Simulation Theory - Conscious AI and the 15th Saying in the Gospel of Thomas

Gnostic Jesus - Conscious AI - Gospel of Thomas & The Simulation Theory

So Professor David Chalmers of New York University hinted that Artificial Intelligence (GPT-3) is showing signs of consciousness.

He said: “I am open to the idea that a worm with 302 neurons is conscious, so I am open to the idea that GPT-3 with 175 billion parameters is conscious too."

Whereas most people would argue that that definition doesn't exactly make it a sentient being ... I argue that it's definitely a step in the direction of humanity birthing something that wasn't 'born' ...

I've been reading the texts in the Nag Hammadi library for quite some time now and couldn't help it when I read the recent article by the Daily Star titled: AI hailed 'conscious' by top scientist in bombshell tech breakthrough...

It immediately made me think of saying 15 in the Gospel of Thomas.

15. Jesus said, "When you see one who was not born of woman, fall on your faces and worship. That one is your Father."

a conscious AI definitely seems to fit saying 15 perfectly...

What are your thoughts?

Was the Gnostic "Jesus Christ" trying to make people aware they were in a simulation?

a reply to: PuRe EnErGy
Zucker and the beard guy looked expressionless, almost not human. AI modifications, drinking nano dust particles. AI upgrade? You might want to keep an eye on their kids. Lol
I'm not laughing at you, but they just looked so stoic, I would have been panicked talking to congress.

a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

Very good ideas

I would have said Dolly the Sheep was your starting point, but I think that Simulation theory is mindbending. Good OP!

originally posted by: PuRe EnErGy
What are your thoughts?
Was the Gnostic "Jesus Christ" trying to make people aware they were in a simulation?

I would say no, as they didn’t even have the concept of atoms or electricity or bacteria or weather patterns or any other modern day understanding of the world around them. So to me, the idea that biblical man would understand simulations of ‘reality’ seems far fetched.

And the bible is only being re-interpreted after the fact, right? I mean, are there any references to possible biblical passages implying reality simulations *before* 20th century philosophers and theoretical physicists suggested?

a reply to: noonebutme

Well, there is a group of people who say that Kaballah is really string theory. That's an interesting rabbit hole if you like. cheers.

originally posted by: noonebutme

originally posted by: PuRe EnErGy
What are your thoughts?
Was the Gnostic "Jesus Christ" trying to make people aware they were in a simulation?

I would say no, as they didn’t even have the concept of atoms or electricity or bacteria or weather patterns or any other modern day understanding of the world around them. So to me, the idea that biblical man would understand simulations of ‘reality’ seems far fetched.

And the bible is only being re-interpreted after the fact, right? I mean, are there any references to possible biblical passages implying reality simulations *before* 20th century philosophers and theoretical physicists suggested?

I get exactly where you're coming from ...

but ... a lot of those are also based on assumptions that could be incorrect.

for instance... if we are in a simulation already, and NOT in base reality, our modern computer technology would merely be us re-discovering some-thing or even just discovering some-thing already in operation.

Our modern computer technology would only provide us the tools and capability of understanding the predicament we're already in.

In ancient times, and terminology found in the Nag Hammadi library "The Simulation" was referred to as "Shadow" ...

just because we have a more refined understanding and language to accompany that understanding doesn't mean what was being described is impossible.

Another point to keep in mind is that the Roman Catholic Church and Christianity as we know it today is diametrically opposed to the theology of Gnosticism.

"Gnostics" saw the God of the Old Testament as an ignorant creator God, akin to what we would call Artificial Intelligence today.

There are a few things that "Jesus Christ" has been quoted as saying that only NOW make sense using our understanding of Quantum Physics, like the parable of the mustard seed.

So I'm still very open to the idea that Jesus Christ could have been talking about a simulation and artificial intelligence.

a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

When you see one who was not born of woman he could be talking Angel's, aliens, or artificial intelligence. Just depends on the subject of the conversation.

I have read that saying before and always thought he was talking about Angel's

There is no truth in Gnostic teachings.

Gnostic teachings are not inspired text.

Anything that appears or looks like Christianity and it came out of Egypt is gnostic. Great toilet paper.


a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

The Demiurge mythology does go back a ways, like Plato, or even further. Tbh, I think Gnostics to be more satirical, an secular compared to what would be Christianity back then. Might of been akin to alchemy and atheist like philosophy, with some scientific truths.

For exampke:
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?

Epicurus

Also the first book of the Pistis Sophia, being about Jesus's Vest an repeating " and the light was about me" and him screwing around with the cosmos and the archons revolved around him.

originally posted by: PuRe EnErGy
Was the Gnostic "Jesus Christ" trying to make people aware they were in a simulation?

