Victorian Railway Engineers On Drugs

George Stephenson,

Renowned as the "Father of Railways"

en.wikipedia.org... was an extraordinary man. Extremely fit and strong, wrestling, racing, leaping hedges and ditches for fun. He even practised very dangerous forms of parkour to the horror of his workmates. He walked enormous distances while choosing the course of various railways and had the ability to sleep little in uncomfortable conditions yet still be alert for a full days work. His first impression of a suitable course for the railway in question usually turned out to be the best option after surveys were made, perhaps through intuition as much as his keen powers of observation.

He was courageous and kind. When a fire broke out underground he ran to the pithead, demanded to be lowered into the pit and took a band of men with him to rapidly build a wall cutting off air to the fire, saving many lives. He was a keen and more than capable naturalist, gardener, agriculturalist, a maker of the highest quality shoe lasts, a tailor, and a tremendous engineer. He died largely as a result of overworking himself in Spain.

I have no seen no evidence indicating George Stephenson used stimulants, but his son Robert was a different case. Here he is looking bright-eyed and bushy tailed. en.wikipedia.org...
Robert worked for three years in Columbia and was known to abuse stimulants and died young.

I've seen evidence in the form of bad design by another Victorian railway engineer that I feel can only be attributed to Cocaine. This is something we need to be aware of now. Cocaine users make bad decisions, if those decisions affect us we have an interest.

Laptop battery about to go. Pity, I was enjoying this.

When looking into the background of arkinicide, a lot of our leaders are on drugs. Hunter Biden is hitting the headlines these days with his dependencies on these products. But that is ok as they profit on the private prison system.

I know drugs are not a black and white issue, seeing someone after they have not slept for a week is all down hill from there. In bringing the darkness to light a better balance needs to be found.

a reply to: Kester

Bad descision makers are prolific they dont necessarilly use coc aine so our interest should be peaked regardless but drug users of any kind make bad descisions predominantly so simple answer isn't it.

Drain the swamp, boot em all out start again and put in place real border controls then eradicate what drugs remain within from within.

But im unsure - is this thread about the drugs or the railways, are we about to embark on a massive Victorian era railway project i havnt heard of???????????

Wasn't till around 1900-1910 IIRC that opiates etc started to get restricted and who can forget a drop or two was Sherlock Holmes favourite and theres Victorian newspaper ads for all sorts of things with various drugs in them for sale over the counter.

So probably it along with copious supplies of alcohol and no drink ride laws would of probably made it rarer to find someone stone cold sober.

a reply to: Eoin249

They are just tadpoles in this pond. It goes all the way up. Why did the Taliban get kicked for cutting down on production? Why are Aussie troops protecting this production? Things might be a little different now, but the effects of US invasion in opium production is clear.

Opium does have a long history as a strong pain killer. A lot of doctors risk a lot world wide trying to give their patients some relief. How the line is drawn at the moment looks like a three year old with a crayon.

Well apparently in the late 19th century Vin Mariani was widely touted as a general tonic, which was was approved of by the Pope (and even advertised with his likeness):

Pope Leo XIII and later Pope Saint Pius X were both Vin Mariani drinkers.[7] Pope Leo appeared on a poster endorsing the wine and awarded a Vatican gold medal to Mariani for creating it.[3] Thomas Edison claimed it helped him stay awake longer.[3] Ulysses S. Grant drank Vin Mariani while writing his memoirs towards the end of his life.[8] Jules Méline, the French prime minister, drank the wine despite being otherwise anti-alcohol.[5]

en.wikipedia.org...

Coca Cola was a US version, although the coca was replaced by caffeine in the kola nut, and loads of sugar.
Although (not sure), apparently denatured coca is still imported to US factories as a flavor agent in the drink.

Bloody drug addicts.

I mean they can be the best people in the world. Be the best sport star, actors, mentors, but once we find out oncc smoked weed..

We must ostravcet them all. Each and every one of them.. No matter the substance.

But once you know they were an addict, shame them them and their entire history. Throw hem to the dogs. Foul fiends.

So sayeth with world we within.

I don't don't use lol am exempt from persecution.

a reply to: Kester

Which stimulants were being used by the son? Cocaine wasn’t even synthesized until 1859 when he died and didn’t come into widespread use until the 1880’s. So he couldn’t have been using that particular stimulant. His best option would be to chew the leaves or make a tea of them as was traditionally made in the area at the time.

