The Age of Depression and Loneliness

Saw a great little interview with Johann Hari about his book Lost Connections.

He explains how he started out as a teenager with depression, he explained it as if "pain was leaking out of me." The doctor says that there is a chemical, seratonin, in the brain that he needs. So he was prescribed medication to release the chemical. After many years, and with depression he decided to travel all over the world, he said over 40,000 miles to discover the root cause of depression.

He learned that there are 9 core causes of depression. 2 are chemical, or biological, but most are not biological, rather in the way we live.

And we are living in an age where more people are depressed, lonely and dying of it than ever before. I recommened watching the short interview. I have not read the book but it looks like worth a read.

He says that when a survey was made years ago, to Americans, how many real friends a person has the average was 5. Today the same answer is 0.

That is astounding to me. People went to having a handful of true, close friends, to having no friends at all, on average!

One of the key things to get rid of the loneliness and sadness, understandably enough was to associate with people. And he stated a study a doctor made with patients who were depressed. He had them gather together on a certain day in an old abandoned lot and make a garden out of it. And so they got together, made plans, started putting their hands in the earth, joined together, made a garden, made contacts with other people, had association, became friends. And that increased their happiness.

I could really relate to this interview. I see people around me on a daily basis who are friendless. I am an easy-going person that likes people and it shows. People around me usually like my company and I make friends easily. Unless you're not a nice person, our personalites clash. It happens online the same as offline as well.

I remember striking up a friendship with the man on a corner who ran a little mom-pop store. Would make it my goal to walk down every day to greet him. The small greetings turned into conversations. And the conversations turned into long talks. I didn't mind as I started to see he had lots of problems. When I made a pizza or something, I'd save a couple slices, bring them over, and have a bite to eat and talk with him.

Then one day he told me his wife was breaking up with him, getting a divorce, she went away with another guy. I saw this coming for awhile and tried to warn him of it. But I felt bad and cried with him and gave him a hug. And at first he refused it, then he hugged me back and cried with me. Said I was the first person who he ever felt like cared about him. Gave him attention. He had never had a hug from someone before, in a friendship way I gave him.

There was another guy, up the street that had the same problems he would always come looking for me and I would sit outside in the yard set down a couple chairs, and just chew the fat with him. I also always took him into consideration and always looked for ways to help him. If he needed food for his family, some clothes, whatever. I would hug him too. He told me one night that I was the only friend he ever had. That there were always "friends" and family members coming around, partyiing, asking for money to drink and get high on drugs. But no one that cared about him as a person. He said he felt as if I was the only person that was a real friend to him.

I can give a long list of people I have experienced this with.

Then I think about attending the meetings I do with Jehovah's Witnesses. It watching that video reminded me of the sense of being part of a group, of caring for each other is needed, and how it has been lost. And then I think of how loving eveyone is when I attend the meetings. How we care for each other. We get together and eat and dance and drink and laugh. We look out for each other when someone is in need or sick. We get into fights sometimes, sometimes we hurt each other's feelings, but we forgive each other. Sometimes we get nutheads that go off the deep and and do really stupid things, and sometimes they have to be disciplined for their bad behavior. We're just like everyone else.

I write this because on another thread of my I got some extreme attacks by certain individuals on this board. And I started to go through their history, and saw they had a pattern of following posters who are JWs and just attacking them constantly, with the same old lies. And never really saw anyone that could see through their subterfuge.

Well I can. And I know that people are smart. When people believe lies about others its usually because of their heart condition. Love believes in others. Hatred is envious and tries to erode love. That is another reason for the age of depression and loneliness. People who are heartless and evil.

I can say that the words in the Bible that fellow believers should meet together regularly have merit! It says:

(Hebrews 10:24, 25) . . .And let us consider one another so as to incite to love and fine works, not forsaking our meeting together, as some have the custom, but encouraging one another, and all the more so as you see the day drawing near.

I ponder all of this and I know that the words are good, the command to meet together regularly. In a world where there is so much division and hatred, so much apathy, run rampant with immorality, violence, ungodliness, it is good to gather together with nice people who really love, who are good and honest. Their words of faith uplift you.

You may be at work where all you where is filthy and degrading talk from workmates all day, you may speak about the kingdom message and only meet apathetic and angry people all week. People who are rude, condescending, snide, contemptful, they may yell at you, they may even physically attack you. It can drain you when you see all of this badness and experience it personally on a day-to-day basis.

But then you meet with fellow believers who apply the words in the Bible. Who have given up hatred, racism, who don't talk obscenities, who are not immoral, who pray to God and love him and because of that they love you.

