has any one seen..Demon's?

It is noteworthy that many who do not believe in either the Christian God or Satan, have lived long lives with no infractions against mankind, neither do we suffer from demonic possession, dark dreams or anything of the like. While the greatest proponents of being born again find it necessary to compensate for whatever character flaws in their personal and wilfully committed atrocities look to blame an unsubstantiated entity for their wayward ways and dearly hanging on to written words for the salvation of their souls. There is no doubt a history of dependency that accounts for this.

To the author of this thread; The reason for your dreams can only be answered by you. If you were to dream about great waves, I am sure many will tell you that you might be having visions of impending disaster somewhere in this world, but that does not make it so. For if that were the case, all dreams would be decipherable.

Nice try somewhere,

While the greatest proponents of being born again find it necessary to compensate for whatever character flaws in their personal and wilfully committed atrocities look to blame an unsubstantiated entity for their wayward ways and dearly hanging on to written words for the salvation of their souls.

The Jewish tradition was casting out devils, so does Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, and more. So, your hatred of Christians is starting to destroy your mind. Maybe you should question, what you belive? Maybe, you have been lied to somewhere? Have you ever really tested your belife? Really? What is the basis for your belife and how did you come about it?

Atheists have committed more atrocities in this century alone than supposed Christians ever have. So take your bigoted slander else where.

She is not always dreaming of them, she sees them in the wakeful state, as have I and many others, here. I know this is hard for your mind to deal with this. But guess what just because you do not want to belive it does not mean it is not really happening. It is not nice to call people liars, without reason.

Nice to know your out there my four legged friend

Do demons exist?? I say....uuuhhmm....eeerrrmmmm...... aaahhh...cracking of fingerjoints..ruffling of hair...touching of ears nervously.....

I really dont know

That a malevolent spirit can manifest itself in a tangible form that we can see - i really really dont know..

If its true then i think every demon is individual to the person that it bothers....the malevolent spirit plays on our fears..it knows our weaknesses and manifests itself in a form that it knows will scare us...playing with our childhood fears maybe... :

I have to say ive never seen one...or been possessed..though i think i was nearly possessed one night after drinking 18 bottles of budwieser...but im not sure if that counts..i had ectoplasm flowing from my mouth and butt the next day..i think THAT spirit for sure knew my weakness..



[edit on 16-4-2005 by andy1972]

why does everyone alsways bring jesus into it, he died 2005 years ago. people always also seem to bring satan into things as well, satan is nothing in comparesin to what other evils there are they just arent so fame seeking as satan, and therefore more dangerous

Originally posted by moonbeam13
why does everyone alsways bring jesus into it, he died 2005 years ago. people always also seem to bring satan into things as well, satan is nothing in comparesin to what other evils there are they just arent so fame seeking as satan, and therefore more dangerous

It's called christianity, and maybe you didn't notice but your entire world and life are based around it.

Originally posted by moonbeam13
why does everyone alsways bring jesus into it...

...people always also seem to bring satan into things as well...

Angels are servants of _____ ?

Demons are servants of _____ ?

One cannot say there are servants without masters. By understanding whom they serve, it's easier to understand their motive and design. Servants have no power their master does not give to them.

[edit on 18-4-2005 by saint4God]

We have to remember that the much maligned Satan, the evil one, the lord of the flies, the master of hell, beelzebub, the devil, george bush jnr, the lord of darkness, or whatever you want to call him, wasnt always badly thought of.

He started his career in the sevrice of a company called GOD & CO...he was lucifer then, the bearer of light, one of the top boys with the wings and the halo...who after arguing with the boss fell from grace and fell into hell...leaving him severly p.o´d..

Principaly i dont think that satan is a bad guy...he´s just sooooo damn bitter with the way his ex-employer treats him and gives him a pile of bad press...i think hes just a little mis-understood, maybe he needs a little anger counselling or something..

