Another Software Source for Fraud --Scytl. Clarity. Electronic Software and Systems

originally posted by: opethPA
Not trying to derail the original thread but I 100% agree with the following..

originally posted by: SleeperHasAwakened
Google "security by obscurity" to understand why what you propose, corporatising OSS, is an abjectly terrible idea.

QFE over and over.

If anyone doesn't understand all the details of everything else that was really well written in your post then focus on those three words in quotes. "Security By Obscurity" should never be viewed as a valid approach to Infosec , private data, intellectual property and so on.

Kevin Mitnick, along with multiple other qualified sources, has spokenwritten a few times around the dangers of believing this type of concept , "My business is so small, no one uses my app, our product isnt important, our data isn't valuable outside our business, we have customized it so much no one will give the effort and because of that no one will ever try to exploit us."

This is exactly the type of target that bad actors (state or independent) have successfully , currently do and will continue to focus on as viable attack vectors.

Thanks Opeth, star given.

I got a little heated on the subject matter partly because I've seen the other participant in this thread slam some of our less IT-oriented members on the forum (turns out maybe that person isn't authorative as they'd like themselves to appear), but mostly because I've seen the horror show of what "internal forking" introduces into a platform.

"Um, I think I'll tweak the AES-CBC implementation here in OpenSSL so it's customized for our use case".

No. Don't do that. The upstream maintainers and originators of the project are EXPERTS at cryptography, and the source of the upstream algorithm was likely transcribed from an algorithm created by someone better at maths than you or myself. PLUS, when the inevitable vulns in AES-CBC are discovered (e.g. oracle padding) and announced, IF you stick with the upstream library, you can simply switch over to a newer/more secure encryption options like AES-GCM.

"Forking", which for those not familiar with software means essentially copy/pasting the source code of a project so you can customize it to your liking, in a private setting, and in a corporate setting this is usually done to gain an economic leg up, is /sometimes/ not such a bad option, but for high security sensitive applications, not such a good idea, because you have just eliminated the benefit of scrutiny and feedback from the community, peers and subject matter experts.

The security analysts at our firm, in conjunction with myself and others, have been laboring against this invalid assumption and trying to unwind years of poor practices in this realm.

Trust me, the very LAST thing anybody should want would be to take a critical piece of software intended to field election ballots and 'inner source' it at a private firm. You should want that out in the open, transparent, available for all to see, confirm, verify and trust. "Securing" and protecting the platform for malevolent actors DOESN'T come from hiding the source code, it comes from sound security engineering and operational practices AROUND the code, in the periphery and even inside your infrastructure.

Just like anything else, the light of day (i.e. millions of watching eyes) is a terrific disinfectant and ward against infestation.

Actually I think that is in a STATE run house. I remember seeing this on a documentary I saw. Beyond that I saw the 14th amendment to the constitution. VERY Smart our Founding Fathers.
reply to: RickyD

originally posted by: SleeperHasAwakened
Want an efficient, reliable, secure voting system? It CAN be achieved technologically, but it will cost $$$, it will need very careful nurturing to remain APOLITICAL, open and fair, and IMO the gub'mt must MUST take point on this carefully vet and supervise WHO is involved and HOW they implement it.

If you've ever frozen your credit before you'll know right away where I'm going with this.

Set up a website, make it as secure as you can. You log in with your name, address and social. If those fields match the information on the other side you get a "pin", either you pick some random 12 digit number or it's auto generated. You write this down or print it. You make your voting choices and submit.

At any point in time, even after the election, you can log back into said website, enter your pin and see how you voted. If your vote is changed there's a big button that says "contest" or something.

This wouldn't be hard or expensive. All three credit bereaus do it already and they aren't the US government.

a reply to: litterbaux

Sadly I must agree with you. I think generally speaking the resistance to moving the voting to a secure digital platform is more around tolerance/acceptance of inefficiencies and procedural 'loop holes' that exist in the system today, that either side thinks it can exploit better than the other.

To your point: so digitizing peoples' hard earned $$$ is OK and permissible, but digitizing who they vote for ..... is not??

o_O

Does not compute. Conduct a blind poll of the public, and ask them if they fear digital vulnerability more impacting their PERSONAL finances/credit, or public elections. Some % of people conduct their business "cash only" and couldn't care less, the rest that use credit cards, banks, EFT, will say they care more about securing their personal wealth than voting.

