Fascism IS a leftist ideology!

Yes, yes you read that title right. I want people to understand, especially you snowflakes on ATS (you know who you are) that Fascism IS an ideology of the left!

You've, no doubt, seen the political spectrum at some point in your life with Socialism and communism on the left and Libertarian and fascism on the right. I tend to lean toward the opinion that hugely conservative people are not, indeed, Fascist, but true libertarians.

Okay, so lets dig into this a bit, but first for a bit of a laugh, let's quote one of Hitlers guys shall we, why not, we're talking about the left afterall.

How can you find pleasure in shooting, from behind cover, at poor creatures borwsing on the edge of a wood, innocent, defenceless and unsuspecting? It's really pure murder. Sounds like a college campus lefty no? Sounds like something PETA would say, no? This was said by Himmler.

Here is how fascists rise to power.
1. Seizing the means of production (sound familiar? It should, that's communism baby)
2. Empowering the masses, usually through violent protest (sound familiar, it should, that's communism baby)
3. Ruled by authorities and 'experts' who become unquestionable to the 'rational' man. (Sound familiar, it should, that's communism baby)
4.The elevation of the youth and brute emotion over WISDOM (sound familiar, it should, that's communism baby)
5. The complete submission of the individual to the collective 'will' of the state (sound familiar? It should, that's communism baby)!

Now, let's have a little think and see if we can apply this to anything we see happening today? Hmmmmmmmmm . . . . HMMMMMMMMMM. Nope, nothing comes to mind........ Does it? America? Eh, Britain, eh, eh...... Nothing at all? Lol.

You know what else the Nazi's hated, tax cuts and property rights! You'll own NOTHING and you'll be HAPPY.

Compare, if you like, the current mindset of this administration on things like Child obesity and none smoking to that of the Hitler youth, food as a communal right...
It's an eye opener no.....

Liberals are, historically, the main advocates for eugenics. Take Woodrow Wilson, the absolute pinnacle of liberlism in America. Roosevelt too, during the 'new deal' an immigrant dry cleaner could have his door kicked in for charging less than the government minimum...This whilst rallies happened at the same in New York, the hypocrisy was lost on a LOT of people, apparently!

We come to a problem with Liberals, they are so sure of their moral superiority and righteous indignation that ANY deviation from their pre-approved virtue gathering opinions is seen as heresy, punishable by silencing or even violence. Liberals don't need to self analyse because their position HAS to be correct, or they're monsters.

By an large a conservative wants a limited government with few federal programmes and overreach - this is not true of the 'freedom loving Liberal' who thinks that it's the governments sacred duty to get involved in any and ALL matters of moral importance, the government should do good where it can, whenever it can, instead of staying out of the way. In this sense, the liberal is the instigator of government overreach. The conservative is then shunned for their position of limited government because to NOT interfere is seen as apathy or abuse.

Fascism doesn't start out as inherently militaristic as most of us believe it does, in fact, most fascist regimes have sprouted forth from socio-economic bent. This happens because the fascist siezes on any political momentum and makes every action they take one of 'imminent importance' (isn't that right Biden, ahahahahaha).. This leaves no room for the pesky conservative (read libertarian) to debate and understand the motive behind such action. In this way the fascist can, in a week, put his whole society on the war path, inadvertently and secretly.

The liberal needs urgent and grand moral cuases to enact bossiness and repression which their policies, inevitably, entail.

Lets examine some of Biden, and the UK governments urgent and moral issues that need sorting immediately!

Covid 19 - Don't get me started!
Climate change - Again, don't get me started.
Economic downturn - Again, again don't start me! I keep telling you!
Poverty!!!!!

Every single one of these issues has the perfect mix of social factors that necessitate statist bullying. The lefts wet dream, and the fascists best friend.

The problem we face now, as I see it anyway, is that the 'right' isn't right at all, it slid left when the lefties went balls to wall crazy left! So the argument isn't now "We need limited government", it has shifted to "I can manage the crisis better than you can". This is NOT a conservative opinion, but a thinly veiled leftist tactic. The conservative NEVER wants the government involved, ever. The distortion means that the anything the 'right' does is demonized, but still benefits the 'left', anything outside of this is labelled 'alt-right' and censored with immediate effect!

Hitler blamed the capitalist Jews for Germans economic woes. Yet his ideology and genesis were, tragically liberal.

Anne Frank House.

Against the backdrop of revolution and violence, Hitler's antisemitism was becoming increasingly radical. It is noteworthy that he said he did not support uncontrolled 'emotional' pogroms (outbursts of anti-Jewish violence). Instead, he argued for an ‘antisemitism of the mind'. It had to be legal and would ultimately lead to the 'removal' of the Jews.

