I think Fauci is pulling a "Bill Clinton" here.

Ron Paul asks Fauci directly, if there was any "gain of function" research funded by NIH.

www.youtube.com...

Fauci says he hasn't been lying when he says it is not true, but then he goes on to say

"You are implying that what we did was responsible for the deaths of individuals...." "I resent that".


I think later on, he is going to say he was responding to that implication, and not to the question itself.

Gain of function research was all but certainly happening in that lab. And probably funded by NIH. But Fauci will say he does/did not believe that research had caused the Corona outbreak, and so when he said again and again that Ron Paul was completely wrong, he was saying he was wrong that it had caused the outbreak. (But not wrong that it had happened.)

Quite a dance. Because no one can ever prove Fauci's state of mind.

a reply to: bloodymarvelous

Fascist Faucy state of mind is paid by big pharma and China, soo depending how much he gets that is how he feels.

Until people collectively quit paying taxes - it's no good bitching about anything funded in any way - by your government.

36% of everything earned in my household goes to such crap. But, you should see the personal arsenal I'm now responsible for.

Well that’s commendable Deplorable

a reply to: Deplorable

a reply to: bloodymarvelous

Of course he is. Let us follow the money:

Fauci is director of the NIAID:

en.wikipedia.org...

“ Anthony Stephen Fauci is an American physician-scientist and immunologist who serves as the director of the U.S. National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID) and the chief medical advisor to the president.”

Then here is the thing that makes you not wonder why The Moderna vaccine was pushed so hard:

www.niaid.nih.gov...

“ A Phase 1 clinical trial evaluating an investigational vaccine designed to protect against coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) has begun at Kaiser Permanente Washington Health Research Institute (KPWHRI) in Seattle. The National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID), part of the National Institutes of Health, is funding the trial. KPWHRI is part of NIAID’s Infectious Diseases Clinical Research Consortium.”

“ The vaccine is called mRNA-1273 and was developed by NIAID scientists and their collaborators at the biotechnology company Moderna, Inc., based in Cambridge, Massachusetts. ”

Close but no cigar. Sorry, couldn't resist with that thread title.

A couple of things here:

1) That was Rand, not Ron.

2) Rand did not ask "if there was any 'gain of function' research funded by NIH," he asked him if the NIH had funded GoF research in Wuhan.

It may seem like I'm splitting hairs here, but there IS a very important distinction. The NIH, from the studies I've read, did NOT actually fund any GoF research in Wuhan. The GoF research the NIH/NIAID funded was right here in the US.

***

Don't get me wrong -- I'm no fan of Fauci, but we should definitely characterize the situation(s) we expound upon accurately if we don't want people to call us conspiracy theorists, etc. I think this is vital for anyone that sees the writing on this COVID wall.
a reply to: bloodymarvelous

a reply to: bloodymarvelous

If we (collectively) really want to make Fauci tell the truth, we need to take away the tools he is using to obfuscate this discussion.

Gain of Function, and how the virus got out, are actually two separate discussions. As long as Fauci is allowed to make them appear to be the same he will slither away every time. Here are the facts and questions he needs to be responding to:

Fact #1: Gain of Function, in and of itself, didn't harm anyone. Only the intentional / unintentional release of the virus harmed people. However, GoF research is an important question to be answered because it should provide insight as to "WHY" the GoF research was being performed (i.e. weaponization, etc). So, was there GoF research knowingly being conducted in Wu Han? And, was this funding subsidized by the American taxpayer? And, was the POTUS aware of this? (Bush, Obama or Trump, doesn't matter).

Fact #2: How was the virus released from the lab in Wu Han? Stop with the bats and wet-markets story! That, or produce a single wild bat, captured in a wet market, which is infected with Covid-19. Stop the BS!

In other words, stop with all the techno-jargon. Just answer the goddamned questions! A simple yes, or no, is perfectly acceptable. Just don't be wrong, because if we find out you lied...you're going on a vacation to Guantanamo for the rest of your natural life (and then some). You will be granted immunity to answer these questions truthfully ONLY during this session, and only this ONE time! Choose your answer wisely.

That all depends on what the meaning of the word "is" is.

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

The problem is that the federal government demanded that everyone stop funding gain of function research in Wuhan, but Fauci was still funding them while they were continuing their gain of function research four years later. Fauci is trying to act like he didn't know they were continuing their gain of function research, even though their studies showed that they were.

Fauci wants to argue the definition of "gain of function" to protect himself and he's looking like a fool in the process.

a reply to: BatSars

It may seem like I'm splitting hairs here, but there IS a very important distinction. The NIH, from the studies I've read, did NOT actually fund any GoF research in Wuhan. The GoF research the NIH/NIAID funded was right here in the US.

Ever heard of money laundering ?
You provided a definition , right there .

a reply to: Deetermined

I get that. And, that's fine. That discussion needs to run it's course and the guilty need to get their nards run through the Cuisinart...slowly, one at a time, sack and all.

Just separate that discussion from the discussion about how Wu-Flu got out.

Otherwise, Fauci will get away. As long as he can keep the GoF discussion linked to the death discussion he can use the argument...he didn't cause the deaths. Separate the two arguments and he can't do that. That's my point. Make him answer the GoF questions first. THEN dive into the discussion of how the virus escaped.

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Fauci already knows that he will never be charged for actual deaths, and that point is irrelevant in the discussion between Rand and Fauci.

Fauci's worry is that he will get caught knowing and understanding that the Wuhan lab was continuing their gain of function research and he knowingly continued to fund it after the government demanded he stop.

Fauci telling Rand that he was wrong and didn't know what he was talking about all revolved around their definitions of what is truly considered gain of function research, not who was responsible for deaths. Fauci resenting Rand for accusing him if such a thing was just a side note to the real discussion taking place.

