ADHD in Kids

a reply to: HawkeyeNation

Yeah, and I totally agree there are kids who need medication to help them. I've seen them in one of my jobs.

We always questioned in with ours simply because he would always tend to be able to settle and do things for periods of time in a quiet environment. He can pick up a book and read on the couch for between 45 minutes and an hour, and if he wears a noise-canceling headset, he can do it while we practice in the evenings. He does it even with one of his best friends sitting there right next to him and all the distractions that can be.

He'll play with putty or slime for similar periods of time while sitting at a table. His play might get loud, but he's sitting and playing at one thing. Or he'll play with his action figures.

It was always in a noisy environment where the noise was aggravating him and he couldn't focus his hearing that the hyper came out.

Runs in my family. Mom and dad. Both diagnosed as adults. I had help through school. I had been diagnosed as an adult at 19. Went on meds for school. It worked well. I never became addicted. My brother diagnosed young. Both my kids have it. My son just graduated. Both kids did not have meds. They had extra help.

My marrage suffered and ended due to my ADHD symptoms. I did not know how to give him what he needed. I am in a good relationship now and we are both ADHD. It works for us.
Sometimes I am a bit. Like a dog chasing my tail. Lucky for me I work with little kids I can use my energy properly!
I make my ADHD work with me not against me.

I wasn't diagnosed until 50 and believe an early diagnosis is a great thing because a lifetime of failure is endlessly destructive to one's self esteem.

As for kids, it's really individual. My oldest was absolutely wily and out of control. He was a clear case but I never got him diagnosed. Strangely, he went through the absolute worst emotional puberty and popped out the other side a calm capable young man. A big factor was him finding a mentor in the electrical field who encouraged him to take his schooling to become an apprentice. My other son has undiagnosed adhd, inattentive type like myself, and didn't outgrow it but has learnt a lot about it through my discovery and uses that info to manage his world.

Adhd kids are hard work and the best thing you can do for them is to support them being different and not allow their self esteem or drive in life be damaged. Early knowledge is a blessing and the meds may or may not work. They work really well for me but I've known a couple people who were medicated as young people and regret it but I suspect their parents were putting the kids better behaviour ahead of the kid's complaints of side effects in both cases.

a reply to: Edumakated

He can focus when he is interested in something. He is great with video games and building things. I've never seen a kid his age build lego creations as complex as his - robots, cars, etc. He even plays chess. We've been wondering if home schooling is the answer or maybe he needs a different school environment that is less structured (like Montesorri) so he feels more creative and less constrained.

What you wrote sounds exactly how my son was. He could build things at a level twice his age. This eventually turned into other obsessions as he grew older, programming, cars, etc. on and on, if he was interested he could focus 110%.
If he was not interested, oh boy...

I am absolutely convinced a different learning environment would be so beneficial for your son. For my son there was a charter school that did that. When we moved it went downhill, that’s how I knew. We did not medicate him but looking back he probably need more help during the high school years. He had a terrible time with organization, homework etc.

As an adult he is able to manage like a normal person and excel in his job as it’s something he enjoys. Like I said in hindsight I do think medication would have probably helped him more as a teen. He managed in elementary and middle school, but high school was quite the struggle.

As far as homeschooling, that is a hard decision. A lot of these kids need that extra socialization. It seems like you are keeping a close eye on it.

a reply to: Edumakated

he sounds like me as a kid (exactly to be frank)... went through the entire line of drugs... it suppressed me and was a good lesson, but made me numb...

my honest suggestion: he needs physical creativity projects (build/create/art/sculpture/wood/etc) and multiples at once and to be in sports or physical activity.

sounds like he suffers from being creative on a far different level than any schooling can teach imho nor many can fathom.

drugs are not the way imho... if anything, l-theanine at most (extract of green tea.. natural option vs adhd meds)

example of me: failed most classes because i would make any project the most complex thing people could ever fathom(only if interested)... any thing that didn't interest me.. i saw no value in doing.. so i didn't... fast forward to age 17... no college... built race cars... then i became a self taught multi-discipline engineer working for fortune 500 companies with my hand on work you see everyday... all by being introduced to cars from a man just like me as a kid (i could tinker/build/make/invent at age 9), i retired at 30 from corporate and now serial entrepreneur with multiple companies as the thirst to create never goes away. he just doesn't fit the mold, and that is amazing and should be praised imho

Another suggestion is to look up visual-spatial learner and see if this sort of defines him a bit too.

When I was trying to figure out what was going on with my son during his horrible kindergarten year, I went through all this stuff.

As someone who was forcibly diagnosed with ADHD as a youth, you gotta be sceptical.

You can't expect a young kid who is full of energy to be okay with being forced to sit in a hard ass chair all day listening to annoying ass people and absorbing irritating stimuli.

Teachers would much rather say a kid has a learning disability or attention disorder than admit they suck at teaching or that there needs to be some patience and the fundamentals covered.

Hell, next thing you know they'll be telling you that your kid needs to be out on anti-depressants.

originally posted by: ketsuko
Another suggestion is to look up visual-spatial learner and see if this sort of defines him a bit too.

