Is the Pillar of Cloud in the Bible the same as cigar shaped U.F.O.'s today?

originally posted by: ArMaP

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: ArMaP

and then theres option 3

Things actually happened as the book describes, but due to limited understanding of primitive people... they could only describe what they saw as "gods"

That's included in option 2, things happened in a different way.

Chances are IF moses or Ezekiel saw a space ship... or even a ship from out modern era, they could only really think it was the "gods"... whereas it could have just been an advanced civilization just peeking in...

True, but what if they really see gods?

Although I find an extraterrestrial visitation more likely than a visitation from god(s), the fact is that we do not really have any way of knowing which (if any) of the two happened. It's even possible that both happened, and that an extraterrestrial/extradimensional/temporal visitation was followed by a visitation from god or vice versa.

From very early on as a child, while sitting through mind-numbingly boring church services, I often wondered why these ancient goat herders got to see 'God' & witness 'miracles' while we're to just take their word for it. What made them so special? Why are we so insignificant in Gods eyes by comparison?

No. If God would have appeared before the goat herders then He/She would have been making regular appearances.
Despite what the Bible says, the Divine doesn't play favourites.

originally posted by: neoholographic
a reply to: Ectoplasm8

I figured this would be your response after I destroyed your argument.

You got me "neoholographic"!
Swiss rolls, egg rolls, breakfast rolls, fruitcake, more.. more.. more of the ingenious interpretations!!

originally posted by: RabidOne
Great thread Neo.

I've been saying for years that the 'cloud by day, a pillar of fire by night', could be no other than a craft of some kind.
Whoever was controlling the craft must have had a great sense of humour; the desert that the Jews were said to be crossing, can be comfortably covered by foot in a few days. One has to ask, what were they doing for 40 years? Just by orientating oneself by the Sun, surely at least some of the Jews would have realised that they were being deceived. [It's also curious why all those people, said to number an astonishing 2.5 million, did not leave a trace of their existence]

The Book of Enoch has even more references to flying & 'Sons of God'.
Although Enoch was removed from the earliest Bibles, there's a few quotes from the book in the NT.

There's a well known Biblical quote that I think is rather obvious but I've never heard questioned;
Exodus 20:5 "You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God ... " [then issues a threat to terrorise ones family for several generations] This clearly indicates that the speaker has rivals.

There is only one Creator. Christian doctrine agrees that there's only one God. So therefore the speaker of the above quote could not be God. So who could it possibly be then? To my mind, taking into account all the spacecraft ..... er, I mean 'clouds' & 'pillars of fire' buzzing around, & the fact that the locals considered them as 'Gods', it could only be off-world travellers with advanced technology.

It wasn't that long ago where an isolated tribe in Papua New Guinea thought that white men flying a Cessna were Gods. They could fly. Produce fire in their hands. Make music come from a box. They could even capture ones image with a magical device. They must be Gods.
It would be no different to a pack of goat herders who encountered off-world travellers who could fly. They must be Gods I tells ya! lol

Speaking of flying pillars. When I was around 9yo, my younger brother & I stood transfixed as a large cigar shaped craft moved very slowly for at least a few minutes off in the distance before taking off in the blink of an eye.
Looking at my brother I asked "Did you see that?" "yeeaahh" came his awed reply. Strangely that we never mentioned it until over 20 years later when I reminded my brother, who is a Pentecostal.

Thanks and good points.

Here's something else that's interesting.

Thutmose III had experiences with U.F.O.'s that were a rod long and a rod wide.

In the year 22, in the third month of winter, in the sixth hour of the day, the scribes of the House of Life noticed a circle of fire that was coming from the sky [...] From the mouth it emitted a foul breath. It had no head. Its body was one rod long and one rod wide.¹ It had no voice. And from that the hearts of the scribes became confused and they threw themselves down on their bellies [...] then they reported the thing to the Pharaoh [...] His Majesty ordered [...] has been examined [...] and he was meditating on what had happened, that it was recorded in the scrolls of the House of the Life. Now after some days had passed, these things became more and more numerous in the skies. Their splendor exceeded that of the sun and extended to the limits of the four angles of the sky [...] High and wide in the sky was the position from which these fire circles came and went. The army of the Pharaoh looked on with him in their midst. It was after supper. Then these fire circles ascended higher into the sky and they headed toward the south. Fish and birds then fell from the sky. A marvel never before known since the foundation of their land [...] And Pharaoh caused incense to be brought to make peace with Earth² [...] and what happened was ordered to be written in the Annals of the House of Life so that it be remembered for all time forward.

www.fanwave.it...

