No Point Vaccinating Those Who've Had COVID-19: Findings of Cleveland Clinic

Well, for anyone who could and has employed critical thinking in this whole pandemic, this should not come as a surprise at all.

No Point Vaccinating Those Who've Had COVID-19: Findings of Cleveland Clinic

Scientists from the Cleveland Clinic, USA, have recently evaluated the effectiveness of coronavirus disease 2019 COVID-19) vaccination among individuals with or without a history of severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) infection.

The study findings reveal that individuals with previous SARS-CoV-2 infection do not get additional benefits from vaccination, indicating that COVID-19 vaccines should be prioritized to individuals without prior infection. The study is currently available on the medRxiv* preprint server.

So, once again, I have to bring up the question: Why does Dr. Fauci and the CDC avoid talking about the immunity and antibodies that those of us have who have recovered from COVID-19? Why is our immunity of a lesser importance IF we are truly trying to come up with the best guidelines based on science? (Yes, I know that's a big "IF")

It seems to me that all of these policies that say fully-vaccinated people can remove masks in all of these situation listed in them should also include people with naturally induced immunity. Why don't they?

Well, my take is that the total number of vaccinated people is more important than a logical approach to getting back to normal, and so there is a concerted effort to scare those who have already recovered from the virus to the point of still getting immunized with an experimental delivery system that has yet to really prove its long-term safety. Without trying to sound hyperbolic, that seems borderline malpractice to me, especially because governments are allowing schools and jobs to mandate a treatment that is still under an EUA.

The analysis of cumulative COVID-19 incidence revealed that during the course of the study, SARS-CoV-2 infection occurred almost exclusively in participants who were not previously infected and were not vaccinated.

Interestingly, no significant difference in COVID-19 incidence was observed between previously infected and currently unvaccinated participants, previously infected and currently vaccinated participants, and previously uninfected and currently vaccinated participants.

The participants from these three groups exhibited a significantly lower incidence of SARS-CoV-2 infection compared to previously uninfected and currently unvaccinated participants.

Specifically, of all infections during the study period, 99.3% occurred in participants who were not infected previously and remained unvaccinated. In contrast, only 0.7% of infections occurred in participants who were not previously infected but were currently vaccinated.

Importantly, not a single incidence of SARS-CoV-2 infection was observed in previously infected participants with or without vaccination.

(emphasis my own) It would almost seem like my immunity are better than their immunity, yet I'm still treated like I'm "unclean" because I haven't allowed the government to inject me with something that I don't want or need. And on top of that, refusing to include me and others with naturally-derived immunity is facilitating yet another rift on our fractured society that does NOT need to exist.

With further statistical analysis, it was observed that the COVID-19 vaccination significantly reduced the risk of SARS-CoV-2 infection in previously uninfected participants but not in previously infected participants.

Although the study did not directly estimate the duration of protection from natural infection, it was observed that previously infected participants remained protected against COVID-19 for at least 10 months after the symptom onset or a positive test result.

If you are one of the people out there who advocate for vaccinating people who have recovered from COVID-19 at least within the past half year, please stop. You are not doing anything positive except exposing people to a vaccine that has not fully proven its safety.

ETA: Please note that this website points out that "medRxiv publishes preliminary scientific reports that are not peer-reviewed and, therefore, should not be regarded as conclusive, guide clinical practice/health-related behavior, or treated as established information." #FullDisclosure

I'll take "the science is what I say it is" for 200 Alex!

Yea, it's nice to hear this, but my guess is, you won't hear much more about it. If we look at how many of us have had covid over the last year and 3 months, I'd wager we are at a point where the vaccine distribution is pointless now. If a high risk person hasn't had it or been vaccinated, that risk is on them.

Best just get the experimental vax and comply, lots of others got it and are just fine. (so far, other than the one's who aren't just fine, but they didn't really believe in the vax enough, so they get what they get.)

So they found out what pretty much half of the world has been thinking all along lol.

I had a case of the snots back in February.
I'm not taking any hot off the press vaccines.

originally posted by: Homefree
I had a case of the snots back in February.
I'm not taking any hot off the press vaccines.

Mmmmmm...the snots.

originally posted by: network dude
I'll take "the science is what I say it is" for 200 Alex!

Ummmm, it's Mayim Bialik this week...and she's doing a good job, IMO.

WLYB

If they don't vax, how can they sell money? It's all about the vax.

If you havent had covid yet id think you arent getting it unless you live by yourself and never go anywhere

I would like to know why there isn't a peer review of this!

Those who have had Covid already show antibodies so what is the point?

Literally been saying this since the vaccines came out. Its a bit reason I wouldn't get one...aside from the fact its risky to try some new concoction with unknown long term side effects and some possible nasty short term ones for something which is not more deadly than the flu.

"The study findings reveal that individuals with previous SARS-CoV-2 infection do not get additional benefits from vaccination"

but they get to enjoy the risks from it.

a reply to: SlapMonkey

So, once again, I have to bring up the question: Why does Dr. Fauci and the CDC avoid talking about the immunity and antibodies that those of us have who have recovered from COVID-19? Why is our immunity of a lesser importance IF we are truly trying to come up with the best guidelines based on science?

main reason cause there are dollars to be made.
second reason those who make the most money wins at the depop game.

originally posted by: RoScoLaz5
"The study findings reveal that individuals with previous SARS-CoV-2 infection do not get additional benefits from vaccination"

but they get to enjoy the risks from it.

As the sayings go, albeit paraphrased to my liking:

If it sounds too good to be true, THEN IT PROBABLY #ING IS.

and --

The miracle cure snake oil is likely invariably worse than the disease.

Just a hunch:

#1 Pre-screening with Antibody tests would require far more (highly trained) medical personnel, massively increased number of labs, and would cost far more than simply vaccinating everyone and increase the timeframe significantly.