Does this sound familiar, hmmmmmm? Removal, silencing, deplatforming...... Hmmmm...... Sound like someone we know, hmmmm??
Interesting perspective

the anti-fascist movement has a sophomoric misunderstanding of fascism and its location on the political spectrum. More disturbing, this lack of understanding extends to its own social media and even physical tactics that mimic the mob psychology, street rage and bullying that are hallmarks of the fascism they denounce.

Mussolini’s claim that in a fascist regime there was to be “everything within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state” is of course the totalitarian opposite of the libertarian ideal. Mussolini was long involved with the socialist movement in Italy, breaking with it because of personal ambition and because his socialist brethren would not support Italy’s entry into the First World War. Once in power, he inaugurated a major extension of welfare spending and public works projects

Now WHO does this sound like? HAHAHAHAHA. Eh Biden, who does this sound like BIDEN?


Mod note:
THIS IS NOT THE MUD PIT

On the other hand...

The left has more in common with fascism than they like to admit.

The demonisation of their 'opposition' and the removal of any dissent is the stench that comes with the turd of fascism.

I implore the left leaning members of ATS to dig deep into the roots of fascism and communism and to realise that they have been completely fooled and taken in by charlatans who just want to use their bodies as shields against all forms of dissent.

America, Britain, we're at our Reichstag moment and, it seems, no one is looking in the right direction!

Do NOT play into identity or partisan politics. Look at things objectively for how they are, and who benefits! See the wall the American government has erected around itself. They fear their own people because, by and large, Americans love freedom and conservatism. They will kill you.......

Let's wake up, eh. We're not enemies. We NEED to unite against this.


As an aside I am willing to admit that ultra libertarinism can actually, also, lead to fascism because people get scared of their responsibilities! This isn't a left vs right issue!

originally posted by: Joneselius
We NEED to unite against this.

They way you came out blasting against one side in the OP detracts from your call for unity.

a reply to: daskakik

The fact that you're still referring to it as a side means you missed the whole point of this thread. Try again.

a reply to: Joneselius
Maybe you should try again, without referring to that side?

And, fascism is a right-wing ideology. Who said right-wingers can't be authoritarian?

a reply to: daskakik

Again, you didn't read my posts did you. Look up.

I didn't play left vs right. I'm making a point about the whole picture. I'm willing to admit that ultra libertarianism can lead to fascism also. Again, what's your bent here, what are you trying to do? Derail? Defend fascism, lol?

It's always about the context! Unfortunately for us, the one's who are acting like Nazi's now, align themselves with the 'left'. No?

Stop being obtuse.

Soo conservatism is now the new jews, we will be persecuted for our way of thinking, arrested and put in concentration camps to be indoctrinated in the ways of communist liberalism, we all know from where the lessons came from right? China Biden. Oppressions seems to look really good for the demonRats.

originally posted by: Joneselius
The left has more in common with fascism than they like to admit.

The demonisation of their 'opposition' and the removal of any dissent is the stench that comes with the turd of fascism.

I implore the left leaning members of ATS to dig deep into the roots of fascism and communism and to realise that they have been completely fooled and taken in by charlatans who just want to use their bodies as shields against all forms of dissent.

America, Britain, we're at our Reichstag moment and, it seems, no one is looking in the right direction!

Do NOT play into identity or partisan politics. Look at things objectively for how they are, and who benefits! See the wall the American government has erected around itself. They fear their own people because, by and large, Americans love freedom and conservatism. They will kill you.......

Let's wake up, eh. We're not enemies. We NEED to unite against this.

As an aside I am willing to admit that ultra libertarinism can actually, also, lead to fascism because people get scared of their responsibilities! This isn't a left vs right issue!

I see that it was all good politics until the table got turned. You are basically Wall St vs GameStop at this point.

a reply to: Joneselius
The fact is that authoritarian left has a lot in common with authoritarian right. It doesn't make them all left.

I'm pointing out the error in your claim.

What is the problem with pointing out that right-wing governments can and have been oppressive?

a reply to: Joneselius

Being a libertarian is almost on the same level as an anarchist. The only difference is that anarchists reject all laws or social norms while libertarians will abide by basic laws and order.

Fascism is a system where corporations, military, and state all become one (in the classic sense as in the Roman fascism, it's when state, military, and land owners all control the power, and feel they know best for the slaves, and peasants).

Considering "left" ideology is based on the collective individual efforts of the common people, and democracy it doesn't make sense to pin it as 'fascist'.

a reply to: Joneselius

Along with ethnic minorities and the disabled, the Nazi's targeted socialists, communists, academics, artisans and trade unionists - all groups inherently leftists in their ideologies.

If the Nazi's were leftists, why would they start by eating their own?

It's a rhetorical question.

I think the issue is that you are conflating fascism with authoritarianism. Authoritarianism exists on the fringes of most political structures and often gains power through alliance with monied interests that stand to benefit from it. Fascism is the name for the specific variant of authoritarianism inherent to extreme right wing / nationalism based movements.

a reply to: TzarChasm

Don't know what you're talking about, are you insinuating that I'm somehow a supporter of Trump? Why are you being so vague?

