Grim New Rules for NYC Paramedics: Don’t Bring Cardiac Arrests to ER for Revival

What about the ship?

a reply to: neoholographic

So what you are saying is that your grandfather had not yet reached the point of being clinically dead after multiple attempts at resuscitation? Because it seems like that is what they are talking about.

We’ve been doing this for years. The ambulance service here is ALS. They carry all the drugs the ER docs give. The CPR in the field with defibrillation, IV, and rounds of drugs for 30 to 40 minutes.
Through all the studies this is best due to the interruptions in CPR and treatment during the loading and moving. I don’t always agree with it, but this is nothing new.

Just left Boston Medical center and the ER is dead. I was the only person there. Sad part is all the homeless out on the streets. It's still pretty busy if you are there to get your vice on. Glad as hell I dont mess with that #. I would have taken photos or video but didn't want to get the boot. I actually needed to be seen. Be safe everyone.

Just imagine, the governor of New York and the mayor of New York City certified ln 2018 that they were ready for any type of terrorist attack.

BULL!

Hospitals aren’t overwhelmed by an overhyped flu, am i right fellows? All just media fearmongering.

So Only let people with the flu in the hospitals!.

This had been standard practice for over 20 years. If you go through the cardiac protocol on a patient with no change or return of circulation, you call your medical director and get permission to terminate CPR and acls.

a reply to: buddha

They took my temp and BP In a triage tent outside the entrance. Put a color coded sticker on me w/ the numbers .if you dont get that, they don't ket you in. The pace was empty. I was in and out in an hour. That never happens.

a reply to: neoholographic

Soon we will see measures like Spain and Italy adopted. If you are 60 YO or older you are sedated and taken off your ventilator so it can save a younger life. (If there is a shortage in your area)

If you are waiting for one and are too old you are given sedatives and sent home.

We will see that here. As more medical professionals get sick and cant work, the number of treatable cases that dont get taken care of on time and end up developing into critical conditions will rise.

Other conditions besides those of Covid patients will lag behind in treatment and worsen as well.

Then we start seeing other illness as cadavers wont be picked up in a timely manner. That has happened everywhere this popped and its disturbing that we still arent addressing the problem now.

I have seen videos of people in south America drag bodies in bedsheets down streets and just drop the body and continue running. They are dumping bodies in central and south America like they were disposing of an old mattress behind a supermarket dumpster.

The problems we will have are only beginning.

Breaking News - Pregnant Women we are sorry to inform you that you must now give birth at home.

Sorry for the inconvenience, but you know......Covid.

originally posted by: neoholographic
That's just adding to the death total. People have heart attacks and it has nothing to do with Coronavirus but you're saying just let them die? My God, I know it's bad but these are some draconian steps.

Ok, so, honest question...

What percentage of people who have heart attacks where they experience full cardiac arrest before or immediately after EMTs get to them, survive when brought to the hospital?

There is nothing magical about a hospital trauma center. If someone is dead, they are dead. Pretty much all EMTs have advanced equipment capable of resuscitating people, do they not?

So, if the vast majority of said people are simply pronounced dead later at the hospital, why is this such a draconian thing? It actually would make sense, under these conditions.

a reply to: neoholographic

Here in the netherlands the opposite... hospitals are urging people with serious health cmplaints not to stay away but report to the hospitals..



PS Reading many different messages concerning all things covid-19... something isn't right.

a reply to: tanstaafl

Pretty much all EMTs have advanced equipment capable of resuscitating people, do they not?

Not on the level of a hospital ER, no. Think about it... if that were true, why not just treat them where they are? Why take anyone to a hospital?

I have had 7 heart attacks. 4 of them, I went to a hospital; the EMTs coudn't handle it here. The job of the EMTs is not to fix the problem, but to try and maintain life until they can get you there (and we have some great EMTs here). Then doctors try to fix the problem in a stable environment with equipment that sometimes won't even fit in an ambulance.