So if electronic finance "works" for you, why can't voting?

We The People are not meant to have accurate "to the penny" transactional voting, 'twould seem.

I wonder why....

originally posted by: SleeperHasAwakened
a reply to: AScrubWhoDied

You just showed you have NO IDEA what you're talking about pursuant to software.

The most secure remote shell access system on the planet Earth OpenSSH is .........

Open Source

The most widely used encryption library on the planet OpenSSL is

Open Source

OpenSSL is entering the realm of cryptology and I absolutely agree with these technologies being open. Everyone needs encryption, and standards are great.

You know that openSSL is relatively secure because its almost impossible to exploit with our CURRENT LEVEL OF TECH.
Implementing a standard that does one thing != building an entire application. To compare these two is stretching' completely. We WILL need to revisit the implementation of openssl once hardware progresses sufficiently.

As far as the rest, it seems you've taken the position that if software is propriety then developers must have slacked and cut corners and ignored the concept of building secure software from the ground up.


There's a very good reason why your bank's reconciliations arent open source. There is a very good reason why the FICO algorithm isn't open source. That's not so say these things arent using open source libraries, packages etc.. but != the entire application.

a reply to: SleeperHasAwakened

You said yourself in your post, cheating happens on both sides, whomever cheats the best wins. Everyone knows it. Dead people have been voting since the first vote I'd wager.

originally posted by: AScrubWhoDied

originally posted by: SleeperHasAwakened
a reply to: AScrubWhoDied

You just showed you have NO IDEA what you're talking about pursuant to software.

The most secure remote shell access system on the planet Earth OpenSSH is .........

Open Source

The most widely used encryption library on the planet OpenSSL is

Open Source

OpenSSL is entering the realm of cryptology and I absolutely agree with these technologies being open. Everyone needs encryption, and standards are great.

You know that openSSL is relatively secure because its almost impossible to exploit with our CURRENT LEVEL OF TECH.
Implementing a standard that does one thing != building an entire application. To compare these two is stretching' completely. We WILL need to revisit the implementation of openssl once hardware progresses sufficiently.

As far as the rest, it seems you've taken the position that if software is propriety then developers must have slacked and cut corners and ignored the concept of building secure software from the ground up.


There's a very good reason why your bank's reconciliations arent open source. There is a very good reason why the FICO algorithm isn't open source. That's not so say these things arent using open source libraries, packages etc.. but != the entire application.

I have no problem with DATA being private, but the mechanisms and formulae to arrive at the conclusions to which the data brings us, should not, CAN NOT be private.

Everybody's individual vote record CAN and MUST be private. The code to tabulate and prove the outcome of the aggregate voting records CAN and MUST be public. This is the very essence of open source software, and modern tech is replete with examples of this (blockchain, cryptographically secure comms, email clients, instant messaging)

Comparing means for calculating one person's credit rating to that of a system that would be trusted and have the power to elect the POTUS is a false dichotomy, and I know you know this. One involves a system of rating an individual's financial trustworthiness; it was created as an economic shorthand by tPTB. The other is a hypothetical system for bringing our sacred franchise from over 200 years of a nation, yours, mine, everybody's in the US, into the 21st century. This deserves the most careful and open/honest handling imaginable. I would not entrust it to corporate stakeholders.

originally posted by: SleeperHasAwakened

originally posted by: AScrubWhoDied

originally posted by: SleeperHasAwakened
a reply to: AScrubWhoDied

You just showed you have NO IDEA what you're talking about pursuant to software.

The most secure remote shell access system on the planet Earth OpenSSH is .........

Open Source

The most widely used encryption library on the planet OpenSSL is

Open Source

OpenSSL is entering the realm of cryptology and I absolutely agree with these technologies being open. Everyone needs encryption, and standards are great.

You know that openSSL is relatively secure because its almost impossible to exploit with our CURRENT LEVEL OF TECH.
Implementing a standard that does one thing != building an entire application. To compare these two is stretching' completely. We WILL need to revisit the implementation of openssl once hardware progresses sufficiently.

As far as the rest, it seems you've taken the position that if software is propriety then developers must have slacked and cut corners and ignored the concept of building secure software from the ground up.


There's a very good reason why your bank's reconciliations arent open source. There is a very good reason why the FICO algorithm isn't open source. That's not so say these things arent using open source libraries, packages etc.. but != the entire application.

