Could you subdue a handcuffed man?

This past weekend at a bbq things got heated about the recent events.

So a man just under 6ft and about 190lbs handcuffed himself behind his back and asked for volunteers to try and subdue him

Not one women could get close,,it was too dangerous.
Not one man could do anything, this guy was kicking, flailing, throwing his head back,, rolling on the ground.
So then 2 men try and still struggle.

Its took about 3 guys to completely stop the guy from moving. 3 guys laying on this one man.

The point was to show the dangers of the job and after a broken nose, stitches, aids prevention shots from being bitten.

You body and mind go into a different kind of defense mode when having to deal with that weekly.

a reply to: Bloodworth

yes - i could - but my methods would offend and outrage " someone "

my response is simples - if he didnt need subdueing - he would not have to be subdued

it really is that simple

originally posted by: ignorant_ape
a reply to: Bloodworth

yes - i could - but my methods would offend and outrage " someone "

my response is simples - if he didnt need subdueing - he would not have to be subdued

it really is that simple

Yeah I forgot to add , could you subdue civilly.
Lol

a reply to: Bloodworth

A Taser should do the job.

There *are* circumstances which require subdueing. But the stakes for these are so low.

originally posted by: Bloodworth
This past weekend at a bbq things got heated about the recent events.

So a man just under 6ft and about 190lbs handcuffed himself behind his back and asked for volunteers to try and subdue him

Not one women could get close,,it was too dangerous.
Not one man could do anything, this guy was kicking, flailing, throwing his head back,, rolling on the ground.
So then 2 men try and still struggle.

Its took about 3 guys to completely stop the guy from moving. 3 guys laying on this one man.

The point was to show the dangers of the job and after a broken nose, stitches, aids prevention shots from being bitten.

You body and mind go into a different kind of defense mode when having to deal with that weekly.

For christs sakes we all grow up wresteling with other people....lets get real....once the cuffs are on you are not going anywhere...you may try to but you aren't really achieving anything but a delay of process...so de-escalation by LEOs is the solution clearly...they know it and refuse to do it.

If you want to run away with cuffs on ok lets go for a Jog together...no problems no threat to anyone else you are cuffed...a little retarded or screwed up wanting to go for a jog @ a time like that but not a threat to anyone....if you are in a Stolen car but are not shooting at the police and have not brandished a weapon and no LEO lies of IT LOOOKED LIKE A GUN BUL##HIT EITHER.....you are only attempting to evade custody and can not be executed for it....if you drive that car in the direction of a LEO during your escape you cannot be executed for it.....they cannot legally stand their ground then execute you for refusing a verbal command then claiming their lives were in danger...they have to move their arses out of the way ...their verbal commands mean jack #...those are requests not demands and they cannot be backed up by execution which is what is happening in many Countries around the World.

People who are high on drugs or Drunk or flat out Bonkers need supervised medical intervention not just handcuffs and choke holds and escalation...obviously...so clearly we need health professionals in Uniform to on scene or available ASAP in real time.

We can clearly see when Negotiation was forsaken for execution....and its all a legal issue caused by Unions and other negative regressive influences.One or two 100 million dollar lawsut settlements against the Cities that employ these criminals and the trouble will stop immediately...its just a situation where to many Judges over to many years were corrupted or forced by graft to make weaponised Cabal sympathetic decisions that ended up bastardizing the entire System.

So yes,you can subdue a person in Handcuffs...easily....its all just a matter of WHEN...if you aren't power tripping and free to execute and abuse then you will wait it out and be patient....if you are legally authorised to execute on the spot for refusing a verbal command then that is what will happen....we know which corrupt weaponised legal decisions were made by which Judges that took us here...we can easily redact those decisions and fix things...easily if we stop lieing about it and deal with it properly.

How far do you think a 6'4 dude whacked out on drugs is really going to run?...what threat does he really represent?....seriously...because as we can see these are actually life and death questions and some claim a man must die for not obeying verbal commands and for trying to escape...this is a legally vetted evidenced fact...so how far is he really going with cuffs n and what clear and present terminal threat could he possibly present to the Public?