This is from the Tulli Papyrus that went "missing" shortly after it was discovered. I think the Vatican or some other powerful entity has it. This papyrus had to be taken and kept hidden because it shows clear evidence of a U.F.O. sighting. Here's an Ancient Egyptian measuring rod.





There goes that shape again!!! Cigar shaped U.F.O.'s!





The reason this would need to be covered up is because 1, it's clearly a U.F.O. sighting and 2, Thutmose III is believed by some to be the Pharoah in the time of Moses. This could point to the identity of Moses and also point to the involvement of U.F.O.'s involved in the Exodus. You can see why the Vatican might have hidden this. Let's look closer at Thutmose III.

Thutmose III came to power when he was less than 2 years old. So his Fathers main wife, he was born to a minor wife, ruled as his Regent for 22 years. She was basically Pharoah. Her name was Queen Hatshepsut. Some believe Hatshepsut was the Pharoah's daughter who found and raised Moses. Is there a Commoner around who gets high rank? Yes, his name is Senenmut. Here's more:

Senenmut was of low commoner birth....Senenmut first enters the historical record on a national level as the "Steward of the God's Wife" (Hatshepsut) and "Steward of the King's Daughter" (Neferure). Some Egyptologists place Senenmut's entry into royal service during the reign of Thutmose I, but it is far more likely that it occurred during either the reign of Thutmose II or while Hatshepsut was still regent and not pharaoh. After Hatshepsut was crowned pharaoh, Senenmut was given more prestigious titles and became high steward of the king....Although it is not known where he is buried, Senenmut had a chapel and a tomb constructed for himself.The chapel is at (TT71) in the Tombs of the Nobles and the tomb is at (TT353), near Hatshepsut's mortuary temple, and contains a famous star ceiling. They were both heavily vandalized during the reign of Thutmose III, perhaps during the latter's campaign to eradicate all trace of Hatshepsut's memory.

en.wikipedia.org...

Thutmose III started out ruling and caring for Hatshepsut, but either during the latter part of his reign or his second son's reign, they tried to erase Hatshepsut and Senenmut from memory.

Here's more about Senenmut:

According to Egyptologist Peter Dorman, “Senenmut may justifiably be described as one of the most eminent and influential persons of the Eighteenth Dynasty.” Living during the reign of Thutmosis III and Hatshepsut, he achieved high rank with titles including Tutor of the King’s Daughter (that is Hatshepsut’s daughter, Neferure), Overseer of all the Works of the King, and High Steward of Amun. His duties in the administration of the religious estate included being Overseer of the Double Granary, the Fields, the Garden, and Cows of Amun. Both monarchs, but especially Hatshepsut, showered him with gifts of statuary and other signs of their esteem.

www.egyptianstudysociety.com...

Here's a Commoner becoming one of the most powerful men in Egypt. Some people think Senenmut was Moses.

CONT'D

Senemut’s high standing in the court during the reign of Hatshepsut, coupled with him being wiped from the Egyptian historical narrative, and the correlation between the biblical and Egyptian dating, would suggest therefore that he was the person we know from the Bible as Moses.

www.ancient-origins.net...

WOW

Just think about that. This could be a huge reason why the Vatican or some other entity has hidden the Tulli Papyrus. It connects Thutmose III to the same cigar or pillar shaped U.F.O.'s Moses and the people of the Exodus saw!

Thutmose III first born Amenemhat died before his Father so his second son Amenhotep II became Pharoah after him.

Some say when Hatshepsut died, there was a falling out between Thutmose III and Senenmut. He left and came back as Moses.

Either Thutmose III or Amenhotep II tried to erase Hatshepsut and Senenmut from memory. What could they have done? Erasing them from memory back then was like erasing them for all eternity.

Were they upset because Hatshepsut gave Senenmut(Moses) so much power and he's responsible for the death of their Son/Brother and more?