The world needs more love. And I know where I can find it. And I have many friends. And I try to be a friend. And I know no one is perfect. I know I mess up, I know you mess up, I know my friends mess up. And when it comes down to it, that is what being a true friend is. It is being mature enough to know there are differences. To accept them. To overlook when someone wrongs you. And also to be bold to tell your friend when they are wrong. And be humble to accept counsel from someone who cares.

In the previous thread I made regarding personal experiences in my life, out of an honest heart, and with sincerity and love, I received several extremely mean-spirited remarks which I ignored. You ignore those type of people. They are everywhere. One said, 'no one wants you here or cares about you,' paraphrasing it. I could go find the exact quote, but no need to.

I believe there is good in everyone. And even bad people can change. And I believe in doing what Jesus and his Father do. They don't look for the bad in others, they don't talk about the bad in others. Those who do that cause divisions. They do not have a spirit of peace or love. The scripture tells us that if God wanted to he could condemn every single person alive, but that is not what he wants. He isn't looking for the bad in us. He is looking for the good:

(Psalm 130:3) 3 If errors were what you watch, O Jah, O Jehovah, who could stand?

Should we not be like him? Should we not be friends to strangers? Should we not look out for our neighbors? Should we not take care of each other? Should we not put other people's interests ahead of our own? Should we not get together and share our love and our hopes and our faith with others, especially with those who are like minded to support the weak and build them up? To give our spark of faith to those who have none.

Faith is like a fire. And it can spread. If you associate with a faithful person, and they radiate that faith it is contagious. I have had the humble privileged of helping many dozens of people in my life find faith, who were one faithless. Of course it was not I but it was God's power. He speaks through his ambassadors to the nations. So it matters little who plants and who waters. For God will make the seed of truth grow in the heart.

(1 Corinthians 13:4-7) 4 Love is patient and kind. Love is not jealous. It does not brag, does not get puffed up, 5 does not behave indecently, does not look for its own interests, does not become provoked. It does not keep account of the injury. 6 It does not rejoice over unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth. 7 It bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

A true friend shows love at all times And is a brother who is born for times of distress.
Proverbs 17:17

a reply to: SimpleIdea

I find it funny you bring up Jehovahs Witnesses and the overall theme of togetherness.

A young woman I worked with when I was 19 was disowned by all of her Jehovah's Witness family members, her father, mother, grandparents, her siblings... because she enjoyed reading tarot cards.

They kicked her out, didnt even allow her to take her clothes. She pulled it together, found a different church. She tried to reconcile for a few years , but slipped further and further into depression and missed her family dearly.

She ended up committing suicide. Her family didn't have a service for her, nothing. No one knows where she's buried, if she was cremated, nothing.

A church only represents togetherness if you fit the mold, otherwise it can cause just as much depression.

originally posted by: Atsbhct
a reply to: SimpleIdea

I find it funny you bring up Jehovahs Witnesses and the overall theme of togetherness.

A young woman I worked with when I was 19 was disowned by all of her Jehovah's Witness family members, her father, mother, grandparents, her siblings... because she enjoyed reading tarot cards.

They kicked her out, didnt even allow her to take her clothes. She pulled it together, found a different church. She tried to reconcile for a few years , but slipped further and further into depression and missed her family dearly.

She ended up committing suicide. Her family didn't have a service for her, nothing. No one knows where she's buried, if she was cremated, nothing.

A church only represents togetherness if you fit the mold, otherwise it can cause just as much depression.

That is a depressing experience. But it does tie in with serving God. No one is forced to. If one chose to serve God they voluntarily chose to do his will. Just as if in society in generual you become a criminal you can end up going to jail for it and become alienated from your family because of your bad choices, or just the same if you go to let's say a college or university that has standards and norms and you agree to them and then chose to ignore them, you can get kicked out.

The same is true among God's people. If you agree to follow what the Bible says, and then go against it you can be shunned. It is a spiritual discipline. In her case you said it was because she got involved with spiritism. To help you understand why a servant of God cannot be involved in the occult and serve God at the same time scripture says:

(1 Corinthians 10:20, 21) . . .No; but I say that what the nations sacrifice, they sacrifice to demons and not to God; and I do not want you to become sharers with the demons. 21 You cannot be drinking the cup of Jehovah and the cup of demons; you cannot be partaking of “the table of Jehovah” and the table of demons.

And in another place:

(2 John 9-11) . . .. The one who does remain in this teaching is the one who has both the Father and the Son. 10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your homes or say a greeting to him. 11 For the one who says a greeting to him is a sharer in his wicked works.

