Masking Conundrum

Yesterday, Supreme Court Justice Samuel Alito said mandatory lockdown and masking reduces FREEDOMS in America.

www.foxnews.com...

RESIST.

originally posted by: chiefsmom
I've really been thinking about the mask issue.
Why are gloves not required?

Because if the virus can now last on surface for a long time, think about everything you touch when out and about. Money, door handles, countertops, carts, items on shelves that others may have touched.

Certainly a lot more to this, than just a mask. As there always was.

The reasons gloves are not required:

First, understand that in order to cause an infection, a sufficient number of coronaviruses have to come in contact with your mucus membranes (eyes, mouth, nasal sinuses, lungs). That's referred to as the infectious dose. One or two viruses won't do it.

"Some experts estimate that exposure to as few as 1000 SARS-CoV-2 viral particles can cause an infection. This dose of virus could occur by inhaling 1000 infectious viral particles in a single breath, 100 viral particles in 10 breaths, or 10 viral particles in 100 breaths."

www.clinlabnavigator.com...

It is now understood that the coronavirus is predominantly spread by direct inhalation of aerosols that are exhaled into the air from infected people. There were some cases early on where people apparently contracted the infection from handling a salt shaker that was also used by an infected individual, etc., but those cases are rare. That's because as soon as a viral particle finds it way to a surface somewhere, it immediately starts the process of falling apart. That process takes different amounts of time, depending on exactly what the surface is made of, but the only time when viruses are not degrading is when they are actually inside a host cell and actively reproducing themselves.

So viruses find their way to a surface somewhere and some fraction of them have become degraded to become non-infectious by the time you come along and touch that surface and transfer some of them to your fingers. Your fingers don't pick up all the viruses on the surface, only a fraction of them. Then you touch your face and leave some of the viruses on the skin of your face. Then you touch your skin again and rub your eyes or pick your nose. That's the pathway by which you could possibly become infected, but at every step the dose of virus that you are transferring is diluted. So it's much less likely that you will transfer an infectious dose to your mucus membranes this way than by direct inhalation.

Also, gloves are just as capable of picking up viruses from surfaces and transferring them to your skin, etc. as your fingers are. If you went through the same process of touching an infected surface, touching your face, rubbing your eyes, etc. while wearing gloves, the result would be the same as if you weren't wearing gloves. The only way to break that chain is to not touch your face if you have touched a possibly contaminated surface until after you have washed your hands thoroughly enough to have removed any viruses you may have picked up.

That said, I will sometimes wear gloves if I'm going in a high-traffic public place where there is a higher probability of contacting a contaminated surface only because it is easier and quicker to wash gloves than to wash your hands. The skin of your hands is porous and can trap viruses much easier than the nonporous surface of nitrile gloves.

a reply to: 1947boomer

So we're back to the original question: does the mask work or not?

If they work, the governor is correct. If they don't, then the mayor is, but why are we all wearing them expecting them to work the way we're told they absolutely do?

Also, I already said my husband prefers the gloves as a reminder not to touch his face. Masks encourage facial touching because they are forever slipping around or causing glasses to fog, etc.

a reply to: ketsuko

Imagine walking a mile through the woods to your best friend's, using the same path you've used since you were old enough to remember, maybe getting a little startled when out of nowhere a squirrel runs across the path just in front of you. While you're sitting at your friend's house, you see an alert on the news that a serial rapist and murderer broke out of prison earlier that week and is thought to be hiding out in the woods you walk through all the time. Fear takes over while you're walking down that familiar path and this time the squirrel not only startles you, but causes you to freeze in fear and panic. You can't think about your next decision or what direction to take now. All you can think about is dying, you're driven by fear, irrational. In the end, it turns out that the escapee is a guy who was in jail for breaking into his ex girlfriend's car to take his jacket back and had been released and the media had it all wrong. From this point, even though the media had it all wrong, every step you take through those woods is a cautious step because the fear of an escaped serial rapist and murderer hiding out in those woods is burned into the back of your mind.