And to think I was bragging about Cuomo's attitude earlier. Now we find out that New York has stockpiles of equipment already that they are begging for but won't transport to the hospitals, and now they decide to ignore those who are in need of healthcare. They have a freakin' US Navy hospital ship parked in the harbor, for crying out loud, and it's not enough? It's good enough for our boys overseas getting themselves shot up, but apparently not for New York!

I'm on the verge of saying block all traffic in and out of New York, bring the ship home (or send it to somewhere that appreciates it), and let them handle their own issues. They caused their own shortages, they aren't even remotely grateful for anything, and they were encouraging people to not take any actions to protect themselves only a month ago; they said they were ready for anything! If I didn't like New York City, I would be past that verge.

So much for universal healthcare being a thing. We need to concentrate on having healthcare first. I don't want to even hear about "first-world healthcare" until then.

TheRedneck

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: tanstaafl

Pretty much all EMTs have advanced equipment capable of resuscitating people, do they not?

Not on the level of a hospital ER, no. Think about it... if that were true, why not just treat them where they are? Why take anyone to a hospital?

Not responsive to my point or question.

My question stands - what percentage of people who die - are clinically dead when the EMTs arrive or die and don't respond to the EMT attempts to resuscitate them either on site or in the ambulance on the way to the hospital ER, are later actually revived at the hospital ER?

The job of the EMTs is not to fix the problem, but to try and maintain life until they can get you there (and we have some great EMTs here). Then doctors try to fix the problem in a stable environment with equipment that sometimes won't even fit in an ambulance.

Thanks, that begins to address my question...

In your situation, you were not dead, and this new rule or whatever it is wouldn't have applied to you, because you weren't actually dead.

a reply to: tanstaafl

I don't know it is possible to answer that with any accuracy. "Dead" is not like flipping on or off a light switch. One person can appear "dead" and be resuscitated, and another can look alive and still be beyond help. That's why it requires a MD to sign off on a death certificate.

Had I had a weak heart that first trip in, I would not have survived... I have been told that many times by many doctors (~90 minutes with 100% blockage on the left side). Had the EMTs arrived a little sooner, they might have thought I was dead. I did pass out for a while on the phone with 911 (weird feeling). I assume I still had some sort of heartbeat, but that's an assumption with no real knowledge.

Point is, the EMTs actually had no idea if I was going to make it out or not. They couldn't see the damage that had been done. They do a wonderful job and I am not dissing them in any way, but to their eyes, with limited equipment, they would have had a judgement call to make. Thank goodness they don't make those judgement calls around here.

My point still stands as well... New York has a Navy hospital ship! The Comfort is sitting in the harbor taking patients, and they have all the latest in medical equipment and battle-tested staff. So why is New York decreeing that it is OK for people to die in the streets? That's a third-world excuse for medical care. That's something that I would expect to see happen in Iran or Columbia or Myanamar or Tibet. Not in the United States of America.

TheRedneck

originally posted by: TheRedneck
So why is New York decreeing that it is OK for people to die in the streets? That's a third-world excuse for medical care. That's something that I would expect to see happen in Iran or Columbia or Myanamar or Tibet. Not in the United States of America.

Well, I will absolutely agree that it is ridiculous to make a blanket declaration like this...

At worst, it should be a decision made on a case by case basis - meaning, the EMTs arrive on scene, determine it is a cardiac arrest, call it in while doing what they can - and if, at that particular moment in time, the hospital is completely overwhelmed, should the EMTs be told to just do their best on scene, but do not bring them in to the hospital if they are unsuccessful.

So, yeah, as far as that goes, this is just more of the ridiculous over-reaction to this thing in action.

a reply to: neoholographic

We are too busy saving lives to bother taking a few moments to save a life.

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: neoholographic

We are too busy saving lives to bother taking a few moments to save a life.

Stepping over pennies to retrieve a credit card