Evidence suggests massive death toll in China

originally posted by: XCrycek

originally posted by: payta

originally posted by: [post=25048914]Zcustosmorum[/post
A theory, which is shaky at best, does not constitute evidence

The theory is the fatality rate has been higher than the one officially reported.
The evidence is there's 21 millions fewer lines. That's a statistic provided by the CCP.

The theory may be shaky, but the evidence still stands.

I'm not claming the death toll in China is 21 millions. Far from it. I'm hoping we can look into the statistics and try to figure out what it all means.
I believe other information or data from China might be useful in order to clear the air on the matter.

Let's keep in mind China has reported 3,500 deaths.

You can't refer to that data as evidence related to CoVid mortality. It's evidence of drop in cellphone usage, not of CoVid mortality.

I know, but we can't dismiss the fact the there 21 million fewer cellphones. That's a fact (as far as we decide to trust official data from the CCP).

So, the theory of this being due to death, may be shaky, yes. It may be completely false, yes. But the fact that there's fewer lines still stands.

originally posted by: iwanttobelieve70
a reply to: XCrycek


Could it be their government turned them off to control the flow of information?

Excellent point. They could also have shut those off so people don't create bottlenecks on their network infrastructure during these quarantine times. I can't stream Netflix or YouTube in HD these days because of so many people working from home so the whole infrastructure is experiencing 30-40% more load than usual

originally posted by: XCrycek
1 % of that would be 210, 000 deaths in whole of China. Btw. People in China aren't only dying of CoVid. How many of those who cancelled their subscription died of some other diseases?
You mention a gain of 3.5 users the same time last year. Well that's logical. People won't buy a new phone during a pandemic period when they lost their job and the economy is as it is.

Let's just say 0,5% of that. that'd mean 100k death, against a reported 3.5k. Quite a spike.

I know people die of ther illnesses, but still, the number of cellphone lines grew while people were dying of other diseases in january of 2019.

a reply to: iwanttobelieve70

it could but, it'd be a drop in an ocean really.

The number of cellphone users decreased from 1.600957 billion to 1.579927 billion, a drop of 21.03 million

Everybody always jumps to less customers = dead customers.
Nobody ever pulls their head out of their ass and thinks less customers after being nailed inside homes = broke customers without paychecks. Even communist China demands people pay their bills, services ain't free.

a reply to: Nyiah

True. There's no way of knowing what the hell is going on over there tbh

originally posted by: payta

originally posted by: XCrycek
1 % of that would be 210, 000 deaths in whole of China. Btw. People in China aren't only dying of CoVid. How many of those who cancelled their subscription died of some other diseases?
You mention a gain of 3.5 users the same time last year. Well that's logical. People won't buy a new phone during a pandemic period when they lost their job and the economy is as it is.

Let's just say 0,5% of that. that'd mean 100k death, against a reported 3.5k. Quite a spike.

I know people die of ther illnesses, but still, the number of cellphone lines grew while people were dying of other diseases in january of 2019.

I'm sure that number of 3+ k is false. The drop of number of cellphone lines is however mostly because of business shutting down. How many cancelled their subscription once everything shut down?!I could imagine that employees in those huge international and domestic corporations in Wuhan had business phones too so their subscriptions got cancelled once they were sent home.
I bet that 0,0005% of that drop is because of CoVid mortality the rest is due to everything that follows when you shut down a society.

originally posted by: XCrycek
Could it perhaps be because many businesses are shut down? No way in hell can you cover up 21 million deaths, not even in China. How about foreigners who were evacuated from China after the outbreak? They too had phones

They certainly could cover up 21 million deaths. The USSR covered up the scale of the 30s famine until 1991. Till then people knew a famine happened, but not the scale of death, or the why and how. All they could do is speculate. Much like China. We know a pandemic happened but not the scale, unless you believe the CCP’s story.

People need to stop saying governments can’t do things when history shows they can do pretty much whatever they want.

originally posted by: payta

originally posted by: [post=25048914]Zcustosmorum[/post
A theory, which is shaky at best, does not constitute evidence

The theory is the fatality rate has been higher than the one officially reported.
The evidence is there's 21 millions fewer lines. That's a statistic provided by the CCP.

The theory may be shaky, but the evidence still stands.

I'm not claming the death toll in China is 21 millions. Far from it. I'm hoping we can look into the statistics and try to figure out what it all means.
I believe other information or data from China might be useful in order to clear the air on the matter.

Let's keep in mind China has reported 3,500 deaths.

Chinese people who were perhaps with more than one carrier have switched to one to make things easier, furthermore if they had more than one handset, they have also probably switched to one, as cleaning one repeatedly is better than cleaning many.

There's 2 good reasons, more plausible than what you are trying to suggest, as to why the drop in numbers.

And the death toll from China was minimized due to the strategy of zero-tolerance they implemented

originally posted by: payta
a reply to: Nyiah

True. There's no way of knowing what the hell is going on over there tbh

So, there's no need for sensationalist OP titles now, is there?