This is what it looks like before coronavirus, during coronavirus, and what it will be like after coronavirus if the media doesn't quit stoking the flames of fear.

originally posted by: mysterioustranger
a reply to: ketsuko

Simple answer: they are a barrier. Period.

Next surgery for the kids or yourself...tell 'em to take off the masks during so they can cough, spit, breathe into the open wounds.

It explains masks: Hepatitis I caught? '93-- no mask, little gloves...all around biohazard waste, bodies etc.

Who walks around with their chest cavity split open or a large gash with meat hanging out and masklessly stand there talking to other maskless people? A mask for people in your field of work was mandatory before this virus ever came here because of what you do. Do you think we should wear a reflective vest, hardhat, and safety glasses like oilfield and construction workers, too? Not to mention, those barriers you speak of aren't helping very much. Infection rates in cities with strict mask rules are higher than the cities that have very lax mask rules.

originally posted by: LSU2018

originally posted by: mysterioustranger
a reply to: ketsuko

Simple answer: they are a barrier. Period.

Next surgery for the kids or yourself...tell 'em to take off the masks during so they can cough, spit, breathe into the open wounds.

It explains masks: Hepatitis I caught? '93-- no mask, little gloves...all around biohazard waste, bodies etc.

Who walks around with their chest cavity split open or a large gash with meat hanging out and masklessly stand there talking to other maskless people? A mask for people in your field of work was mandatory before this virus ever came here because of what you do. Do you think we should wear a reflective vest, hardhat, and safety glasses like oilfield and construction workers, too? Not to mention, those barriers you speak of aren't helping very much. Infection rates in cities with strict mask rules are higher than the cities that have very lax mask rules.

Hooold on here...I am not a mask proponent. And I'm a 1st Responder. I don't care what anyone does or doesn't do about masks.

For all my years and exp? I (we've ) always washed our hands, stay away from close crowds...wear masks if people are hacking...or whatever. Or not.

We've done it like this...and of which these things never changed:

Gloves
Wash hands
Don't touch face
Mask

So...nothing new for us. Everyone else is complaining. We don't care, because all day, everyday...it's been the same to us.

Constant, repetitive exposure...and we only use the above. So...? We get it...others should...or not. Your call...your body.

Peace

a reply to: mysterioustranger

You made it sound like Ket should ask the doctor and nurses to remove their masks next time she or her kids go under the knife so she can see the good that masks do.

I'm saying that it's a mandatory thing in your field of work to keep the things you've mentioned out of open wounds, etc. Cities with mandatory mask rules are getting the virus as much or more than people in cities with lax mask rules. I remember people in hospitals wearing full body suits when this first broke and they were still catching the virus.

a reply to: LSU2018

Nope. Me n Ketsuko are ok...I think. Didn't mean anything other than folks will or won't heed caution.

Mandatory anything? Is usually some uppence of precautionary care.

I don't have the time or energy to break it down for anybody.

In a nutshell...and along a "grand scheme" of historical facts, and demonstrable positive results....are evident with use of barriers.*

*Pfffft!

...and I wish folks would, knowing half won't, it's ok

I got mine...

originally posted by: chiefsmom

I've really been thinking about the mask issue.
Why are gloves not required?

Here's what I've been wondering about the mask issue: where are the laws?

All I see are "mandates" that people are required to follow that are supposed to be enforced by law enforcement. That's not the way our government is supposed to work. There has been plenty of time for every legislative body in the nation to address this issue.

Democrats have complained about Trump's handling of this plague of plagues, but I don't recall a single bill being offered up for a signature or even a vote. State and local legislatures have also been conspicuously quiet. Everyone seems to want the executive branch to rule by decree.

I saw a recently produced episode NCIS tonight.

The good guys were wearing masks at all times.

The bad guys never wore masks.

The bad guys looked more dignified!