I have no problem with DATA being private, but the mechanisms and formulae to arrive at the conclusions to which the data brings us, should not, CAN NOT be private.

Everybody's individual vote record CAN and MUST be private. The code to tabulate and prove the outcome of the aggregate voting records CAN and MUST be public. This is the very essence of open source software, and modern tech is replete with examples of this (blockchain, cryptographically secure comms, email clients, instant messaging)

Comparing means for calculating one person's credit rating to that of a system that would be trusted and have the power to elect the POTUS is a false dichotomy, and I know you know this. One involves a system of rating an individual's financial trustworthiness; it was created as an economic shorthand by tPTB. The other is a hypothetical system for bringing our sacred franchise from over 200 years of a nation, yours, mine, everybody's in the US, into the 21st century. This deserves the most careful and open/honest handling imaginable. I would not entrust it to corporate stakeholders.

I understand exactly, I just dont agree. This isnt software where to exploit is to simply gain money, you've the potential to shape the entire course of nation.

I can assure you, when a Russian state actor discovers a vulnerability, he's going to be in no rush to submit a pull request. The same for all of Americas enemies.

This would become one of the single most valuable targets in the world.

I could be wrong because this is secondhand information, but the agency rolls 100% inhouse for EVERYTHING and it makes sense given the nature of their work

TGP Speaks With Sen. Patrick Colbeck: TCF computers were connected to Internet During Vote Counting

Links to an 18 min video on Brighteon. The Gateway Pundent Speaks With Sen. Patrick Colbeck: TCF computers were connected to Internet During Vote Counting. Talks about some of the computer problems going on voting day.

a reply to: AScrubWhoDied

Alright, well, we can agree to disagree, I've stated my case, and you've put forward yours.

I felt a little upset at myself for slamming you so hard after I wrote my original reply last night, in large part because the notion of "internal forking" of OSS has been a bit of a hassle at our company. So I apologize for the nastiness of my initial reaction to your post; I should have made my point in a less heated and demeaning way.

BTW we still haven't covered the second biggest downside of "internal forking", behind loss of audit/peer review from the community at large.

People are so dense - a NSA contractor came out with proof that socalled encryption was being created in house and diseminated, you might remember ol ed snowden. - It doesnt matter if you have access codes, sit at the point of encryption or just have classified systems that can defeat it - no code goes into use that the NSA cannot defeat, period.

To do so would be a threat to national security and then the government comes and says play ball or go to secret jail - same reason only morons would believe bitcoin is going to challenge the soverignty of the world monitary system - no matter how many dark markets that use it get shut down and all its members arrested, b3CuZ they r is not smart and use gmail when buying missles and kilos of coke...

right.

Next you'll tell me your iphone is secure, hint - it's not.

The only way to do a fair election is federal ID's used - both parties can challenge the list, it's only 140 million voters and they should have 3 months or whatever to do so - then you come in an pen your ballot where a camera can see the area clearly and then both parties representives get to approve or challenge it.

its basically the same system as now except with ID and no glitchware.

a reply to: kwakakev

I watched that video earlier today. It makes sense.

Sharpies and boxes of ballots in the night while real, are a distraction. I never really understood how it all gets tabulated beyond the precinct/county level.

So we have private companies who tabulate the data, here in the states and off shore in real time. Not suspicious at all.

What really burst my bubble was the example of the Texas 2018 election. The FBI knew about this, evidence and all. It did nothing. The DOJ will make a lot of smoke now but do nothing. It's pure and simple leverage for them. Don't mess with our budgets or mess with the way we do business. Or else.

I'm posting this for reference for the work that has been done on this. If you want to deny voter fraud you better start making your case. I believe the Trump campaign got their hands on this as well:

EVERY THING YOU'RE ABOUT TO READ IS VERIFIED AND WAS MADE BY THIS PEDE; HE DID ALL THE HEAVY WORK

🏆 thedonald.win... 🏆

BTW IF YOU CAN HELP DOWNLOAD EVERYTHING AND KEEP A LOCAL COPY.. IN THE CODE WHERE YOU CAN GET INFO FOR ALL THE STATES, DOWNLOAD FOR ALL THE STATES.

REMINDER: THIS DOESN'T TAKE INTO ACCOUNT ALL THE HUNDRED THOUSANDS OF TRUMP VOTES DESTROYED, BURNED AND RIPPED APART, THE THOUSANDS OF BALLOTS JUST MARKED FOR BIDEN. THIS IS THE EVIDENCE WE'VE FOUND SO FAR.