Things that make you go hmmmmmmm

a reply to: neoholographic

Look, I understand why people want the Bible to be a book of fairy tales full of magical metaphors.

The Bible is an anthology of 66 Books. There are 39 books in the Old Testament and 27 in the New Testament. The anthology consists of compiling texts in a variety of forms that are all linked by the belief that they collectively contain the word of God. These texts are historical accounts, hymns, allegorical, parables, and didactic letters.

As you can see, the bible is not simply a single book of fairy tales full of magical metaphors.

If the Bible is talking about things like U.F.O's and genetic engineering, then it hits close to home and becomes all too real.

If and that is a big IF then...all the incidents and atrocities that described in the OT are the works of the Aliens. The flood that destroyed the earth is also made by aliens. The killing of the firstborns in Egypt, the plaques in Egypt, the Exodus, Deuteronomy, the prophets etc. are all because of the aliens. All for what ? To make Jesus an alien-human hybrid ?

Why call it a cloudy pillar if it's just cloudy? That makes no sense.

Because a pillar of cloud is just a pillar of cloud and not an U.F.O

Again, they knew exactly what they were describing just like Zechariah and the flying roll.

Let me repeat my self since you didn´t read my post above yours. The text says "flying scroll" and not "flying roll" as you claim.

I looked again, and there before me was a flying scroll.

The LXX translation says this:

ἐξῆρεν δὲ ὁ ἄγγελος τοῦ θεοῦ ὁ προπορευόμενος τῆς παρεμβολῆς τῶν υἱῶν Ισραηλ καὶ ἐπορεύθη ἐκ τῶν ὄπισθεν ἐξῆρεν δὲ καὶ ὁ στῦλος τῆς νεφέλης ἀπὸ προσώπου αὐτῶν καὶ ἔστη ἐκ τῶν ὀπίσω αὐτῶν

That text describes the following picture that i posted on my previous post. I highlighted the relevant part.

So, they call it a cloud because that and birds is all they see in the sky but he tells you it looks like a stylos or a pillar.

See my previous post concerning "Pillar of Smoke" and "Pillar of Fire".

Also a pillar is vertical and not horizontal as the pillar is a structural element that transmits, through compression, the weight of the structure above to other structural elements below.

He wrote the book Spaceships of Ezekiel.

Yes, i have read Ezekiel too. But i do not think he described spaceships. Anyway here a link called What do you think it was that Ezekiel saw. which offers an alternative that what Ezekiel actually describes is a cooking stove.

Go figure...Spaceships and cooking stove.

I know you want to make it mystical and magical but it's not.

No i am not. I am simply correcting you where you are wrong. I am not discounting the possibility of another civilization in the vast universe that God created. What you are doing however, is speculative and misinterpretation of the actual texts.

Anyway thanks for the interesting and high speculative thread Neo. ATS could use a lot of those kind of threads. You know Underground bases,UFOS, aliens etc. instead of the political news i see in first page all the time. After all Dulce base, Roswell, aliens collaborating with humans, led me to join ATS.

On the particular thread of yours however, we agree to disagree and so i am moving on.

Peace

a reply to: Seed76

Wrong, just wrong! You said:

If and that is a big IF then...all the incidents and atrocities that described in the OT are the works of the Aliens. The flood that destroyed the earth is also made by aliens. The killing of the firstborns in Egypt, the plaques in Egypt, the Exodus, Deuteronomy, the prophets etc. are all because of the aliens. All for what ? To make Jesus an alien-human hybrid ?

Again, I say Extraterrestrial or extradimensional. Why wouldn't God use the technology or the laws of physics he created to do things? If everything he does is magical, why did he carry out surgery on Adam to make Eve instead of just chanting a few words and saying viola?

Why does God ride on a swift cloud?

1The burden of Egypt. Behold, the LORD rideth upon a swift cloud, and shall come into Egypt: and the idols of Egypt shall be moved at his presence, and the heart of Egypt shall melt in the midst of it.

Why not just magically show up out of nowhere? Why does he need to ride on a swift cloud to get to Egypt?

In the Exodus, why did God descend in a cloud? why did God lead the Egyptians in a cloud when he could have just saved time, wiggled Moses nose and viola they're in Israel.