There is a world of people that use the devil as an excuse for their actions or the excuse for anything bad that happens in the world...nobody ever asks him for his side of the story...

The fact that SATAN was once an ANGEL is too readily overlooked by the majority of people today

Jakko my world does NOT revolve around christianty

saint4God only according to the bible

andy1972 the lord of the flies is Beelzubub not satan, they are NOT the same beings. exactly people try and see a fallen angel as the ultimate evil pleeeeease there will always be a piece of good in lucifuer, always.
satan is the master of hell but it shouldnt be hell you fear there are far worse places in the underworld, and what rules there are not known to humans. there is a very good saying, dont fear what you know fear what you dont.

Originally posted by moonbeam13
Jakko my world does NOT revolve around christianty

Everyones world does moonbeam.
Unless you think you're not living in the year 2005.

Who stated the satan was the ultimate evil.....

Read me well buddy, i stated that as a personage satan is mis-understood...a much maligned character..I stated he was a fallen angel...fallen but never the less an angel....

I also stated that satan is the victim of much bad press.....i was never critical of him in a "the s.o.b doesnt have a good bone in his body" way...

I open accept that the image of satan as opponent of god, the eternal battle between good and evil, is merely a production of the church..who need the existence of a supreme evil to give reason to the life to their supreme good..

If there is ONE form of supreme evil on this planet, then personaly i woulndt look much further than the church...How many have died in the name of the church and faith - MILLIONS - ...on the other hand how many have died in the name of satan....???

[edit on 18-4-2005 by andy1972]

Jakko, everyone's world doesn't revolve around Christianity...


Ever hear of Atheists or Islam, Judaism or Shintoism? They're called other religions (well...Atheism isnt really a religion but you know what I mean) and those are what other peoples world revolves around....


Peoples worlds revolve around what they believe in...


As for me I'm agnostic.... so my world doesn't revolve around Christianity (even tho I'm forced to celebrate the Christian Holidays with my family)

Originally posted by Reikuro
Jakko, everyone's world doesn't revolve around Christianity...

You do not understand what I mean.
We all live in the same world, and the impact that christianity had and has on our world and lives can not be denied.
We all celebrate the same christian holidays, we all live 2005 years after Jesus was born, wether you like it or not.

Originally posted by andy1972
Principaly i dont think that satan is a bad guy...

He's a real bastard. I met him before I knew God. Anyone who meets him will say the same. A satanic friend of mine would agree with a smile.

Originally posted by Jakko

You do not understand what I mean.
We all live in the same world, and the impact that christianity had and has on our world and lives can not be denied.
We all celebrate the same christian holidays, we all live 2005 years after Jesus was born, wether you like it or not.

*coughs* troll *coughs*

Wow, you should really get out more. Many jews and/or hebrews do not go by the church's calender, but rather an older one. To many Jews, today isn't Monday April 18, 2005. It's actually 9th of Nisan, 5765. What year is it for the Chinese? Oh yeah! It's the year of the rooster (note: they go by a lunar calender), and the Korean calender is the about the same. Scientists now use CE and BCE instead of AD and BC. I know a lot of people who do not celebrate christian holidays, and many people deny Jesus was actually ever born.

Originally posted by radardog
*coughs* troll *coughs*

Wow, you should really get out more. Many jews and/or hebrews do not go by the church's calender, but rather an older one. To many Jews, today isn't Monday April 18, 2005. It's actually 9th of Nisan, 5765. What year is it for the Chinese? Oh yeah! It's the year of the rooster (note: they go by a lunar calender), and the Korean calender is the about the same. Scientists now use CE and BCE instead of AD and BC. I know a lot of people who do not celebrate christian holidays, and many people deny Jesus was actually ever born.

Not sure what your point is calling me a troll, you probably still have no clue what it is I am talking about.
Of course there are exceptions, people who do not celebrate certain christian holidays and who do not "agree" with the year 2005, but they are all exceptions.