PEDES GET IN HERE. I saw the video on The Gateway Pundit [ www.thegatewaypundit.com... ] and I decided to do some digging of my own, into a more reputable source that can verify that the glitch was indeed real, and that it affected the votes, instead of it being just a display glitch on that news channel. So I went digging into the Edison data [ static01.nyt.com...] and I found this damning evidence [ i.maga.host... ]. As can be seen in the image, only 54 votes were added, but the ratio changed in Biden's favor by a whole 0.6%! This is proof that not only did the glitch happen, but it doesn't seem to have been reverted at all.

EDIT : BIG UPDATE, I made a script to run through the data and gather all instances where votes switched from Trump to Biden, Lost Votes means that the total amount of votes counted decreased by that amount throughout the counting. I've only done states that use Dominion Voting Systems so far.

EDIT 2: Added ALL the states, and separated by voting systems, although no state uses exclusively one system as far as I know.

Edit 3: Re-ordered the states, first by switched votes, then by lost votes.

🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨🚨

Switched votes are votes that were taken from Trump and given to Biden.

Lost votes are voted that disappeared during the counting, from both candidates.

There might be a small overlap between Switched votes and Lost votes.

Dominion Voting Systems :

Pennsylvania : Switched : 220,883 Lost Votes : 941,248

New Jersey : Switched : 80,242 Lost Votes : 20

Florida : Switched : 21,422 Lost Votes : 456

Michigan : Switched : 20,213 Lost Votes : 21,882

New York : Switched : 18,124 Lost Votes : 623,213

Georgia : Switched : 17,407 Lost Votes : 33,574

Ohio : Switched : 14,965 Lost Votes : 5,102

Virginia : Switched : 12,163 Lost Votes : 789,023

California : Switched : 7,701 Lost Votes : 10,989

Arizona : Switched : 4,492 Lost Votes : 0

Minnesota : Switched : 2,766 Lost Votes : 195,650

Tennessee : Switched : 2,330 Lost Votes : 0

Louisiana : Switched : 2,322 Lost Votes : 0

Illinois : Switched : 2,166 Lost Votes : 54,730

Wisconsin : Switched : 2,078 Lost Votes : 3,408

Colorado : Switched : 1,809 Lost Votes : 0

Utah : Switched : 1,627 Lost Votes : 0

New Hampshire : Switched : 973 Lost Votes : 116

Iowa : Switched : 938 Lost Votes : 477

New Mexico : Switched : 268 Lost Votes : 4,610

Missouri : Switched 0 : Lost Votes : 20,730

Nevada : Switched : 0 Lost Votes : 0

Alaska : Switched : 0 Lost Votes : 0

Washington : Switched : 0 Lost Votes : 0

Hawaii : Switched : 0 Lost Votes : 0

Kansas and Texas use Premier Election Solutions, owned by Dominion Voting Systems.

Texas : Switched : 14,954 Lost Votes : 30,557

Kansas : Switched : 1,674 Lost Votes : 2,154

Election Systems & Software :

Nebraska : Switched : 30,086 Lost Votes : 50

Kentucky : Switched : 8,129 Lost Votes : 23,849

Arkansas : Switched : 3,664 Lost Votes : 20,748

South Carolina : Switched : 2,779 Lost Votes : 2,119

Montana : Switched : 2,330 Lost Votes : 1,276

South Dakota : Switched : 1,347 Lost Votes : 1

North Dakota : Switched : 234 Lost Votes : 681

Maryland : Switched : 203 Lost Votes : 0

North Carolina : Switched : 0 Lost Votes : 15

District of Columbia : Switched : 0 Lost Votes : 0

Unknown Systems:

Nebraska : Switched : 30,086 Lost Votes : 50

Connecticut : Switched : 3,834 Lost Votes : 272

Massachusetts : Switched : 3,613 Lost Votes : 51

Oregon : Switched 2,557 Lost Votes : 0

Alabama : Switched : 1,170 Lost Votes : 408

Mississippi : Switched : 355 Lost Votes : 0

Maine : Switched : 271 Lost Votes : 35

Rhode Island : Switched : 6 Lost Votes : 13

West Virginia : Switched : 0 Lost Votes : 78,300

Idaho : Switched 0 Lost Votes : 0

Oklahoma : Switched : 0 Lost Votes : 0

Indiana : Switched : 0 Lost Votes : 0

Delaware : Switched : 0 Lost Votes : 0

Vermont : Switched : 0 Lost Votes : 0

NOTE : Lost votes are votes that disappeared, not only for Trump, but overall.