Why did God, who travels in Magic smoke, just skip the smoke and magically make the people of the Exodus just appear in Israel and save them the trip?

Why did Ezekiel's magical mystical bicycle or whatever he was describing have wheels? Why would God need anything with wheels to get around? I will quote NASA Engineer Blumrich one more time.

My own involvement in the subject of extraterrestrial visitors began with a vehemently negative attitude. Having worked as an aeronautical engineer since 1934—first in the design and analysis of aircraft, then for the past fifteen years in the design and development of both launching vehicles and spacecraft—I was firmly entrenched in the camp of those who declare visits from outer space to be an impossibility.

]It was in this frame of mind that I began to read Erich von Däniken's Chariots of the Gods? His claim that the prophet Ezekiel had encounters with spaceships prompted me to read the biblical book of Ezekiel carefully with the intention of proving von Däniken wrong. By the time I had got to verse 7 of the very first chapter, however, I found myself interpreting a description of the landings legs of some kind of flying vehicle: "Their legs were straight. and the soles of their feet were round and they sparkled like burnished bronze." Having designed and tested such structures myself, I could not deny that it was possible to read in this a direct, yet simple, technical description.

The contrast of that evidently clear passage with the quite hazy pictures sketched by the rest of the chapter made me realize that the prophet could not have known what it was he had seen, or could not have understood it. I realize the necessary consequences of this: the prophet could only describe his encounters with space vehicles and their crews in the terms available to him—with words and comparisons familiar to him and his contemporaries. So I began taking Ezekiel seriously, in an engineering sense.

www.spaceshipsofezekiel.com...

I can go on and on. The fact is, God created technology and the laws of physics, why wouldn't he use them? It doesn't make God any less God because he uses these things.

Also, Jesus, the Angels and more would be Aliens.

This doesn't mean their made of flesh and blood but it's obvious they can take on flesh and blood. Jesus walked the Earth, the Sons of God slept with the daughters of men and the people of Sodom wanted to sleep with some Angels. Jesus said though that earth isn't his home.

John 14:2

In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

Where was this place? Texas? Seattle?

Jesus said in 18:36

Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

Where's His Kingdom if it's not of this world?

What does the word Alien mean?

: belonging or relating to another person, place, or thing : STRANGE
an alien environment

b: relating, belonging, or owing allegiance to another country or government : FOREIGN
alien residents
c: EXOTIC sense 1
alien plants

d: coming from another world : EXTRATERRESTRIAL
alien beings
an alien spaceship

IT JUST MEANS COMING FROM ANOTHER WORLD!!

Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

What I'm doing is describing exactly what the the text says.

I know people hate this because it makes the Bible all too real instead of God riding around in magical clouds! There's nothing wrong for people to believe this if this is their faith but the pseudoskeptics and fake debunkers want it that way because they can't handle it if the Bible isn't all fairy tales and metaphors. Again, look at when God created Eve:

21 And the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;

22 And the rib, which the Lord God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

Why not just use magic? Why put him in a deep sleep first and then close him up?

Why was God walking in a Garden?

Genesis 3

8 And they heard the voice of the Lord God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the Lord God amongst the trees of the garden.

9 And the Lord God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?

Why was God walking in a Garden? Why isn't he on a magic carpet or in a puff of magic smoke?

Why did he say, Adam, where art thou?

Why didn't he say Adam, I know you're behind that tree I see all through my magic smoke?

Your posts make no sense.

I know why you and others hate this because again, it makes God real instead of some fairy tail that rides around in magic smoke.

The point is he can do both.

He can raise Lazarus from the dead and also walk around a Garden, perform surgery on Adam and ride around in a U.F.O. instead of magic smoke.

I like it!

I'm one who definitely believes in Ancient Aliens.

And do not believe the Myth Jesus.

originally posted by: Annee
I like it!

I'm one who definitely believes in Ancient Aliens.

And do not believe the Myth Jesus.

Thanks and it's a solid theory but Jesus isn't a myth.

In fact, the evidence shows Jesus was a historical figure who rose from the dead.

1. We can't view the popularity of Jesus today to Jesus when he walked the earth. There was about 300 million people on earth at that time and Jesus came in contact with about .0001% or 3,000 people during his lifetime and most didn't know who he was. The point is, the death of Jesus wouldn't be known throughout the world. He would be seen as just another religious leader that died.

