ASMR effect responsible for our symbiotic social relationship with dogs since ancient times..

Hi folks,

This is a quick one, but I think I'm perhaps the first to make this connection with regards to the way that we humans have interacted with dogs since ancient times. It was already suspected that a long-standing partnership with dogs was at least partly responsible for the development of our own speech capabilities, with the suggestion that a need for clear commands would be an evolutionary advantage for ourselves, in terms of controlling dogs for the hunt, for security of the camp, and for the individual comfort of a relationship between a man & his dogs.

I am now suggesting that there was a second factor which played into the relationship between Homo Sapiens & Canus Lupus Familiaris. In recent years a new feature of human's physiology was discovered, and ironically this was discovered through the medium of the Internet, and Reddit in particular. ASMR refers to a feeling of intense well-being combined with a neuro-physical tingling sensation in the scalp and down the back of the neck, often occurring in repeated waves, as experienced by some people in response to a specific gentle stimulus, often a particular sound. ASMR is triggered by things like whispering voices, paper tearing, and scalp massage.

On YouTube you can find hundreds of channels dedicated to this phenomenon, and many of us are able to experience its comforting benefits with just one or two attempts when listening to someone who practices this 'art' (it takes quite unique style & mannerisms of speech to accomplish great results). For me personally, I actually first encountered the effect directly after having heard about it, yet it wasn't through a defined ASMR artist, it was the result of listening to a hypnosis video on YouTube. At the point I would have dropped into hypnotic slumber, instead I experienced a 'drop' into ASMR tingling flooding my spine from the base of the skull. It was an oddly pleasant experience, albeit slightly strange.

My tenuous link here, in case you haven't already guessed it, is the reason behind why dogs & humans struck up such a strong interdependence over the course of many thousands of years, beyond the obvious security which dogs would have by living with humans & thereby having access to food & shelter, etc. When connecting with dogs, many of us typically stroke their heads, ears & necks, 'fussing' them, speaking to them with soothing words, as though they were human babies or children, sometimes/often making baby noises 'cooing' as we do so. Having thought about ASMR & the way it works for humans - soothing tones & sounds, massage - it is my firm belief now that our relationship with dogs was cemented by the ASMR effect being applied to dogs themselves when they are being fussed in the manner they are accustomed to. We stroke their heads/ears/neck & coo at them, talking quietly & responding to the dog's obvious enjoyment, and therein is the reason they are so deeply connected to us, because they derive often intense pleasure of a neuro-physical nature from our collective approach to fussing them with soothing tones, with this sense of comfort being highly motivating on a personal, one-to-one level, between dogs & ourselves. Anyone can see how happy dogs are when they receive this sort of attention, and if we were to watch very carefully, we could probably observe their specific reactions to ASMR-type experiences.

Thanks - please share any thoughts you may have on the matter..

ASMR - Autonomous Sensory Meridian Response, Wikipedia

ASMR; the biggest YouTube trend you've never heard of

Always glad to hear someone mention ASMR. It is an interesting sensation. You may be right about the dogs, and I would add cats to that list as well.

Cheers

Ohh that tingling feeling when they poo or pee on the carpet, or dig a mini golf course in the backyard or that tingly feeling when you got to pick up their poo in the street or when they bark all night long etc.

A need to evolve our speach to communicate with dogs????? -

Now I've heard it all.

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

How interesting! Thanks for posting and discussing. I always wondered what that was.

You could, very easily, be right about dogs. I've seen cats react with massive purring and kneading just from voice stimuli alone. Could just be a conditioned response--the voice is usually associated with petting--but it could be ASMR too.

I get this ASMR as well. Especially with music and also when I feel in close communion to God. Interesting theory in regards to the possible dog/human connection. Too bad there is not a way to measure such physiological responses easily accessible. What would one use to gauge such a thing? MRI? CAT scan(hehe)? Maybe ultra sound.

a reply to: CthruU

A need to evolve our speach to communicate with dogs????? -

Now I've heard it all.

It's actually a reasonably well-known concept & has been looked at by anthropologists due to the clear advantage that the domestication/training of dogs would have had for our early human ancestors. Something to do with an evolving mechanism in the throat - a certain bone/tendon arrangement which made for a voicebox more finely adapted for speech. Punctuated equilibrium could be the mechanism responsible for the sudden rise in capacity for complex speech, with dog control being a typical primary use of the system. Also, when one member of the species adapts with a special configuration beneficial to ongoing life success, then the other members of the species suddenly manifest the new features in the next generation. Experiments involving rats were done to test aspects of this kind of theory, and although I can't recall the source, they were successful & demonstrated a link between generations which was forged by a connection in the 'collective unconscious' of the species. Worth looking into anyway, rather than shooting from the hip with a snarkey comment before engaging your critical thinking faculties.

a reply to: AquaAscending

You could probably assess it using a voltmeter or similar electrical testing equipment, seeing as the effect is likely linked to the bioelectric field of the body. Would be cool if someone tested the theory anyway!

