever.
I think that if it was proven that this thing is just that, then more people would be getting vacced.


* yes the vaccines are man made as well. I realize that. But we have to fight back if Covid is lab made.

So you want a Chinese made bioweapon in you? or a vacc that's designed to fight that weapon?

I had covid and it forced me to change my diet, exercise more, cut down on red meat, eat more vegetables, and get in the best shape of my life. I feel healthier now than before I had covid because I was a habitual drinker. It was a wake up call to prioritize my health and fitness. If the government really wants to save people, they should mandate gym memberships and ban all GMO's and hormones and shut down all those farms that violates these laws. Except, politicians are routinely bribed by big agriculture to turn a blind eye. Investigative reporters are routinely silenced for trying to expose the real toxic food epidemic.

So the very same politicians and lawmakers who allow farmers to put toxic chemicals into our food systems are now suddenly trying to mandate vaccines for the "greater health?" Pullllllease.

a reply to: canucks555

hey remember we were never free to determine what we can and cant put into our own bodies

we couldnt party mary jane , we couldnt party with albert hoffmann, we couldnt speak to machine elves in hyper space , we couldnt chat with the great goddess mushroom

yet they are telling us to go ahead and inject this # into our bodies at the drop of a hat.

No thanks , Ill put what I want into my body regardless of who says I can or cant.
and no one else decides that for me.

we were never free , and we certainly arent now, but we are free to say # YOU.

the only way they win is if we all obey

Gene Sharp - civil disobedience , from dictatorship to democracy

they only have power over us if we freely give it to them by bending the knee

a reply to: rounda

You're wrong:

Are the COVID-19 vaccines rigorously tested?

Yes. Clinical trials are evaluating investigational COVID-19 vaccines in tens of thousands of study participants to generate the scientific data and other information needed by FDA to determine safety and effectiveness. These clinical trials are being conducted according to the rigorous standards set forth by the FDA.

Initially, in phase 1, the vaccine is given to a small number of generally healthy people to assess its safety at increasing doses and to gain early information about how well the vaccine works to induce an immune response in people. In the absence of safety concerns from phase 1 studies, phase 2 studies include more people, where various dosages are tested on hundreds of people with typically varying health statuses and from different demographic groups, in randomized-controlled studies. These studies provide additional safety information on common short-term side effects and risks, examine the relationship between the dose administered and the immune response, and may provide initial information regarding the effectiveness of the vaccine. In phase 3, the vaccine is generally administered to thousands of people in randomized, controlled studies involving broad demographic groups (i.e., the population intended for use of the vaccine) and generates critical information on effectiveness and additional important safety data. This phase provides additional information about the immune response in people who receive the vaccine compared to those who receive a control, such as a placebo.

www.fda.gov...

Animal studies were successfully done years ago.

I’ve said this 100 times. When the vaccine funding comes from someone that has talked about reducing the world population for the better part of his adulthood, we have an issue.

a reply to: Phantom423

What animal studies were successfully done years ago?

How is that possible without the novel virus?

Was it the challenge studies where all the ferrets died? Or all the cats?

Maybe you’re referring to Kuba et al injecting SARS1 spike into mice? That was a success i. Showing that the spike is the cause of covid. It was a success to the eugenicists running the show for their grand vision of humanity.

Good lawd

originally posted by: zardust
a reply to: Phantom423

What animal studies were successfully done years ago?

How is that possible without the novel virus?

Was it the challenge studies where all the ferrets died? Or all the cats?

Maybe you’re referring to Kuba et al injecting SARS1 spike into mice? That was a success i. Showing that the spike is the cause of covid. It was a success to the eugenicists running the show for their grand vision of humanity.

Good lawd

2009:

Immunize and disappear—Safety-optimized mRNA vaccination with a panel of 29 allergens

Conclusion
Immunization with mRNA induces TH1-biased immune responses similar to those elicited through DNA-based vaccination but additionally offers the advantage of a superior safety profile.

2008
Vaccination with Messenger RNA (mRNA)
www.sciencedirect.com...

2007
Long-term storage of DNA-free RNA for use in vaccine studies
www.future-science.com...

2012
Developing mRNA-vaccine technologies
www.tandfonline.com...

Had enough?

a reply to: canucks555

Why does it have to be a bioweapon?

Are smallpox, diptheria, cholera, influenza and bubonic plague bioweapons, or did mother nature cook all of them up all by herself before bio weapons labs were ever invented?

And if she did, why can't she be carrying on cooking things up?

Your thinking is flawed.