2. There were many groups back then popping up here and there but when their leader died, the group died out. The Followers of Jesus became more determined after his death. They were ready to die if they had to. Why? Jesus said he would be raised from the dead but if he wasn't raised from the dead, why did they become more determined to tell people about Jesus?

3. You start to see the followers of Christ show up in the history books as a strange group that would die instead of turning from Jesus. People couldn't understand it because Jesus was dead. Why would these people become more determined and why are they willing to die for a guy that died?

4. At this point, they were still a smaller group because you had to convert to Judaism first.

5. Then cam Saul who became Paul and changed everything. You have to ask again. Why would Saul, who had a good life as a Jew moving up the ranks and who persecuted Christians, risk death, jail and more for Jesus? Again, it makes no sens if Jesus is dead. Why Jesus?

6. Next, Emperor Constantine converted to Christianity. Again, I think there's plenty of evidence that Jesus was a historical figure but was also God who rose from the dead.

It makes no sense for the Disciples to become more empowered and more determined if Jesus said he would be raised from the dead but he didn't actually rise from the dead. A Good book to start with is The Case for Christ.

I accept the Ancient Alien theories because Alien just means from another place. It's egocentric to think that earth is the only place in the cosmos that has life and we would be aliens to those worlds.

Heaven is a place. If God rides around in magical clouds all day talking through puffs of smoke, why does he exist in a place? Why are their beings in this place? Why are there mansions in this place?

It's just that the term Alien has a negative connotation because of Professional debunkers and pseudoskeptics. It just mean from another place and that's not a bad thing.

originally posted by: neoholographic
CONT'D

Senemut’s high standing in the court during the reign of Hatshepsut, coupled with him being wiped from the Egyptian historical narrative, and the correlation between the biblical and Egyptian dating, would suggest therefore that he was the person we know from the Bible as Moses.

www.ancient-origins.net...

WOW

Just think about that. This could be a huge reason why the Vatican or some other entity has hidden the Tulli Papyrus. It connects Thutmose III to the same cigar or pillar shaped U.F.O.'s Moses and the people of the Exodus saw!

Thutmose III first born Amenemhat died before his Father so his second son Amenhotep II became Pharoah after him.

Some say when Hatshepsut died, there was a falling out between Thutmose III and Senenmut. He left and came back as Moses.

Either Thutmose III or Amenhotep II tried to erase Hatshepsut and Senenmut from memory. What could they have done? Erasing them from memory back then was like erasing them for all eternity.

Were they upset because Hatshepsut gave Senenmut(Moses) so much power and he's responsible for the death of their Son/Brother and more?

Things that make you go hmmmmmmm

Interesting. The Vatican has a lot to answer for.

The Pope ordered the destruction of the Great Library of Alexandria because it held scrolls that contradicted the churchs doctrine. Many were up to 10,000 years old.
In fact the church had the nasty habit of destroying any writings other than theirs during the 'Purges'.

Nexus magazine had an article about the Vatican library. Only one person has a key to the 'hidden vault' which is said to contain a huge store of writings that are still to be catalogued & read.
My memory on exact details is a bit vague but the Vaticans head librarian was given a young priest who had studied Hebrew & Aramaic, whose job was to start wading through the vault.

The young priest came across writings that threw a spanner in the works regarding church doctrine.
It's no surprise that the young priest was reassigned to new duties away from the library & the vault has been locked ever since according to the article.

The church would wipe out any opposition as ruthlessly as Stalin, Pol Pot or Hitler.
The peaceful Cathars followed a doctrine as taught by John, an actual disciple of the Rabbi Jesus.
The church espouses Pauline doctrine that's based upon the fictional writings from Saul/Paul who not only had never met Jesus but admits that he was totally ignorant of the Rabbi's teachings [So he just made # up. He justifies being a liar in Rom 3:7 - the Rabbi's students were so outraged at Saul/Paul fabricating nonsense in their teachers name that they confronted him to cease & desist. This is why Saul/Paul fled to Greece where they loved a ripping good yarn about 'Sons of God' with supernatural powers]

Cathar doctrine makes sense, unlike church doctrine. They were drawing people away from the church so the Pope ordered in his army to slay every man women and child. The Pope told the soldiers that they were absolved of any crime committed during the slaughter. [Pure evil as far as I'm concerned]

Apologies for straying from the UFO focus of your thread but it explains why there's so many discrepancies & missing links between actual historical documents & the Bible.