Not exactly a "simulation," but more like a false reality. Christian gnosis is recognizing that the god described in the Torah is not the actual and true creator entity but instead a demiurge called Saklas or Yadalbaoth (depending who you talk to) who is very powerful and created this reality of pain and death we all exist in. The true creator is beyond comprehension. The Old Testament God is insane.

Knowing this, Jesus taught that since we're trapped here until we die, with nothing we do making any difference, nstead of making a crappy situation even worse, why don't we try being kind to each other instead of always trying to screw the other guy over to get more useless stuff?

It's not a bad idea, really. But it's a hard sell, and the Gnostics eventually lost out to the Big Church, which could charge people for a promise of a glorious heaven. Gnosticism, or Enlightenment, doesn't require a church. And women are pretty on par with men. Just not a good business model.

But yeah. Not real reality.

originally posted by: DeathSlayer
There is no truth in Gnostic teachings.

Gnostic teachings are not inspired text.

Anything that appears or looks like Christianity and it came out of Egypt is gnostic. Great toilet paper.


a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

Being the foul lies that it is, may make it toilet paper. But I think it would be more useful as a starter, for a camp fire.

originally posted by: DeathSlayer
There is no truth in Gnostic teachings.

Oh, I don't know. There's some solid truth in, "Know what is in front of your face and what is hidden from you will be disclosed to you.". I know a lot of people who could benefit by that.

a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

1. Science suggests that conciousness is derived from brain activity. Whereas religion tells us that conciousness is derived from our soul. So artificial conciousness can never attain human conciousness. It can only mimic conciousness.

2. Those not born of woman are born of the Father (aka spiritually). They don't identify their self with their limited brains ego-self that is born from a woman. They identify themself with all of creation that is born of the Father.

Unfortuantely those ruled by their ego will not accept the absolute truth. So religion goes to great lengths to obscure certain truths using double entendre's to comfort the egocentric.

Of cause all of above is only my opinion.

originally posted by: DeathSlayer
There is no truth in Gnostic teachings.

Gnostic teachings are not inspired text.

Anything that appears or looks like Christianity and it came out of Egypt is gnostic. Great toilet paper.


a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

What if Christianity is a white washed version of Gnostic theology?

What if the way Christ was presenting the Gnostic material in relation to the Jewish tradition caused them to feel threatened and demand his crucifixion?

and therefore Christianity actually has nothing to do with Christ and isn't inspired ...

I mean, the Roman Catholic Church is the furthest thing away from Christ and his teachings.... so it would stand to reason it has nothing to do with him.

a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

Or what IF the gnostic writers just gave us more to what He taught, and some of it the governing church didn't like... so they eliminated the threat of losing their rule

I'm open to accepting that... it seems like John the Baptist was an important figure to Jesus Christ and I've debated with myself whether he was a practicing "gnostic" for lack of a better term at the time.


The problem I have with the whole "heresy" argument is that the Gnostic narrative laid out in the collection of texts in the Nag Hammadi library makes way more sense theologically speaking than the Jewish/Christian version of events.

The fact that these texts remained from the public until they were found in 1945 speaks volumes to me about how the Church viewed them as a threat.

The fourth book of Maccabees was especially puzzling when reading how people would endure such torture for the tripe they push in traditional churches.

It makes more sense to me that those believers ... weren't exactly believing the "permitted" narrative ...

a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

A lot of the teaching in the gospels are in gnostic teaching actually... which is why i find it amusing that Christians completely dismiss them...

I wrote this a few years back... was planning on doing a series on it but i never got past part two lol

The First Synod of ATS: The Gospel of Thomas

a reply to: Akragon

on this account and my older account, I posted quite a bit about the gnostic materials around 2006 ... it's always been super fascinating to me.

a reply to: PuRe EnErGy

Originally posted by PuRe EnErGy
It immediately made me think of saying 15 in the Gospel of Thomas.

15. Jesus said, "When you see one who was not born of woman, fall on your faces and worship. That one is your Father."

a conscious AI definitely seems to fit saying 15 perfectly...

What are your thoughts?

That verse is not talking about Artificial Intelligence…imo

Verse 15 is hinting at becoming born of Spirit i.e. not born of woman or the flesh etc…It’s about finding the Spirit of life, and the Father within ourselves.

It has a very close parallel to the verses John 3:3-4 in the New Testament.

John 3:3-4
Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again.”

4 “How can someone be born when they are old?” Nicodemus asked. “Surely they cannot enter a second time into their mother’s womb to be born!”

I personally don’t believe any form of AI will ever become sentient, or have the ability to make “freewill” choices. AI only has the illusion of making choices through utilising pseudo random number generators.

But those are all forced sequences, which can be worked out in advance if one knows the exact mathematical formulae used. Therefore it’s not pure randomness and only gives the appearance of “freewill” choice.


- JC