Casey Jones

No engineers using on duty any more, at least in North America. Mandatory urinalysis for even the slightest infraction and being subject to "random" surprise testing every day they come to work has ended any drug use there was on the rails in the US.

There is a YouTube channel called Absolute History that is an absolute horror show with the various ways Victorian, Edwardian and other period people managed to kill themselves - everything from food additives to sketchy cosmetics to gas heated bathtubs that would boil people to death.

a reply to: peter vlar
Interesting point, thank you. I'll look for the reference in the book.

Lives of George and Robert Stephenson by Samuel Smiles
www.gracesguide.co.uk...

a reply to: Kester

I’m not saying he wasn’t utilizing any stimulants. Just pointing out that coc aine itself wasn’t an option. Chewing the leaves and drinking tea made of them will do a descent job and it’s been used by people living at high altitudes to enable them work longer so even chewing coca leaves, while more mild in it’s euphoric effects certainly isn’t lacking in its ability to act as a CNS stimulant.

Regardless, I’m curious to see what you find once you locate the reference.

a reply to: peter vlar
I'll have the precise quote tomorrow.

You got to understand that in a lot of places, when these drugs first came around in the the first wave, they weren't illegal.

Morphine during the post Civil-War era. The tonics laced with morphine!

Heron during the Jazz era or the 60s period (thanks 'Nam)

And good ol' fashioned alcohol (a drug).

Most notoriously, coc aine. My goodness, if people only knew how much blow people were doing, before they knew it messed you up.

Want to know something that will knocks your socks off? Sigmund Freud. A user of the snowy powder during that time, we was burning holes in peoples noses. That stuff was a part of his practice.

Everyone was so coked up, they thought the man was genius! He wasn't. And is still sometimes toted as much. If they do, then whatever your reading is to be called into question.

a reply to: cenpuppie

Coca Cola contained stimulants back in the day. Pretty unfair to judge folk from the past with today's standards. Besides, they created a railway to Stockton. Surely that was to score some gear, same as today

a reply to: peter vlar

Page 295.

" He was habitually careless of his health, and perhaps he indulged in narcotics to a prejudicial extent. Hence he often became 'hipped' and sometimes ill. When Mr Sopwith accompanied him to Egypt in the Titania, in 1856, he succeeded in persuading Mr Stephenson to limit his indulgence in cigars and stimulants, and the consequence was that by the end of the voyage he felt himself, as he said, 'quite a new man'. Arrived at Marseilles, he telegraphed from thence a message to Great George Street, prescribing certain stringent and salutary rules for observance in the office there on his return. But he was of a facile, social disposition, and the old associations proved too strong for him."

'Hipped' means depressed. Some people call any drugs narcotics. Sounds like the office was a drug den. Died of liver failure 1859.

a reply to: peter vlar

1860 Cocaine is first isolated from the coca leaf by Albert Neiman. He receives his PhD for his efforts.

tonydagostino.co.uk... aine/

I would say first recorded as being isolated from leaf 1860.

originally posted by: Kester
a reply to: peter vlar

Page 295.

" He was habitually careless of his health, and perhaps he indulged in narcotics to a prejudicial extent. Hence he often became 'hipped' and sometimes ill. When Mr Sopwith accompanied him to Egypt in the Titania, in 1856, he succeeded in persuading Mr Stephenson to limit his indulgence in cigars and stimulants, and the consequence was that by the end of the voyage he felt himself, as he said, 'quite a new man'. Arrived at Marseilles, he telegraphed from thence a message to Great George Street, prescribing certain stringent and salutary rules for observance in the office there on his return. But he was of a facile, social disposition, and the old associations proved too strong for him."

'Hipped' means depressed. Some people call any drugs narcotics. Sounds like the office was a drug den. Died of liver failure 1859.

Outstanding. Thanks for taking the time to find the exact citation. That’s a step or three beyond what usually occurs on ATS so kudos on that alone. I do wonder though if the “depressed” state described was a result of opium or laudanum use, particularly when traveling to Egypt on an ocean liner. As with many terms, stimulant was associated with any excessive alcoholism or narcotic use. The combination of heavy opiate use and heavy drinking would definitely lead to liver failure. Just minor speculation on my part. Again, thanks for the appropriate citation.