To get back on topic, and to answer the question "why do people keep on talking about Jesus", because the bible tells us we can get rid of demons by telling them to leave in the name of Jesus.
Of course if you're not a christian you may not believe all of this, but that doesn't mean you can not understand why people tlak about it in this thread.

I am a christian as well and I think demons can be "detected" by some in one way or another. Demons are always bad news though, they are never out to help you and have no reason to give you the information that you need or that helps you.

Satan and his minions (demons) are not bad because the church says so, they are bad because they decided to go against God. God was righteous and just in the most perfect way possible, and Satan wanted to be on the same level as God, even though he was created by God in the first place.

Not sure what your point is calling me a troll, you probably still have no clue what it is I am talking about.

If it quacks like a duck, walks like a duck, looks like a duck ....

Of course there are exceptions, people who do not celebrate certain christian holidays and who do not "agree" with the year 2005, but they are all exceptions.

Scroll up. You said all. If you want to admit that you're wrong, now is probably the best time to do it. Want to know how many chinese citizens there are in the world? As of the year 2000, there were 1,261,832,482 reported chinese citizens. Current world population is estimated at 6,431,501,502. 1/6 is hardly a mere exception.

Moreover! There is an estimated 2 billion christians in the world, with muslims right behind them at 1.3 billion. Islam does not celebrate christmas. That's a rather large exception. This statistic doesn't even point out that catholics make up 1.1 billion of the 2 billion christians -- of whom many protestants do not even consider catholics as christians. Ironically, Islam has a higher rate of growth and is predicted to overtake christianity in numbers in 50 years or so. Then Christianity becomes the exception.

(religion statistics from:
en.wikipedia.org...)

To get back on topic, and to answer the question "why do people keep on talking about Jesus", because the bible tells us we can get rid of demons by telling them to leave in the name of Jesus.

Satan and his minions (demons) are not bad because the church says so, they are bad because they decided to go against God. God was righteous and just in the most perfect way possible, and Satan wanted to be on the same level as God, even though he was created by God in the first place.

The word "just" has root in the idea of "fairness"; it is really hard to argue that God was fair to the angels when he created humans. It could be said that God treated angels like his redheaded step children, and Satan had enough. Or (my interpretation -- different story) God commanded Satan into his current role.

Originally posted by radardog

Scroll up. You said all. If you want to admit that you're wrong, now is probably the best time to do it. Want to know how many chinese citizens there are in the world? As of the year 2000, there were 1,261,832,482 reported chinese citizens. Current world population is estimated at 6,431,501,502. 1/6 is hardly a mere exception.

Even for that 1/6 we live in the year 2005 radardog. It doesn't really matter what you say, the entire world is based on the christian yearcount regardless of wether people are christian or not.

Moreover! There is an estimated 2 billion christians in the world, with muslims right behind them at 1.3 billion. Islam does not celebrate christmas. That's a rather large exception.

Was I talking about christmas only?
Nope.

I think you understand my point pretty well, so let's not waste time trying to explain something to you you allredy understand.
Christianity and the jewish religion has had a huge impact on everyones world and lives, wether people realize it or not.
In the end there is really no reason to be all surprised when people talk about Jesus in a thread about demons I think.

The word "just" has root in the idea of "fairness"; it is really hard to argue that God was fair to the angels when he created humans.

Why?
Do you know enough about angels to decide for them wether or not it is fair that God created humans also?
Do you even know enough about the ultimate purpose of angels and the ultimate purpose of humans to say such things?
If so, maybe you could educate me.

It could be said that God treated angels like his redheaded step children, and Satan had enough. Or (my interpretation -- different story) God commanded Satan into his current role.

The whole point of satan, was that he was one of the few angels with a choice. He chose to go against God, even though God was the one who made satan all that powerfull in the first place.
Because God is righteous and just, God couldn't get rid of satan whenever he wants, because that wouldn't be just.

