Either China or Overblown can't have both

So many people on here talking out of both sides of their neck

So which is it?

#1 China lied about numbers & severity
or
#2 This virus is way overblown and not as dangerous

It appears some people want to believe that China released this VERY deadly virus, AND yet
once it's here, it's totally overblown and exaggerated and we are all ready to go back to work, cuz you know it ain't ttttttthat serious.

People really need to decide if they think this thing is dangerous or not.

Also wanted to add, either life is precious or it isn't.
If you are not OK with abortion, you should not be ok with killing old peeps or imune-compromised.

a reply to: JAGStorm

Well.. Yes it can be both.

There are different ways to "attack" another nation beyond "death rate," with a virus.

It could also be an unintentional release, leveraged as a war on minds (psyop).

Just gotta look a bit beyond the very, very limited way this has all been defined on twitter and the news.

There are a myriad of possibilities, ranging from exceedingly plausible to delightfully absurd. Neither of which indicates whether its True or not.

Just because China most likely leaked the virus from a lab where they were researching these kinds of viruses doesn't mean the virus is some kind of humanity-ending pandemic. It was most likely leaked from their virus lab, but it's relatively minor. China lied for a few potential different reasons:
1. To cover up their total screw-up with allowing a perfect storm to take place as far as the virus spreading worldwide instead of stopping it in its tracks before it started, when they had plenty of opportunity;
2. To cover up their total incompetence at not leaking viruses from their lab;
3. To hide the actual reasons for the release of the virus, assuming it was done intentionally, perhaps as part of some play in the trade war between us and them;
4. Just for the sake of protecting the image of the Chinese government.

Does China lie to their people, and to the world? All the time.
Is this virus dangerous? Sure, to the same people the flu is dangerous to.

a reply to: JAGStorm

China lied about their numbers and likely tried to underplay the seriousness of it.

We knew about it since November and did the same thing.

More worried about having egg on their face, politicians in an election year, they'd rather do too much than too little.

The virus is serious for some people and can hit dense communities hard, but that doesn't mean you should shut down large swaths of a nation because a city is struggling.

That's my take. Big fan of not being constrained by the extremes or talking points. I like taking my own position.

a reply to: JAGStorm

If you are not OK with abortion, you should not be ok with killing old peeps or imune-compromised.

If you are okay with abortion, I guess we should be able to go back to work then?

I don't know... just saying.

They could have stopped flights. In that sense it was used as a weapon. If you have to suffer why not make your enemy suffer as well. Certainly don't want to strengthen them. People are way over thinking this thing.

I guess we will find out this fall and next winter how bad it truly is. If you remember, the Spanish flu wasn't so bad the first time it came around either

originally posted by: visitedbythem
I guess we will find out this fall and next winter how bad it truly is. If you remember, the Spanish flu wasn't so bad the first time it came around either

Alternatively, we could be in the second wave right now. Its been going on for almost half a year, officially.

I would expect there to be a wave any time the lockdown is lifted (if its lifted..). Which will precipitate one helluva cycle of lockdowns and fear. A cycle that will prime folks quite well for The Vaccine.

Should probably be investing all this money in designing and implementing quickly scalable solutions for medical apparatus response. Something that has been a longstanding issue beyond just infectious diseases.

It's pretty obvious China is manipulating their numbers. China just added another 50% to the Wuhan numbers over the last 24 hours.
Source

It's a weird to watch people who I've never seen trust China...
Trust China.

I agree next time we must do better to balance personal safety and personal freedom. If we as a society start valuing the dollar over life then we are no better than China when they welded people into their apartments. Life is prescious, a fiat currency isn't. I feel our forefathers would agree.

a reply to: JAGStorm

Yes it's dangerous and of course China lied.

The number of healthcare workers who are dying from the infection and China adjusting the Wuhan death toll upwards are testament to that.

a reply to: JAY1980

I agree next time we must do better to balance personal safety and personal freedom. If we as a society start valuing the dollar over life then we are no better than China when they welded people into their apartments. Life is prescious, a fiat currency isn't. I feel our forefathers would agree.

Best response ever.

a reply to: JAY1980

I agree next time we must do better to balance personal safety and personal freedom. If we as a society start valuing the dollar over life then we are no better than China when they welded people into their apartments. Life is prescious, a fiat currency isn't. I feel our forefathers would agree.

We clearly don't have any value of the dollar right now.

I don't quite get what you're eluding to.

a reply to: JAGStorm

The US doesn't need China's help skewing the numbers.

I don't know that there is any chance of containing it at this point. There may have been a chance if steps were taken back in January or Febuary but we were at 500 thousand cases yesterday and it looks like we will have 700 thousand by the end of the day. It is going to continue to spread and we have only tested 1% of the population.

I called to see about testing yesterday and was told to stay home unless I show symptoms. They are still lacking tests.

As far as I know I don't have a mouth on either side of my neck.

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: JAGStorm

The US doesn't need China's help skewing the numbers.

I said in February that I'd trust our government as much as China's when it came to this virus. Sadly I've been proven right.

The government clearly doesn't know what the hell they are doing. Both them and the media were saying in February that we should really be concerned about the flu if we were so worried about this. Then when all this started you had the Surgeon General say people needed to stop buying N95's, because just slapping them on isn't going to do anything for you, and you are just eating the supply the health care professionals need.

Now you see this repeated narrative that we saw play out in 2001-2003. You're with the US on Iraq, or you're unpatriotic, and want to see people die by weapons of mass destruction.

One of our problems is no matter the issue, there is two extremes, and to play by the rules you have to pick a side, even if both are wrong. Everything is a polarized debate, and the two viewpoints are already provided for us to choose when we enter the discourse. Sadly, no one questions that. No one questions anything.

My biggest pet peeve about this whole ordeal, is the biggest question everyone asks is not "what am I going to do", it's "what's the government going to do for me".

As if we haven't learned from failed regional disasters the governments are completely inept, we trust them with a national one that is widely being treated with a one size fits all approach.

a reply to: CriticalStinker

Well said.

a reply to: JAGStorm

Cabin fever getting to you?

originally posted by: visitedbythem
a reply to: JAGStorm

Cabin fever getting to you?

No way, I'm a homebody that was taught survival skills at 6, gardens and cooks. I was made for pandemics.

originally posted by: CriticalStinker

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: JAGStorm

biggest question everyone asks is not "what am I going to do", it's "what's the government going to do for me".

Not everyone..

Ive been trying to provide options for the biggest concerns I personally have through all this. Including talking about what appears to be the best mechanism to treat SARS-CoV-2 specifically. I see others actively doing this as well.

The one-size-fits-all approach is certainly an issue though. Arguably, it emerged out of necessity over civilizations, but weve got the tools to transcend it now. Instead, we seem to cling to it like some sort of strange security blanket.

Im really not so sure what we are seeing is fully explained by ineptitude though. Then again, Ive always felt Hanlon's Razor was deeply flawed.

I see many begging government & corporate jebus for "divine" intervention too. But, I also see plenty just complaining about that (including myself), and Im not sure thats any more productive.. Even if I agree with it.