#2 Natural Antibodies would appear to be strain dependent where the vaccine is not e.g. There's been cases of people being infected more than once by different strains where the vaccines appears to be reasonably effective at reducing the possibility of getting "bad" Covid across all strains.

Unfortunately we still don't know how long a vaccine will be effective for. Will those that got a dose in January need a new shot after 8 months (similar to antibodies) or they lose immunity ?

That's a lot more vaccines required and for a far longer period of time if we are truly going to open the world to pre-covid levels anytime soon.

originally posted by: SlapMonkey
... So, once again, I have to bring up the question: Why does Dr. Fauci and the CDC avoid talking about the immunity and antibodies that those of us have who have recovered from COVID-19? Why is our immunity of a lesser importance IF we are truly trying to come up with the best guidelines based on science? (Yes, I know that's a big "IF")

Short answer: because this has never had anything to do with your or public health. This was clear to me by the end of March, 2020.

I'm not saying that the virus does not exist. It well may, but it has been co-opted as a psychological warfare tool. None of the measures have anything to do with anybody's well being.

Your question is simply moot.
:

So how do I find out if I already had the covid? Vast majority had to have a test tell them if they had this pandemic disease.

originally posted by: TheResidentAlien
Just a hunch:

#1 Pre-screening with Antibody tests would require far more (highly trained) medical personnel, massively increased number of labs, and would cost far more than simply vaccinating everyone.

#2 Natural Antibodies would appear to be strain dependent where the vaccine is not e.g. There's been cases of people being infected more than once by different strains where the vaccines appears to be reasonably effective at reducing the possibility of getting "bad" Covid across all strains.

Unfortunately we still don't know how long a vaccine will be effective for. Will those that got a dose in January need a new shot after 8 months (similar to antibodies) or they lose immunity ?

That's a lot more vaccines required and for a far longer period of time if we are truly going to open the world to pre-covid levels anytime soon.

Cleveland Clinic is full of professionals who seem to disagree with you here.

Are you trying to say you know better than the researchers do? I know it's a gambit at this point in trusting researchers' findings, but this one's pretty cut & dried.

originally posted by: YongPeng
If they don't vax, how can they sell money? It's all about the vax.

Normally, I agree, and this is definitely a part of it, but I can't help but think that a lot of what has gone down in the name of COVID-19 and associated states of emergency has been a test study of how far the government can go in controlling people under the guise of fear.

In any even, I can guarantee that places like the CIA have been paying very close attention to how the public has reacted to pandemic-related mandates, and also how people are reacting once mandates are lifted. Ami Horowitz just put out a video asking people in NYC why they are still walking around with masks outdoors, even though the mandates are lifted and most of them are vaccinated. The reasons ran all from actual anxiety, to peer pressure to keep wearing them, to virtue signaling, to setting an example (whatever that means).

This has the markers of a mass social experiment written all over it...and if it wasn't the goal at the start, it certainly is a crisis that has not been wasted.

a reply to: SlapMonkey

I've been saying this in thread after thread for months. The CDC-WHO said last Summer, when enough people have contracted and recovered from Covid-19, "HERD IMMUNITY" would kick in.

Then the bastards in charge of the health/medical industry saw dollars signs from the golden-goose U.S. Treasury... tons of money for administering a Covid-19 vaccine.

Suddenly the vaccine was the only game in town. No vaccine, you're likely to catch Covid-19 again, and possibly drop dead!

Word today is that the FDA is almost ready to approve our little children as Covid-drug guinea pigs!

You want a WAR in America? Mandate that our children can't attend school unless they've been injected with an experimental drug!

originally posted by: TheResidentAlien
Just a hunch:

Okay, let's have a hunch-off...

#1 Pre-screening with Antibody tests would require far more (highly trained) medical personnel, massively increased number of labs, and would cost far more than simply vaccinating everyone and increase the timeframe significantly.

My hunch is that there doesn't only have to be an exclusive avenue to take on this--vaccinations can still exist, and if you read the link that I provided, you would see that it says that the vaccine does quite well for those who haven't been infected with and recovered from COVID-19 previously.

But they have been pushing antibody tests for people for many months at this point, so I disagree about your concern over logistics. Just the logistics alone of creating the vaccines and shipping and keeping refrigerated and monitoring expiration dates and dealing with tainted batches shows that your concerns over antibody-testing logistics is misplaced.

#2 Natural Antibodies would appear to be strain dependent where the vaccine is not e.g. There's been cases of people being infected more than once by different strains where the vaccines appears to be reasonably effective at reducing the possibility of getting "bad" Covid across all strains.

There are many cases of people who have been fully vaccinated later being infected, and there is circumstantial evidence at this point that is showing that it's possible that being vaccinated actually increases the severity of symptoms in some people. While there is evidence that shows that the natural immunity has a better/longer duration of antibodies and memory B cells (which create new antibodies faster when reinfected) for the specific strain and the antibodies from the vaccine do seem to cover other strains better (but not perfectly, by a long shot), evidence, like what I've provided here, shows that natural immunities are as effective overall.

Unfortunately we still don't know how long a vaccine will be effective for. Will those that got a dose in January need a new shot after 8 months (similar to antibodies) or they lose immunity ?

At least one vaccine producer has said that it's probable that a booster will be needed annually, so, it would seem that the duration is very limited.

That's a lot more vaccines required and for a far longer period of time if we are truly going to open the world to pre-covid levels anytime soon.

No, it's not. We have viable treatments for the illness and we have available vaccines for those who want them, and we have a growing population of people with both natural and vaccine-induced antibodies. We are fine to "open the world to pre-covid levels," and people are able to decide if they want to take advantage of the world being open, or still take subjectively determined precautions for themselves.

Just a hunch