If there is such a thing as an Anti-Christ, my money is it being the Vatican.
The churchs fabrications & lies were an open secret amongst the church hierarchy & the nobility of the time.
As old Pope Leo X chortled; "How well we know what a profitable superstition this fable of Christ has been for us" [As this was witnessed & recorded by a church historian, the church doesn't bother trying to deny the quote. Instead they pretend that Leo meant other than what he said]

I'm positive that documents in the Vatican vault would fill in all the gaps in the historical record. As the church fears the truth being revealed I doubt that that will ever happen. They'd burn the records before allowing them to be studied & the findings released.

One thing that I find very curious is why does the Vatican have a huge telescope in S.America? IIRC it goes under the name of Lucifer [Lucifer was aka 'the Bringer of Light', 'the Revealer of Truth', 'the Shining One' & the 'Bright Morning Star'. Hardly sounds like a bad guy. So why did the church have Lucifer demonised?]
As the Vatican holds the biggest archive of occult knowledge on the planet [Occult means 'hidden knowledge/wisdom] they're aware of something that they've kept close to their chest. They're expecting something big to return to planet Earth. Why else would they have a powerful telescope, keep it secret & name it Lucifer?

Any return of advanced beings who were here back in Biblical times, will spell the end of the RCC & they know it.

originally posted by: neoholographic
This is from the Tulli Papyrus that went "missing" shortly after it was discovered.

Or never existed, as there is only one indirect reference to it.

Depends if they are actually just seeing the craft, the clouds with the craft, or just the clouds?


Surprised no brought up that passage about God having his greetable an colourful right hand an the itchy, doom an gloom left over the Kingdoms.

Open your tiny boxes, my God humans are unbearable. Educate yourselves. Why is it that the customer service rep at a home theatre retailer has a better understanding of the universe than you people? Get out of your stupid little fleshy boxes you abhorrent fools.

a reply to: neoholographic


Myth Jesus.

Same as Johnny Appleseed and John Chapman.

Real historical person - - - barely recognizable in the myth.

I use the terminology "Off Planet Being" - - not alien or ET.

I am atheist - - I do not believe in a God(s).

originally posted by: RabidOne

originally posted by: neoholographic
CONT'D

Senemut’s high standing in the court during the reign of Hatshepsut, coupled with him being wiped from the Egyptian historical narrative, and the correlation between the biblical and Egyptian dating, would suggest therefore that he was the person we know from the Bible as Moses.

www.ancient-origins.net...

WOW

Just think about that. This could be a huge reason why the Vatican or some other entity has hidden the Tulli Papyrus. It connects Thutmose III to the same cigar or pillar shaped U.F.O.'s Moses and the people of the Exodus saw!

Thutmose III first born Amenemhat died before his Father so his second son Amenhotep II became Pharoah after him.

Some say when Hatshepsut died, there was a falling out between Thutmose III and Senenmut. He left and came back as Moses.

Either Thutmose III or Amenhotep II tried to erase Hatshepsut and Senenmut from memory. What could they have done? Erasing them from memory back then was like erasing them for all eternity.

Were they upset because Hatshepsut gave Senenmut(Moses) so much power and he's responsible for the death of their Son/Brother and more?

Things that make you go hmmmmmmm

Interesting. The Vatican has a lot to answer for.

The Pope ordered the destruction of the Great Library of Alexandria because it held scrolls that contradicted the churchs doctrine. Many were up to 10,000 years old.
In fact the church had the nasty habit of destroying any writings other than theirs during the 'Purges'.

Nexus magazine had an article about the Vatican library. Only one person has a key to the 'hidden vault' which is said to contain a huge store of writings that are still to be catalogued & read.
My memory on exact details is a bit vague but the Vaticans head librarian was given a young priest who had studied Hebrew & Aramaic, whose job was to start wading through the vault.