By the way...why were we "subdueing" anyone to begin with.....are we taking someone into custody or subdueing them because those are 2 different things and do not go together...you escort someone into custody and no one is holding a Stopwatch timing you.....so you don't get to add SUBDUE to your toolbox to hurry things up...because subdue leads to murder and we all dam well know it.

If you are in handcuffs you are already in Custody.

I can tie thug's hands to his legs using our belts and throw him in a car like a bag of potatoes. I dont need to MMA him for 14 minutes to break his will first. They should hunt us with tranquilizer darts and nets like animals. It's more humane. Why are animals allowed to fight for freedom without being tamed or killed but not humans? Even a rabbit will claw your hands.
It was about time for a healthy public discussion.

a reply to: one4all

I wrestled a few years in HS, and I rolled jits until I hurt my neck, and was about a blue belt. I am 6' 200lbs (not fat but not shredded anymore either), and I know there is no way any normal man (I am discounting running into The Mountain from GoT) could subdue me by himself without getting seriously injured, trying to stick me into a claustrophobic area.

Then you feed me some amphetamine, and it's game over. I'd be gone, and they'd be clutching their balls and trying to stop the bleeding form their nose, lol. I think you are underestimating how strong people can be, and how animalistic when they don't want be forced to do something.

a reply to: Bloodworth

This just sounds like a pointless exercise of machismo.

Spray the guy in handcuffs in the face with mace and don't invite him to your BBQs anymore.

thread starter you are talking about regular people..Police are TRAINED to deal with people....here is a policeman dave Bissonnette who trains the police

June 3 at 2:33 PM
I’ve had numerous people approach me and ask me my opinion regarding the police use of force in Minneapolis. I normally don’t speak out like this in such a public forum but my heart is broken with what I am witnessing across the country and right here in our own state and I feel the need to say something.

I have been a police officer for 19 years. For 16 of those years, I have taught Use of Force and Police Arrest & Control techniques at the recruit level at the Municipal Police Academy and at numerous departments throughout southern New England on an in-service level. I have trained thousands of cops. My training not only includes physical tactics and techniques to control a violent and combative individual but also the physiological, psychological and legal aspects that officers face during this type of event. I am a certified Force Analyst through the Force Science Institute and also teach a course in police diffusion and de-escalation techniques. I have conducted numerous Police Use of Force reviews throughout the state and am considered a subject matter expert by the RI Attorney General in the area of Police use of Force. I’m not saying all this to impress anyone. I really don't care what anyone thinks about me. I’m saying it because I want to establish credibility with anyone that reads this post. I know what the f**k I’m talking about.

I have watched and reviewed the George Floyd video countless times. In all my years doing this, I have never seen a more blatant disregard for human life than what I witnessed in that video. It haunts me. It made me sick to my stomach. I can’t stop thinking about it. I’ve seen plenty of suffering and death in 19 years but have never watched a man die while the people who are supposed to protect them watched it happen and did nothing.

Kneeling on someone’s neck is not a technique that is taught or accepted anywhere that I’m aware of. As a matter of fact, we specifically tell recruits and cops NOT to kneel anywhere near the spine or neck because you can paralyze or kill someone. There are countless other ways to control someone on the ground that don’t involve putting your knee into a person’s neck with all your weight for over 8 minutes.

That is my professional opinion. Now for my personal feelings on the matter:
To “Officer” Derek Chauvin, who is the officer seen kneeling on Mr. Floyd’s neck, I have this to say to you: You Bastard. You Son of a Bitch. You and two other officers knelt on George Floyd’s neck and back and you watched him die. George Floyd was handcuffed and proned out on his stomach. Please don’t say you were holding him down because he couldn’t have pushed himself up off the ground if he wanted to. He was controlled. Once someone is controlled the use of force ends. Period. It is then the officer’s duty to check the well being of the subject to be sure he is not hurt or in distress. I don’t care how hard he fought you. I don’t care if he was on drugs. You had a duty to act! The smug look on your face said it all. You didn’t care that Mr. Floyd was begging for air and calling out for his Mother. You have no honor. And the other three officers are just as culpable. They didn’t act to stop you. You are all cowards. I wouldn’t piss on you if you were on fire.