If one is practicing spiritism, which is listed along with murder, adultery, and immorality, and idolatry, and slander, and they refuse to stop their willful practice of this deadly and filthy sin, they must be removed to maintain the cleanliness of God's people. The same is true if your are a child molester, or a homosexual, or an immoral person in any way.

I wanted to bring this up, because there are standards for being a servant of God. And they are high. And there is a reason a lot of people like the JWs and say they are nice people, and realize how good they are, but they themselves do not become witnesses. They do not want to meet the high moral standards in the Bible to become a Christian.

None of these people can become Christians:

(1 Corinthians 6:9, 10) . . .Those who are sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, men who submit to homosexual acts, men who practice homosexuality, 10 thieves, greedy people, drunkards, revilers, and extortioners will not inherit God’s Kingdom.

Also these:

(Revelation 21:8) . . .But as for the cowards and those without faith and those who are disgusting in their filth and murderers and the sexually immoral and those practicing spiritism and idolaters and all the liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur. This means the second death.”


If one were to come into God's organization and then turn to any of these disgusting practices and refuse to repent, they are removed from the congregation to maintain the cleanliness of it. God's people are no ordinary people. They have God's spirit, and Jesus as its head. And mighty angels are involved in rooting out evil from the congregation.

With Jesus alive in heaven and head of the congregation it is incorruptible. It is not like the nation of Israel in the Bible that was allowed to become so corrupt and overrun with evil that it was rejected. The Christian congregation is run by Jesus and he keeps it clean.

There are weak people that fall into sin. They are helped and usually regain their spiritual health. There are imposters who are like wolves. God removes these wicked people from the congregation. Although unfortunately they can do harm to Jesus' sheep while they are allowed to show their wickedness.

Then there are those who are like Judas. Who were at one time friends and followers of Jesus, but whose hearts become corrupt, as did Satan's when he was an angel. These can totally turn away from the truth and have no hope at all left in them.

I know of cases of all such.

There is one thing JWs get a lot of heat for, and it is the scriptural practice of shunning:

(1 Corinthians 5:12, 13) . . .For what do I have to do with judging those outside? Do you not judge those inside, 13 while God judges those outside? “Remove the wicked person from among yourselves.”

But as you can see it is what the Bible says to do. Did you know even ungodly people will shun wicked people without being told to. Also, the Churches of Christendom condone all of the things listed above that God condemns.

It is quite plain to see who is really living as true Christians and has the truth faith.

But that was not the point of the OP. It was more to bring out the consequences of a society that has become so fragmented and consumed with self and the pursuit of materialism, and lack of association, care, and altruism for other people.

a reply to: SimpleIdea

But that was not the point of the OP. It was more to bring out the consequences of a society that has become so fragmented and consumed with self and the pursuit of materialism, and lack of association, care, and altruism for other people.

It seems like this is the exact opposite of what that woman experienced from her own family.

originally posted by: Atsbhct
a reply to: SimpleIdea

But that was not the point of the OP. It was more to bring out the consequences of a society that has become so fragmented and consumed with self and the pursuit of materialism, and lack of association, care, and altruism for other people.

It seems like this is the exact opposite of what that woman experienced from her own family.

Even sciprutre states:

(Hebrews 12:11) . . .True, no discipline seems for the present to be joyous, but it is painful; yet afterward, it yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness to those who have been trained by it.

It is what God said to do. It is his discipline. Those who accept it repent of their wickedness and become holy before God once again. It is for their good. So it both serves to keep God's people clean, and also to help a person who is willfully sinning to repent and accept discipline. It is how a Father treats his children:

(Hebrews 12:5, 6) 5 And you have entirely forgotten the exhortation that addresses you as sons: “My son, do not belittle the discipline from Jehovah, nor give up when you are corrected by him; 6 for those whom Jehovah loves he disciplines, in fact, he scourges everyone whom he receives as a son.”

The discipline is an act of love from God. Look at how many people today that are not being disciplined by God. Do you think they will be acceptable to him when he comes to render judgement on mankind?