The young priest came across writings that threw a spanner in the works regarding church doctrine.
It's no surprise that the young priest was reassigned to new duties away from the library & the vault has been locked ever since according to the article.

The church would wipe out any opposition as ruthlessly as Stalin, Pol Pot or Hitler.
The peaceful Cathars followed a doctrine as taught by John, an actual disciple of the Rabbi Jesus.
The church espouses Pauline doctrine that's based upon the fictional writings from Saul/Paul who not only had never met Jesus but admits that he was totally ignorant of the Rabbi's teachings [So he just made # up. He justifies being a liar in Rom 3:7 - the Rabbi's students were so outraged at Saul/Paul fabricating nonsense in their teachers name that they confronted him to cease & desist. This is why Saul/Paul fled to Greece where they loved a ripping good yarn about 'Sons of God' with supernatural powers]

Cathar doctrine makes sense, unlike church doctrine. They were drawing people away from the church so the Pope ordered in his army to slay every man women and child. The Pope told the soldiers that they were absolved of any crime committed during the slaughter. [Pure evil as far as I'm concerned]

Apologies for straying from the UFO focus of your thread but it explains why there's so many discrepancies & missing links between actual historical documents & the Bible.

If there is such a thing as an Anti-Christ, my money is it being the Vatican.
The churchs fabrications & lies were an open secret amongst the church hierarchy & the nobility of the time.
As old Pope Leo X chortled; "How well we know what a profitable superstition this fable of Christ has been for us" [As this was witnessed & recorded by a church historian, the church doesn't bother trying to deny the quote. Instead they pretend that Leo meant other than what he said]

I'm positive that documents in the Vatican vault would fill in all the gaps in the historical record. As the church fears the truth being revealed I doubt that that will ever happen. They'd burn the records before allowing them to be studied & the findings released.

One thing that I find very curious is why does the Vatican have a huge telescope in S.America? IIRC it goes under the name of Lucifer [Lucifer was aka 'the Bringer of Light', 'the Revealer of Truth', 'the Shining One' & the 'Bright Morning Star'. Hardly sounds like a bad guy. So why did the church have Lucifer demonised?]
As the Vatican holds the biggest archive of occult knowledge on the planet [Occult means 'hidden knowledge/wisdom] they're aware of something that they've kept close to their chest. They're expecting something big to return to planet Earth. Why else would they have a powerful telescope, keep it secret & name it Lucifer?

Any return of advanced beings who were here back in Biblical times, will spell the end of the RCC & they know it.

Exactly and you make some good points.

originally posted by: RabidOne
The Pope ordered the destruction of the Great Library of Alexandria because it held scrolls that contradicted the churchs doctrine. Many were up to 10,000 years old.

Really? Which Pope was that?

Nexus magazine had an article about the Vatican library. Only one person has a key to the 'hidden vault' which is said to contain a huge store of writings that are still to be catalogued & read.
My memory on exact details is a bit vague but the Vaticans head librarian was given a young priest who had studied Hebrew & Aramaic, whose job was to start wading through the vault.

The young priest came across writings that threw a spanner in the works regarding church doctrine.
It's no surprise that the young priest was reassigned to new duties away from the library & the vault has been locked ever since according to the article.

That sounds like a made up story. First, I doubt there's only one person with the key, as it makes no sense. Second, finding some writings that go against the Church's doctrines doesn't mean the writings are right and the Church is wrong, there always have been things like that and the Church mostly ignores them.

One thing that I find very curious is why does the Vatican have a huge telescope in S.America? IIRC it goes under the name of Lucifer [Lucifer was aka 'the Bringer of Light', 'the Revealer of Truth', 'the Shining One' & the 'Bright Morning Star'. Hardly sounds like a bad guy. So why did the church have Lucifer demonised?]
As the Vatican holds the biggest archive of occult knowledge on the planet [Occult means 'hidden knowledge/wisdom] they're aware of something that they've kept close to their chest. They're expecting something big to return to planet Earth. Why else would they have a powerful telescope, keep it secret & name it Lucifer?