If 2 million or 5 million were dead in China the death rates of countries bordering China that we can get good intel would be skyrocketing too. None of the countries have astronomical rates and we can get numbers from multiple sources as well as internet reports.

hgis.uw.edu...

originally posted by: iwanttobelieve70
a reply to: XCrycek


Could it be their government turned them off to control the flow of information?

I 2nd this theory.

Anyone that quotes numbers CHINA, Russia, North Korea, etc...have provided are naive or just plain dumb.

Good luck to use all.

originally posted by: Zcustosmorum

originally posted by: payta

originally posted by: [post=25048914]Zcustosmorum[/post
A theory, which is shaky at best, does not constitute evidence

The theory is the fatality rate has been higher than the one officially reported.
The evidence is there's 21 millions fewer lines. That's a statistic provided by the CCP.

The theory may be shaky, but the evidence still stands.

I'm not claming the death toll in China is 21 millions. Far from it. I'm hoping we can look into the statistics and try to figure out what it all means.
I believe other information or data from China might be useful in order to clear the air on the matter.

Let's keep in mind China has reported 3,500 deaths.

Chinese people who were perhaps with more than one carrier have switched to one to make things easier, furthermore if they had more than one handset, they have also probably switched to one, as cleaning one repeatedly is better than cleaning many.

There's 2 good reasons, more plausible than what you are trying to suggest, as to why the drop in numbers.

And the death toll from China was minimized due to the strategy of zero-tolerance they implemented

originally posted by: payta
a reply to: Nyiah

True. There's no way of knowing what the hell is going on over there tbh

So, there's no need for sensationalist OP titles now, is there?

China delayed reporting, suppressed doctors and journalists, cut off internet and chat apps out of the impacted region so - there's no reason to trust their stats.

If we split the difference on the estimated mortality rates and go with 2.2...do the math on 350 million people in the U.S...

Stay home.

Question: Can the number of cell phone users lost versus population be at all compared/correlated to Italy's fatality rate?

I do not have any proof more then what i saw during the chinese epidemic . A lot of videos released during that time were shown to be true. Here is one concerning
supposed cell phones at cremation site

Take it for what you will, but knowing china's past ability to hide millons of deaths this is not out of bounds

They’ve been shut down longer than us.

Maybe 21 million people couldn’t pay the phone bill . That’s only about 1 1/2% of the population .,

Just saying

a reply to: payta

That's 0.30% of China's population cell phones!!!
SHOCKING

/sarcasm

Seriously, who gives a crap anymore? Unless those 21 million were part of their communist government, it's of zero matter to anyone at this point. Their country, their government, and their business models are a scourge upon this cursed planet and when this fiasco is over we need a global conversation about removing them from being in any position to ever do this to the planet again.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

Seriously, who gives a crap anymore? Unless those 21 million were part of their communist government, it's of zero matter to anyone at this point. Their country, their government, and their business models are a scourge upon this cursed planet and when this fiasco is over we need a global conversation about removing them from being in any position to ever do this to the planet again.

And if the virus had been detected in another country first, would your opinion be the same of that country?

originally posted by: Zcustosmorum
a reply to: burdman30ott6

Seriously, who gives a crap anymore? Unless those 21 million were part of their communist government, it's of zero matter to anyone at this point. Their country, their government, and their business models are a scourge upon this cursed planet and when this fiasco is over we need a global conversation about removing them from being in any position to ever do this to the planet again.

And if the virus had been detected in another country first, would your opinion be the same of that country?

Depends on whether or not that other country had the track record of bending the world over that China has, doesn't it? My negative opinion of China and their crap communist system was well formed long before they were responsible for Coronavirus circling the globe. They have proven, since Richard Nixon stupidly visited their country 40 years ago, that they are not trustworthy nor deserving of the benefits of the modern world. The entire country should be turned into an exclusion zone where the rest of the world is forbidden from doing business with them in any degree until such a point as their citizens have had enough and finally stand up for themselves and place every communist party head on a pike for the world to see.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: Zcustosmorum
a reply to: burdman30ott6

Seriously, who gives a crap anymore? Unless those 21 million were part of their communist government, it's of zero matter to anyone at this point. Their country, their government, and their business models are a scourge upon this cursed planet and when this fiasco is over we need a global conversation about removing them from being in any position to ever do this to the planet again.

And if the virus had been detected in another country first, would your opinion be the same of that country?

Depends on whether or not that other country had the track record of bending the world over that China has, doesn't it? My negative opinion of China and their crap communist system was well formed long before they were responsible for Coronavirus circling the globe. They have proven, since Richard Nixon stupidly visited their country 40 years ago, that they are not trustworthy nor deserving of the benefits of the modern world. The entire country should be turned into an exclusion zone where the rest of the world is forbidden from doing business with them in any degree until such a point as their citizens have had enough and finally stand up for themselves and place every communist party head on a pike for the world to see.

Richard Nixon who's actions cost thousands of US lives in Asia, who manipulated facts in order to continue bombing the crap out of Cambodia, who was guilty of illegal slush funds and money laundering and price fixing, I'd rather believe the Chinese

Depends on whether or not that other country had the track record of bending the world over that China has

If China is truly guilty of this, then how do we view the global actions of the US?

Just saying, there's a line that every government should be playing by, and we all know who the worst offenders actually are