It also reminds me of the account of Miriam. When she began to murmur against her brother Moses with her brother Aaron. God was listening and he became enraged and struck her with leprosy. And Moses interceded and pleaded on her behalf. She was commanded to remain outside the camp of Isreal for 7 days then she could be received back:

"Now Mirʹi·am and Aaron began to speak against Moses because of the Cushʹite wife he had married, for he had taken a Cushʹite wife...And Jehovah was listening...
(Numbers 12:9-15) . . .So Jehovah’s anger burned against them, and he departed from them. 10 The cloud moved away from over the tent, and look! Mirʹi·am was struck with leprosy as white as snow. Then Aaron turned toward Mirʹi·am, and he saw that she was struck with leprosy. 11 Immediately Aaron said to Moses: “I beg you, my lord! Please do not hold this sin against us! We have acted foolishly in what we have done. 12 Please, do not let her continue like someone dead, whose flesh is half eaten away at birth!” 13 And Moses began to cry out to Jehovah, saying: “O God, please heal her! Please!” 14 Jehovah replied to Moses: “If her father would spit directly in her face, would she not be humiliated for seven days? Let her be quarantined for seven days outside the camp, and afterward she may be brought back in.” 15 So Mirʹi·am was quarantined outside the camp for seven days, and the people did not break camp until Mirʹi·am was brought back in.

Most show are shunned in such a manner humbly come to their senses and repent, and are quickly returned to the flock. The majority of all JWs who are disciplined for graves sins are return to the flock within several months, some it can take longer, a year or so.

Better to receive discipline now, then to be destroyed at Armageddon for practicing what will prevent you from entering into God's kingdom.

a reply to: SimpleIdea

Very insightful, yet sad OP.

We do live in an age where people are isolating themselves to a social life online... and are reaching out less and less to others in real life, in a spirit of helpful caring community.

We do need to show more love to each other, but sometimes that can be difficult when we feel broken and hurt, and want to protect our hearts from being hurt again.

a reply to: SimpleIdea

Yep, it seems like the best way to foster togetherness is to create a cult with ridiculous and petty rules and shun all those who believe differently, like 99% of the world.

Sad.

originally posted by: Atsbhct
a reply to: SimpleIdea

Yep, it seems like the best way to foster togetherness is to create a cult with ridiculous and petty rules and shun all those who believe differently, like 99% of the world.

Sad.

Those are rules set out in the Bible. And it is divinely inspired. As you have clearly seen. Perhaps you don't believe in the Bible. I respect that. But just because there are a people who do practice what God requires from the Bible does not make them a cult, not like you claim. There is no human JWs look up to or serve, as you would indicate. The form of worship JWs have is the exact same one the first century Christians had in the Bible.

And the 1st century Christians were also called a sect, a cult, and worse. It becomes more and more obvious every day who really has the true Christian faith.

originally posted by: SimpleIdea

originally posted by: Atsbhct
a reply to: SimpleIdea

Yep, it seems like the best way to foster togetherness is to create a cult with ridiculous and petty rules and shun all those who believe differently, like 99% of the world.

Sad.

And the 1st century Christians were also called a sect, a cult, and worse. It becomes more and more obvious every day who really has the true Christian faith.

And you believe this is the JW’s? That’s comical at best. Your OP is the perfect personification of JW’s. Most become JW’s because they are depressed and lonely. It’s a glorified support group. ONLY if you do what they say.

I will say that there are some good people in your religion. Smart people — not so much.

Takes one to know one. I spent 21 years in that cult.

a reply to: SimpleIdea

I just read the part in your OP where you state it’s all the same individuals posting in JW threads attempting to derail.

Listen, we don’t attempt to derail. JW’s do a good job of contradicting themselves.

Like I said, the JW’s are a mighty fine support group. But that’s all they are. Their Doctrine is broken.

Your just one, in a long list of JW’s, that have tried to spread their message on these boards. You’re not going to find any followers here. Is that even what you’re looking for? Or just looking to count some time without having to leave your house?

I honestly don’t mean to be rude. You do seem less arrogant than your predecessors. It’s interesting about how much the JW’s preach humility. When the majority Of JW’s deal with the public, humility is the last thing we see.

Let’s just ignore the child molesters in JW,org hey, pretend it isn’t a reality

God is a God of justice, your organisation hides and harbours predators, you will be judged condemned and sent from the Fathers presence

You, you have chosen to protect evil

I like it. Family depressing you? No problem! Join the Witnesses and no more family. Depression solved.

Some people want to please everyone, to be popular. That is not a good way of thinking, because everyone is different and no matter how you try you will never get along with everyone completely. I tend to talk to people about what they are interested in or what we have in common and become more of aquaintences than friends with a lot of people. I do have some good friends, maybe about five total, but most are just people you know that you chat with occasionally about things. I do have relatives, but those are not really considered friends, my brother is my brother, this is way deeper than being a friend. My wife is my wife, not necessary my friend, her role is way more important than a friends role.