Faustian Fauci

a reply to: bloodymarvelous

originally posted by: BatSars
A couple of things here:

1) That was Rand, not Ron.

2) Rand did not ask "if there was any 'gain of function' research funded by NIH," he asked him if the NIH had funded GoF research in Wuhan.

It may seem like I'm splitting hairs here, but there IS a very important distinction. The NIH, from the studies I've read, did NOT actually fund any GoF research in Wuhan. The GoF research the NIH/NIAID funded was right here in the US.

***

Don't get me wrong -- I'm no fan of Fauci, but we should definitely characterize the situation(s) we expound upon accurately if we don't want people to call us conspiracy theorists, etc. I think this is vital for anyone that sees the writing on this COVID wall.
a reply to: bloodymarvelous

This reminds me of the arguments made by liberal toolbags in reference to Planned Parenthood… “none of the government funding ever goes toward abortion… it’s all just for check ups and women’s health blah blah blah”… sure it is…

Plain and simple without government funding Planned Parenthood dies a dishonorable racist death… same goes for the other genocide factory in China…

originally posted by: Gothmog
a reply to: BatSars

It may seem like I'm splitting hairs here, but there IS a very important distinction. The NIH, from the studies I've read, did NOT actually fund any GoF research in Wuhan. The GoF research the NIH/NIAID funded was right here in the US.

Ever heard of money laundering ?
You provided a definition , right there .

What if, the "government" gives ass loads of money to big pharma, and then big pharma donates ass loads of money to the democratic party? that might be like selling a painting that looks like a homeless crack head made by puking on a canvas, and selling it to foreign nationals for $500K. Yea, now that I think about it, that's a crazy thought. never happen.

originally posted by: Deplorable
Until people collectively quit paying taxes - it's no good bitching about anything funded in any way - by your government.

36% of everything earned in my household goes to such crap. But, you should see the personal arsenal I'm now responsible for.

Conveniently, isnt the Xiden admin beefing up the IRS hiring hundreds more agents?

Hope you dont get an inconvenient knock on your door, with you chest thumping.

originally posted by: BatSars
A couple of things here:

1) That was Rand, not Ron.

2) Rand did not ask "if there was any 'gain of function' research funded by NIH," he asked him if the NIH had funded GoF research in Wuhan.

It may seem like I'm splitting hairs here, but there IS a very important distinction. The NIH, from the studies I've read, did NOT actually fund any GoF research in Wuhan. The GoF research the NIH/NIAID funded was right here in the US.

***

Don't get me wrong -- I'm no fan of Fauci, but we should definitely characterize the situation(s) we expound upon accurately if we don't want people to call us conspiracy theorists, etc. I think this is vital for anyone that sees the writing on this COVID wall.
a reply to: bloodymarvelous

Dr. Paul had the budgetary line items detailed and a statement from a Chinese researcher in Wuhan. I think its pretty well established the funding in question is directly connected to the lab in China at ground zero.

originally posted by: Flyingclaydisk
a reply to: bloodymarvelous

If we (collectively) really want to make Fauci tell the truth, we need to take away the tools he is using to obfuscate this discussion.

Gain of Function, and how the virus got out, are actually two separate discussions. As long as Fauci is allowed to make them appear to be the same he will slither away every time. Here are the facts and questions he needs to be responding to:

Fact #1: Gain of Function, in and of itself, didn't harm anyone. Only the intentional / unintentional release of the virus harmed people. However, GoF research is an important question to be answered because it should provide insight as to "WHY" the GoF research was being performed (i.e. weaponization, etc). So, was there GoF research knowingly being conducted in Wu Han? And, was this funding subsidized by the American taxpayer? And, was the POTUS aware of this? (Bush, Obama or Trump, doesn't matter).

Fact #2: How was the virus released from the lab in Wu Han? Stop with the bats and wet-markets story! That, or produce a single wild bat, captured in a wet market, which is infected with Covid-19. Stop the BS!

In other words, stop with all the techno-jargon. Just answer the goddamned questions! A simple yes, or no, is perfectly acceptable. Just don't be wrong, because if we find out you lied...you're going on a vacation to Guantanamo for the rest of your natural life (and then some). You will be granted immunity to answer these questions truthfully ONLY during this session, and only this ONE time! Choose your answer wisely.

Another question that needs to be asked: why did Obama lift the ban on research he had banned during his admin (that Fauci may have violated), 11 days before Trump was sworn in? Why didnt Fauci inform his new boss of this change?

originally posted by: bloodymarvelous
Ron Paul asks Fauci directly, if there was any "gain of function" research funded by NIH.

www.youtube.com...

Fauci says he hasn't been lying when he says it is not true, but then he goes on to say

"You are implying that what we did was responsible for the deaths of individuals...." "I resent that".


I think later on, he is going to say he was responding to that implication, and not to the question itself.

Gain of function research was all but certainly happening in that lab. And probably funded by NIH. But Fauci will say he does/did not believe that research had caused the Corona outbreak, and so when he said again and again that Ron Paul was completely wrong, he was saying he was wrong that it had caused the outbreak. (But not wrong that it had happened.)

Quite a dance. Because no one can ever prove Fauci's state of mind.

What Sen. Paul needs to do next time is bring the two Drs in questions or at least one and ask them straight up if they consider their work GoF. Also Fauci repeatedly says that it isn’t GoF and that people that peer reviewed also don’t think is GoF… I want those people also brought in to see if they agree with him or if Fauci is just pulling one out of his ass.

I’m incline to agree that Fauci is playing defense here and parsing his statements in a way that gives him some cover from legal exposure.