When I was trying to figure out what was going on with my son during his horrible kindergarten year, I went through all this stuff.

This seems how he learns.

Like I mentioned, he builds these lego creations that are mind blowing. He literally can just take random lego blocks and create the robot characters he sees on TV and video games. The are perfectly symmetrical, can stand up, balance, etc. You literally can almost tell who he was building at a glance. One night he built a scorpion. Had the claws and elevated tail stinger and all... just out of random lego blocks. I am kind of a lego nerd and I couldn't build what he did if I tried (i like building kits with instructions).

He figures out video games just buy playing them. He can't really read but he can seemingly just figure out how to play games and get himself to an expert level. He is very good at Minecraft.

I don't want to suppress his creativity and force a square into a circle just so he does well in a predefined schooling environment. At the same time, I also don't want him to fall behind on the basics of reading, writing, and math either.

a reply to: Edumakated

Yeah, I think if I were you, I'd start doing some research and seriously thinking about getting him assessed, outside the system if you need to.

It's expensive, but the more information you have on him, the better an advocate for him you can be as a parent, especially if you run into a nightmare teacher like we did.

He sounds like a neat kid.

a reply to: Edumakated

Try a multivitamin containing methylcobalamin and methylfolate. My daughter found some kids multivitamin/multimineral capsules with this type of B vitamins and the kids did have an easier time in school.

Non scientific article: www.additudemag.com...

Scientific articles.

patents.google.com...

www.psychologytoday.com...

www.ohsu.edu... problems.pdf

B12 is a neuromodulator and folate is a vitamin that helps with b12 absorption and utilization. MethylB12 is the kind that people with the MTFHR gene differences need. The 677 gene polymorphism is not that uncommon, one copy creates problems. The 1298c mthfr gene has to be two copies to cause problems. I have the double 1298C gene, but coffee keeps me from going adhd. My grandkids mostly have the 677 single gene, it is common in hispanic people. TMG can help to keep the homocysteine down in the 677 or the combo 677+1298c. Or just feed them foods containing betaine. If they can convert choline to betaine well, just eating eggs for breakfast three times a week will help. Some people do not have good enzymes for converting those two back and forth, so they must eat choline and betaine foods.

There are other deficiencies too, a small supplement of Taurine might be able to moderate brain activity too.

A

a reply to: rickymouse

We've done this with our kiddo too.

originally posted by: rickymouse
a reply to: Edumakated

Try a multivitamin containing methylcobalamin and methylfolate.

Was just going to add this. I've never done the genetic testing so can't be sure but just recently tried this for myself and it made all the difference. I'd taken the regular b vitamins before and they made me puke, so was skeptical but the results suggest I'd have the mutation that needs this form as my head became more clear and calmer but at the same time had more energy.

Diet is a good place to start.

originally posted by: igloo

originally posted by: rickymouse
a reply to: Edumakated

Try a multivitamin containing methylcobalamin and methylfolate.

Was just going to add this. I've never done the genetic testing so can't be sure but just recently tried this for myself and it made all the difference. I'd taken the regular b vitamins before and they made me puke, so was skeptical but the results suggest I'd have the mutation that needs this form as my head became more clear and calmer but at the same time had more energy.

Diet is a good place to start.

Cyanocobalamin is rarely found in nature, there are some microbes that form it but most people do not consume what they create. Methylcobalamin is formed by microbes we are more in contact with and in our bodies from eating foods.
Adeno and Hydroxocobalamin have different medicinal uses. All are available in supplements for different conditions. It depends what you are going to treat and the medical condition you want to fix.

Folic Acid is not natural either, it has some side effects for people. It works to reduce Homocysteine but does not work well with B12 metabolism or blood cell creation in people. Too much food folate in supplements can cause crabbiness in some people too, a hundred percent RDA is enough in a supplement.

originally posted by: dollukka
a reply to: tanstaafl
Wouldn´t do that for growing child, adults are different they do not grow anymore. Children needs carbs too among other nutrition. Brains needs and every other organs too glucose to to maintain their work. No carbs at all is not good for growing child.

I'm sorry, but this is simply the regurgitated learnings of a false belief system imposed by those who know nothing - or worse, have ulterior malicious motives (financial, and other). Do yourself a favor. Don't believe everything that the powers that be tell you.

My 3 yr old twins are thriving, never been seriously ill (they got the normal fever/sniffles/coughs that kids get when their immune systems are exposed to bugs for the first time, especially/mostly after we had to put them in daycare before we pulled them out due to the stupid mask requirements - for 2 yr olds no less. But they've never had any ear/sinus infections that are so common today for small kids.

No vaccinations at all yet, and an exclusively carnivore diet since they were born, in the form of the Weston Price Liver based formula. They're 3 now, and still demand their morning, noon and nightly bottles - although they have started skipping the noon bottle when they're busy during the day. My oldest is 6, and she was raised on the Weston Price raw milk formula. I wish we'd used the liver formula for her too.

No, the best food for growing healthy brains, muscles, ligaments, tendons, etc, is good healthy animal fats, found in grass fed/finished/pastured meats, especially organ meats like liver and brains. Suet is a wonderful treat for kids.