We need something to do, it does not have to be expensive, it does not have to be extravagant. Sitting around a campfire talking to some friends is better than going to an expensive restaurant and acting like someone you really are not. A cake does not have to be highly decorated to taste good, in fact the highly decorated ones usually taste worse than a homemade scratch cake with a good recipe. We are creating this problem in our society, we are focusing on our wants and ignoring our needs. There is nothing better than sitting around the table with friends having a good conversation over coffee and cookies or for some, a beer and spareribs.

Actually there are more important dangerous issues concerning JW,

Their own "blood guilt" over their changing of yes then no on various blood issues as they coach their loved ones on their death bed and reminding them to reject blood transfusions. Their doctrine has changed so many times over the last 50 years.

But the most important danger is the Watchtower Society has convinced their sheep that THEY (the watchtower) is enlighted and the ONLY church on this earth that is being directed by the Hoy Spirit.

My neice has been selected as one of the 144,000 that will be going to heaven which they have constantly changed.

1914 !!!! Those alive will NEVER die.

Debating a JW is a waste of time. During confidential debate with two elders (seperately) over 4 months each one admit the Watchtower Tract and Society is NOT enlightened and are trapped out of fear of losing what they love most - their family.

DS

LOL Masonicus!

I feel like the number 1 reason world wide for depression is that folks will spend most of their lives working at something that is unfulfilling without enough nature, piece and quite in their lives. They'll scrape buy having very little of what they truly want in life.

Its weird though if your born into say farming and land, most of the youth will want out of it.
Arnold Shwarschneggar left Switzerland and came to the USA with nothing because he couldn't see himself being a farmer like his parents.

Too much clouds and gloomy weather mess my mood up more than anything these days.
Thank God the sun's shining today. Its been flooding here for weeks.

a reply to: SimpleIdea

I don't want to attach love to a religion. Anyone can love. Love holds everything together. I personally like the idea that all sentient beings are God in their entirety. We shape the world. And most of us live according to rules that allow us to live halfway in peace. Respect life. Respect your environment. Respect human dignity. Accept that everyone has faults. And that we have a dark side. Help those who need help. Treat all people equally. Argue but don't hate.

I think there's always been depression. It's just never been recognized or diagnosed in the past. I've had the pleasure. About three months. A mild depression. No fun. The brain becomes self-reliant. But it wasn't my environment that caused it. It was a severe sports injury.

I respect my environment. I treat (almost) everyone with respect. And yet I make mistakes every day, and yet I lie at least once a day. Life cannot always be sunshine. And we cannot give love around the clock. There are good days and bad days. And we all have to die. No one knows what comes after. In the end, it doesn't matter because we're not here anymore.

The world today is a better world than it was 20/30 years ago. People live longer. Education has increased worldwide. Fewer children die. Many diseases have been eradicated. We know much more. We have the Internet. Unfortunately there are still too many extremists. Religious and ideological extremists. Everyone should believe what they want to believe. And nobody should be forced to believe anything. But maybe it doesn't matter, the world is facing big problems. Climate change, whether man-made or natural, will radically change the world in the coming years. And then it won't help, if everybody does his own thing, then we all have to stick together. More refugees. More wars over resources. Less habitat. Changed working conditions. And so on. We should be prepared. And if we are to blame, that also means that we can influence something. Praying will not save us, i think.

I don't really get lonely.
I earned my solitude and I treasure it.

“Do you hate people?”

“I don't hate them...I just feel better when they're not around.”

― Charles Bukowski, Barfly

not many people grow up in large families anymore
we get bused to schools, sometimes without our siblings/neighbors
general reduction in human interaction

a fairly sensitive person (child) surrounded by bullies will conclude that people are bad and interaction is a negative experience, hence closing oneself away.

sadly, even many online sites are inundated with bullies.
most of the bullies themselves are miserable and poorly socialized.

going to church is a great way to build human relationships in a positive environment.

I wish everyone here positive socialization.

(dang, I just re-read this and it sounds all touchy-feely psychobabble)

originally posted by: ElGoobero
not many people grow up in large families anymore
we get bused to schools, sometimes without our siblings/neighbors
general reduction in human interaction

a fairly sensitive person (child) surrounded by bullies will conclude that people are bad and interaction is a negative experience, hence closing oneself away.

sadly, even many online sites are inundated with bullies.
most of the bullies themselves are miserable and poorly socialized.

going to church is a great way to build human relationships in a positive environment.

I wish everyone here positive socialization.

(dang, I just re-read this and it sounds all touchy-feely psychobabble)

Growing up around a large family and being force fed church is probably the main reason I prefer rolling solo for the most part.