In a way God is bound to his own rules in order to remain just, which explains why satan and demons are existant today.

Dog?

What is your problem? I have quite a bit of respect for you, and now you are going off on some semantic tangent. All Jakko was saying is that Christianity is a major "belief" in our world and has effected most of the known world. How is this surpising? How could you possibly miss his point?

Now, lets be fair, Judaism, Islam, and Christianity all believe in Satan and God, and that Satan is really, really bad, and evil, and God is all good. Hell is the worst place in the world you could ever be. I do not think Satan is misunderstood at all, he is the source of all filth, and evil.

So Jakko’s, point is most of the world has this belief system so why is moonbeam "shocked" because it mentioned? Does she think we must all give up our belief system, just because she, does not like it? Jakko was only saying "get use to it".

So to regress, why are you Dog, picking a fight over this, and then calling him a "Troll"? It is a bit odd, and not very nice. Then you do not even fight fair, making traps and all. Tisk, Tisk.

Moonbeam

Jakko my world does NOT revolve around christianty

First it is not your world. Second most of the world belives in God and Satan. So get used to being a minority, it is going to be a long time before anything changes.

Hi Andy,

Are you calling me an Azz? Because I am, you know. You trying to start something? HuH?!
Oh, by the way I finally did a Google search on Hand Grenades,…….your advice is…is……is….. really bad! Those things are dangerous! Gosh, I could of gotten hurt.

though i think i was nearly possessed one night after drinking 18 bottles of budwieser.
[/qutoe]

Ok, well I was upset with you but seeing how you support Budweiser, I will forgive you, Clydesdales and all. Support you local pack animal, drink Budweiser!

Because God is righteous and just, God couldn't get rid of satan whenever he wants, because that wouldn't be just.

yes but then theres always the argument "God is not bound by anything"


-and the best solution to this paradox is that God, in his absolute discipline chooses to allow satan to run his course. it makes sense really, because if he were to renounce satans given right to choose, he would be doing exactly what satan has been trying to do to humanity since the beginning.

[edit on 19-4-2005 by lost]

What is your problem? I have quite a bit of respect for you, and now you are going off on some semantic tangent. All Jakko was saying is that Christianity is a major "belief" in our world and has effected most of the known world. How is this surpising? How could you possibly miss his point?

Donkey, I am a big fan of truth. What Jakka said was untrue and I showed this publically. Lines such as, "It doesn't really matter what you say, the entire world is based on the christian yearcount regardless of wether people are christian or not." have the smell of ignorance rising from it. Sir Donkey, could you really defend that statement? Do you really think the entire world is based on Christianity?

Let's be candid here, the break down of world religion looks something like this:

Christianity 2 billion
Islam 1.3 billion
Hinduism 900 million
Secular/Nonreligious/Agnostic/Atheist 850 million
Buddhism 360 million
Chinese traditional religion 225 million
....

We can see that most of the world is not christian; it is something other than christian.

So Jakko’s, point is most of the world has this belief system so why is moonbeam "shocked" because it mentioned? Does she think we must all give up our belief system, just because she, does not like it? Jakko was only saying "get use to it".

Get used to what? Jakko's major premise is wrong: most of the world isn't christian, nor does most of the world celebrate christian holidays. Him or her having said those statements is probably very nice evidence of him or her being or troll or not having the knowledge at hand. Sir Donkey, I have seen trolls before, and I am sure I will see them again. In all irony, trolls usually sound like this chap; forgive my use of induction.



This isn't to say that christianity has not been a factor in western world history -- it certainly has -- especially in a western world once pratically controlled by the christian church (i.e. dark ages). However, we westerners tend to forget there exists another half of the world. In such a way if you were born and raised in Saudi Arabia, chances are your world would revolve around islamic law, beliefs, and calendars.

www.islam.com... (western-islamic calendar conversion)

I only ask for you and your cohort to be more mindful the idea that not everything is christian based.