Now the country is burning down. And you were the spark. Your fellow officers are getting injured and killed. Even officers in your own city. Your brothers. I hope you can live with that for the rest of your life. I hope you can live with the suffering and pain you started. You have put us all in a position where we now have to defend ourselves against angry mobs with bricks and bats and other weapons who group us in with you. Well I am not like you. We are not like you. You are the 1%. I will NEVER be like you. I would rather die than be like you.

To my family and friends and those I care about who are not police officers and maybe don’t understand, please know that no one hates a dirty, piece of # cop more than a good cop who does this job with honor and pride. I beg you, do not judge the 99% of good police officers based on the actions of an ignorant and evil few.

If you want to protest what happened, please do. Reach out to me. I will march with you peacefully just like thousands of other cops across the nation and mourn what has happened. I will kneel and pray with you. And when I put my uniform on, I will protect your right to peacefully protest because I took an oath to do so.

To my brothers and sisters that put on this uniform every day. Do not let what you see on TV jade you into thinking that this is what it is all about. The majority of people out there are good, honest hard working people who support you and what you stand for. Remember that. We don’t want to be judged by the actions of a shameful few and neither do the people we serve. Support the people we are sworn to protect. Hold your heads high and serve with honor and integrity.

To the rioters, I speak for all of law enforcement when I ask: PLEASE STOP. Your actions are solving nothing. You are not mourners or protesters. You are thugs and opportunists. You are cowards. You are destroying people’s lives and your behavior will not be tolerated. People are going to get hurt. Please do not test our resolve when it comes to protecting our flock. Enough is enough. This is not the legacy that George Floyd deserves.

Thank you for listening.


a reply to: Psilocyborg

a reply to: Bloodworth

Could you subdue a handcuffed man?

I've heard a knee to the back of the neck works quite well...

a reply to: Bloodworth

Just how well could a 65 year old woman who is 5'1" do,
in your opinion?

originally posted by: mamabeth
a reply to: Bloodworth

Just how well could a 65 year old woman who is 5'1" do,
in your opinion?

Lol. Start picking out the gravestone

a reply to: Bloodworth

Mine or his?

a reply to: Bloodworth

And how many of you sat with your knee on the back of his kneck for several minutes after he stopped moving? And how many more sat there for a minute or more after he was no longer conscious or coherrent to continue to plead for help? That excercise you participated in showed nothing other than how difficult it is to get someone on the ground initially. Yes, i will agree that is by far the most difficult part. I was Army. Infantry. I’ve been there. Trust me there were certain targets we captured where i would’ve loved more than anything than to just rest my knee against their thorax for an excessive amount of time for what they did to us. But we did not. The officer used necessary force, sure, problem is, he continued to use it when it was not necessary. For a highly EXTENDED period of time.

George Floyd fought for 3 minutes outside the police car while handcuffed .

After being put inside the car, he fought the police there also, according to body cam footage.

Newly released video: twitter.com...

Oh, yeaaaaaaaaaah.

Giggty.

a reply to: carewemust

You mean they hitched their wagons to a lame horse... again? NO! I refuse to believe it! How can it possibly be that each of these "OMG,l that poor man" incidents with cops that ultimately lead to public fiascoes always seem to involve either people who are later proven to have fought with the cop, were real POS, or both?

originally posted by: Psilocyborg
a reply to: Bloodworth

This just sounds like a pointless exercise of machismo.

Spray the guy in handcuffs in the face with mace and don't invite him to your BBQs anymore.

Yup, what a load of tripe, Floyd was not bucking wildly, no bleeding from officers, bitch move, by bitch cops.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

There's something totally screwy with the entire George Floyd event. Minnesota Attorney General Keith Ellison is refusing to release the body cam footage from the officers taken within the police vehicle.