That's not exactly true.
- The telescope (VATT - Vatican Advanced Technology Telescope) is not in South America, it's in the United States, in the Mount Graham International Observatory in Arizona;
- The telescope is operated jointly by the Vatican Observatory and the University of Arizona;
- The telescope is not secret;
- The telescope is not called Lucifer, LUCIFER (Large Binocular Telescope Near-infrared Spectroscopic Utility with Camera and Integral Field Unit for Extragalactic Research) was the name of an infrared spectrograph used on a different telescope, the Large Binocular Telescope, that's not even in the same building as the telescope operated by the Vatican Observatory;
- LUCIFER was renamed to LUCI.

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: neoholographic


Myth Jesus.

Same as Johnny Appleseed and John Chapman.

Real historical person - - - barely recognizable in the myth.

I use the terminology "Off Planet Being" - - not alien or ET.

I am atheist - - I do not believe in a God(s).

It's good you accept off planet beings as you call them because this provides a deeper meaning to the Bible. There's a surface meaning which is enough for most people to believe and is Preached in most Churches.

There's a much deeper meaning connected to Ancient Alien theories. It goes like this.

The Fallen Sons of God or who Enoch called the Watchers are under a blood curse. They came to Earth and mingled themselves with us and now we're under that blood curse.

In order to get out of this blood curse, there needed to be someone born that was incorruptible and that was Jesus. It's like Jesus has a perfect score that nobody can get because of this blood curse but we can all be partakers in that perfect score no matter if we got a b,c,d or f.

This is why there's so much talk of the Blood of Christ.

Those who are covered in the Blood of Christ on Judgment Day will not go into Perdition with the Fallen Ones which will be a horrible thing.

1 Peter 1:23

Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

So the fallen Sons of God or who Enoch calls Watchers were put under an irreversible curse. When they mingled themselves with us, we're now under that curse. The only way out is if someone was born that isn't corrupted. This is Jesus Christ.

If you read the Bible from the viewpoint of extraterrestrial or extradimensional visitation, the deeper meaning becomes very clear.

a reply to: neoholographic

What do you mean by "blood curse"?

a reply to: ArMaP

Which Pope? Does it really matter which one? They were all as bad as each other. I'll have to dig out my books & get back to you on that one.
A quick duckduckgo search says that the Archbishop Theophilus organised the destruction. The source suggests it was carried out under the guiding principle of Pope Gregory "Ignorance is the mother of piety" but maybe not the actual Pope who gave the order.
[Church doctrine is designed to keep followers ignorant so that they're dependent on the church for their very salvation. It's why they refer to them as sheep. i.e. mindless, unthinking followers. The religious concept of 'faith' is just another way of saying 'willful ignorance']

The Vaticans SECRET telescope is in S.America. It's not common knowledge because it's a SECRET.

The Nexus Magazine article can be found here - www.nexusmagazine.com - but I think one needs to pay a fee for access. [I buy the magazines so I'm not entirely sure how their website operates]

originally posted by: ArMaP
a reply to: neoholographic

What do you mean by "blood curse"?

The original sin was depicted by the Greek's as Pandora's box, which opened all the hardship and suffering into the world just like Eve. This was the fall from perfection. Due to karmic law, the repercussion for mis-doings is death and disease. The Jews would attenuate this karmic law by sacrificing their most choice animal without blemish to act as a scapegoat for their mis-doings, so that the animal would take on the suffering that was deserved for the people's sin.

This was all foreshadowing for when the perfect sacrificial lamb would come without blemish to atone for people's sins for all time. It is also important to note that the only thing that remained in Pandora's box was hope - which was Jesus who would inevitably come and make the sacrifice for all humankind and reverse the curse of the fall from the Archetype.

originally posted by: RabidOne
Which Pope? Does it really matter which one?

It does, for several reasons, some of which are:
- Popes are different individuals, with different personalities, what one thinks is different from what the next one thinks;
- It's easy to say "the Pope" without mentioning any names, as it gives a look of authenticity without proving a thing;
- It would give me an idea of when it supposedly happened.

The Vaticans SECRET telescope is in S.America. It's not common knowledge because it's a SECRET.

Why would a telescope be secret? And if it's secret, how did you got that information?

The Nexus Magazine article can be found here - www.nexusmagazine.com - but I think one needs to pay a fee for access. [I buy the magazines so I'm not entirely sure how their website operates]

Yes, it looks like they have only half a dozen of free articles, all the rest is for sale.