VERIFIED!!!!:

I went looking through the data I got from my script, trying to find if the moment the Antrim glitch happened in Michigan is there. And it is. Here is the Data. [ static01.nyt.com... ]

And here is the specific part when the switch happened. [ i.maga.host... ]

You can see in that picture, that Trump lost 3,096 votes, those all went to Biden. BUT, Trump also lost 2,324 votes, that went nowhere.

SOURCES: Here is the data I used:

EDISON DATA: static01.nyt.com...

workupload.com...

The data is from Edison Research, it is used for election coverage by at least ABC News, CBS News, CNN and NBC News. It is also used for the website of the NYT, and probably others as well.

I scraped the data from the NYT website, here [ static01.nyt.com... ] to check for other states, replace "pennsylvania" in the link with the state you want to check, for states that have spaces in their names, like new york, write new-york instead.

Take this picture for example. [ i.maga.host... ]

It's like this:

Nr.187 : 2,984,468(Total votes) * 0.566(Trump share of the votes) = 1,689,208.888

Nr.188 : 2,984,522 * 0.56 = 1,671,332.32

Do the same thing for Biden, and you'll see that he gained the votes that Trump lost.

I made a program that basically checks every single change in votes, does the above to check if votes were switched, then adds them all up to get the total amount of switched votes.

Here is the link to a rar file containing all the .json files for the states, and the fraudcatch.py file, you'd need to download python 3.8.2 to use it, click EDIT with idle, then in the window that pops up click Run, to check how many votes were switched from Trump to Biden in a state, you then type findfraud('hawaii') for example, replace hawaii with the name of the file of the state you want to check, the file for new hampshire is named newhamp for example, so findfraud('newhamp'), to check the total lost votes (For both candidates) do lostvotes('newhamp') for example. workupload.com...

[pede444wow] I took the json files that are included here, and wrote a python script to convert the critical data to one csv file, so you can analyze it in excel:

python script: https:///Q6nTP04N

result csv file: (download and save to csv file, then open in excel) h

a reply to: daskakik

By their own admission, the leftist loons did not see Donald Trump as any kind of threat. They thought they had it in the bag. LOL.

I'm probably the only person in the world who'd make this association, but when I first saw the name of this company, my mind went to a chatacter in Herbert's Dune series.

Scytale

Scytale is a face dancer, a genetically created organism that can mimic the appearance and behavior of any other person down to minutea so small as to be undetectable.

This software company is mimicking that behavior in a strangely synchronous fashion.

originally posted by: maya27
By their own admission, the leftist loons did not see Donald Trump as any kind of threat. They thought they had it in the bag. LOL.

How would members on ATS talking about a CT show what leftist loons were thinking, one way or the other?

My point was that the rigged voting machine CT, usually linked to Soros in some way, has no traction when the dems lose in a presidential election.

a reply to: daskakik

Computer corruption/fraud has no place in any election, on any candidate.
And is a HUGE danger to free elections in a democratic society.

I mean really.....SMH
It MUST be the job of a free press to alert the citizens of dangers to the Republic.
At least it should be.

a reply to: DontTreadOnMe
What are you shaking your head about?

I pointed out that the computer corruption/fraud talk around here was less in 2016 than 2020 and, IIRC, not pointed at Trump after he won.

That isn't me condoning it or condemning anyone for investigating. It's just an observation.

a reply to: daskakik

Okay, fair enough.

I wonder if the whole computer thing is more deeply embedded in the process now that four plus years ago, couple with the fact the there were way more ballots....more than any other election in history.

I actually do remember problems with the votes in 2016, recounts, fraud mentioned in Detroit/Wayne county, slow counts, court involvement. It went on for days.

originally posted by: DontTreadOnMe
a reply to: daskakik

Computer corruption/fraud has no place in any election, on any candidate.
And is a HUGE danger to free elections in a democratic society.

I mean really.....SMH
It MUST be the job of a free press to alert the citizens of dangers to the Republic.
At least it should be.

No reason to alert the citizens when they are in on it ... wonder how much they got paid.