This is what makes internet dangerous.

Yes, the internet can be a dangerous place for mis/dis-information, that is sure. But this is not that.

( For example there have been parents who has took advice from internet for their diabetic children to not eat carbs at all and disease is "magically cured" and no insulin needed, which inteed had left their child in ketoacidosis and death.)

Like you said - the internet can be a dangerous place where information is concerned. Any parent that self-treated their diabetic child without involving their doctor, or at a bare minimum, closely monitoring their insulin levels, is just stupid. You can't fix stupid.

Being in ketosis - which is what happens when you do the keto diet - is very different from ketoacidosis - or more correctly called 'diabetic ketoacidosis' (DKA) (which you are correct is a very dangerous and life threatening condition). DKA is caused by extremely and abnormally high levels of ketones, levels that far exceed those reached when doing the keto diet or when in ketosis.

The need for carbs - for anyone, kids or adults - is a myth, and the truth is coming out. Medical Doctors like Paul Saladino and Ken Berry, and Jason Fung are true pioneers in spreading the word about the false narrative we've been sold these past decades.

First and foremost - I would never, ever suggest to anyone that they should treat their diabetic child without monitoring the critical factors like insulin levels. This goes especially for anyone with Type I diabetes. In fact, anyone/everyone who experiments should work with a professional until they are comfortable with what they are doing and what they need to watch for.

That said, the carnivore diet stabilizes insulin levels, and pretty much every type II diabetic (that was so bad that they had to start taking insulin) that has gone on the keto and/or carnivore diet has totally eliminated their need for insulin. There is absolutely no danger of 'ketoacidosis' from the keto or carnivore diet - when done properly. They worked with their doctors and most importantly, monitored their insulin levels closely, and adjusted the amount of insulin until they simply no longer needed it.

Type I's can often dramatically reduce their need for insulin, but it is much more important for them to monitor their levels.

My Dad - who is 85 - was told he was early stage type II about 6 months ago, and had been experiencing all of the symptoms of early onset type II diabetes. I convinced him to try Keto, and within 2 months, his doctor was amazed to tell him his blood sugar was totally normal - and he'd lost a lot of weight and felt much better.

There are nutrition charts and pyramids which gives a idea of decent meals.

Yes, there are charts. Charts that have been proven to be extremely wrong, as they were created by those who know nothing about proper nutrition, and/or were pushed and funded by the large processed food corporations and their paid lobbyists.

Learn, smartly.

a reply to: tanstaafl

My son is type I diabetic, so i know what i am saying. No carbs at all.. not the way for growing kids. By the way liver has a huge amount of glucose, liver is the place where body storage glucose for later use ( example for hypoglycemia )

originally posted by: dollukka
a reply to: tanstaafl
My son is type I diabetic, so i know what i am saying.

I'm sorry, but the mere fact that your son is diabetic does not equate to you knowing what you are talking about.

You are apparently not bothering to even attempt to read any of the authoritative sources I've linked to for you, simply because they conflict with your current pre-determined bias.

I submit to you that you are misinformed. Do with that what you will.

No carbs at all.. not the way for growing kids.

So, you know better than the doctors that have studied this for many years?

And my personal experience with my own kids belies the falseness of your unsubstantiated claim.

Thankfully, we are each still free to make up our own minds based on the truth - for now at least, although the new incoming administration appears poised to destroy free speech and the internet as we know it.

By the way liver has a huge amount of glucose, liver is the place where body storage glucose for later use ( example for hypoglycemia )

-sigh

The liver does not store glucose, it stores glycogen, which when released by the liver is converted to glucose.

That said, liver does indeed have a lot more carbs than muscle meats, and can result in raised insulin levels much more than lean meats, so should be eaten in more moderation - but that doesn't mean that you're 'eating a bunch of glucose' as you seem to be suggesting.

I'll just finish with...

It ain't what you know that gets ya, it's what you think you know that just ain't so.

Go in peace.

a reply to: tanstaafl

So you healthcare professional ? i am a nurse, i have seen situations with meds and suppliments and pretty much are aware of healthy diet. Like msm you mentioned in other thread has no proof whatsoever. Just skip it !

originally posted by: dollukka
a reply to: tanstaafl

So you healthcare professional ?

Nope, just been studying this stuff for 35+ years, thats all. I'm sure I've forgotten more about natural health than you think you know.

i am a nurse,

Good for you, but... so what? Nurses don't have to study anything about nutrition, and certainly not about nutrition that goes against the grain of the government overlords.

i have seen situations with meds and suppliments

Not sure what that means, or your point, but... ok...

and pretty much are aware of healthy diet.

Well, since you conflate ketosis and ketoacidosis - two very different things - and are apparently unaware of the safety and efficacy of the keto and carnivore diets, your awareness is... apparently lacking.

Like msm you mentioned in other thread has no proof whatsoever. Just skip it !

Proof... yeah, that's in the pudding.

a reply to: tanstaafl

Oh my .. even i am not english speaking member here i have never conflated those two.. that is ridiculous statement from you, it seems you have not even read my statement about ketoacidosis or you are just simply a bully.

You are not worthy of reply anymore..

About that ADHD.