Just say what you're thinking. Man..... Like getting blood from a stone.

And no, I wasn't happy with Trump at all, I saw him the same way I see Biden. A tool, being used to foment change for their overlords. The difference was, Trump rarely claimed virtue on the basis that he was simply doing something! Biden is, and he's also managing to enact all the EO's that will allow the rise of fascism in America. Everyone seems to be under the illusion that this can't happen, and it will!

a reply to: Hefficide

So Antifa didn't attack the Democrats HQ?

They eat their own because they're ideologically driven, not ethically led. Authoritarianism is the result, yes. But fascism, at least to an American standard, IS on the left.

Our left is another countries right, there is that....

a reply to: Joneselius

Your mistake here is viewing the Democratic party as "leftist". It is not. It's a neoliberal party, which is the left's version of authoritarianism.

Also it's not apples to apples because it's not the state attacking ANTIFA but ANTIFA reacting to the state.

a reply to: Joneselius

I will love to know what is your solution for our nation, because the truth is I am losing hope.

This is not the America I was born into. If the state I live in loses the governor in mid term elections I will be packing selling my home and moving down south to Florida. Time to leave everything behind and just seat and relax at the beach under the sun. Maybe it will be easier to ignore the crap that is going on right now and about to get worst.

No, it's a MAGA ideology, from nationalism, to the migrant threat, to consolidation of power, viewing everyone else as "enemy"," anti-intellectualism, reduction to baseness to everything in between.

Every one of them stated that to be a fascist, one must support the revolutionary, usually violent overthrow of the entire government/Constitution, and reject democracy entirely.

Vox

And here we are.

Sounds familiar, the past four years:

The cult of tradition. “One has only to look at the syllabus of every fascist movement to find the major traditionalist thinkers. The Nazi gnosis was nourished by traditionalist, syncretistic, occult elements.”
The rejection of modernism. “The Enlightenment, the Age of Reason, is seen as the beginning of modern depravity. In this sense Ur-Fascism can be defined as irrationalism.”
The cult of action for action’s sake. “Action being beautiful in itself, it must be taken before, or without, any previous reflection. Thinking is a form of emasculation.”
Disagreement is treason. “The critical spirit makes distinctions, and to distinguish is a sign of modernism. In modern culture the scientific community praises disagreement as a way to improve knowledge.”
Fear of difference. “The first appeal of a fascist or prematurely fascist movement is an appeal against the intruders. Thus Ur-Fascism is racist by definition.”
Appeal to social frustration. “One of the most typical features of the historical fascism was the appeal to a frustrated middle class, a class suffering from an economic crisis or feelings of political humiliation, and frightened by the pressure of lower social groups.”
The obsession with a plot. “Thus at the root of the Ur-Fascist psychology there is the obsession with a plot, possibly an international one. The followers must feel besieged.”
The enemy is both strong and weak. “By a continuous shifting of rhetorical focus, the enemies are at the same time too strong and too weak.”
Pacifism is trafficking with the enemy. “For Ur-Fascism there is no struggle for life but, rather, life is lived for struggle.”
Contempt for the weak. “Elitism is a typical aspect of any reactionary ideology.”
Everybody is educated to become a hero. “In Ur-Fascist ideology, heroism is the norm. This cult of heroism is strictly linked with the cult of death.”
Machismo and weaponry. “Machismo implies both disdain for women and intolerance and condemnation of nonstandard sexual habits, from chastity to homosexuality.”
Selective populism. “There is in our future a TV or Internet populism, in which the emotional response of a selected group of citizens can be presented and accepted as the Voice of the People.”
Ur-Fascism speaks Newspeak. “All the Nazi or Fascist schoolbooks made use of an impoverished vocabulary, and an elementary syntax, in order to limit the instruments for complex and critical reasoning.”

Eco

Hitler, Mussolini, MAGA checklist confirmed.

a reply to: marg6043

The solution is for the individual to be responsible for themselves whilst leaving room for compassion towards others without capitulating to 'higher authorities', one's that govern unjustly and by means of force.

America HAD the best system of a constitutional, representative Republic, with an electoral college that stopped one state from deciding elections.

We have gone past the solution, I fear, the minds of too many are ideologically driven and they see their peers and equals as enemies. Society is on a war path with itself again.

My solution was to do what every authoritarian hates and trust God and lean not on my own understanding. To treat everyone as my family and to not dismiss anyone or hate. That's my rebellion. I won't bow to an ideology, only my God.

originally posted by: Joneselius
Our left is another countries right, there is that....

Wrong, what skews the american standard is equating right-wing with freedom. That is why everything limiting freedom is called left, just like you are trying to do here.

a reply to: Hefficide

Then thank you for pointing out that mistake.