I like your idea.
but I dont see how we can prove this.
until we have dogs that speak.

Hmm you have me thinking.
or it could be that it is the memory of them being a pup.
do you know any one who strokes some ones head?
or makes cooing sounds? lovers do this.
maybe thats why other adults dont do it.
its view'd as odd and maybe a pervert.
far to many evil people.

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

Thanks for posting this!

It really makes sense when it comes to bonding. Especially the way we bond with pets and in return dogs are devoted to us because of this stimulation.

As to vocal commands to dogs being the source of speech. I'm not sure I think that is the only reason. Ancient man had to be social and live in groups because survival normally depended on working together. Grunting and pointing to organize complex activities, like teaching the young how to make "clothes" out of skins, how to hunt effectively, were probably more likely the source of the need for speech. Perhaps it is everything combined that the need to use speech arose. Training dogs may have just been a part of that.

Anyway, superb post! Kudos!

Interesting. I had always thought that tingling sensation was due to dopamine being released.

In my opinion, ASMR (which I've known about all my life, but thought it was just me, till the internet blew up with it) and Misophonia are the same thing, but on extremely opposite scales.

People with misophonia cannot stand certain sounds, chewing, clicking of a pen, etc.. for me it's crickets and anything repeatedly squeaking... it sends me into a fit of rage and gives me a bona fide migraine.

But ASMR, I don't get it much from youtube.. a rare few.. it all seems forced and for me, it's the unconscious things someone does that gives me tingles. Tapping while in a daze, fidgeting, a repetitive movement.. just the unconscious, unintentional things people do, and it can be any time, anywhere.. Makes a long trip on public transport bearable lol..

I think all those hot youtube chicks have actually given it a bad rap, people who don't understand it think it's sexual and people experiencing it are some sort of pervert... furthest thing for me. Or you get those talk shows with that horrible woman who eats crunchy food, and people think it's all about that while laughing after the segment at the strange people.. That crap irks me to death. Eating sounds drive me insane. It's a shame, because in rl I keep it to myself, so as to not have to explain it to people who simply don't understand it..

So.. I'm not too sure, I think the dogs might just like the attention. They groom each other similarly, as do cats. I think it is more a bonding thing, than reaction to stimulus such as ASMR..

Cats otoh, when they purr.. that has to a similar sort of sensation for them, when they go goofy and dazed.. idk..

originally posted by: CthruU
Ohh that tingling feeling when they poo or pee on the carpet, or dig a mini golf course in the backyard or that tingly feeling when you got to pick up their poo in the street or when they bark all night long etc.

A need to evolve our speach to communicate with dogs????? -

Now I've heard it all.

Sorry that your experience with dogs has been so negative. The digging probably just means your dog is infantry. Sorry for you if that's the case. Next time make sure they're Cavalry.

Outside of a few accidents my dogs had as puppies, I can't say my dogs ever act as you describe. But, then, I took the time to train and socialize them.

Lastly, co-evolution of humans and dogs is a pretty solid theory and has been researched across several specializations.

originally posted by: gallop
Eating sounds drive me insane.

Me too! It is the worst. Do certain foods seem to be worse than others for you? Potato chips and apples are torturous to my ears.

Seriously though, if dogs had hands, would they pet themselves or would they pet their humans?

originally posted by: BrianFlanders
Seriously though, if dogs had hands, would they pet themselves or would they pet their humans?

My dogs always look at me funny whenever they catch me "petting" myself...

a reply to: F2d5thCavv2

I havent felt the ASMR sensation in a few years now! It sucks, I used to get it all the time. I found it would be triggered while listening to someone give a lecture in college and things like that.

originally posted by: PokeyJoe
a reply to: F2d5thCavv2

I havent felt the ASMR sensation in a few years now! It sucks, I used to get it all the time. I found it would be triggered while listening to someone give a lecture in college and things like that.

It has been practically nonexistent for me for decades now, and when I feel it coming on, it is very weak and transient. I think as one ages and more stress accumulates, it blocks ASMR.

Cheers

This is an interesting topic for sure. I have read about the link between human vocalization and the need to use it during hunting but I don't remember it being specifically about working with dogs. It was years ago that I read about it and I don't remember the source so can't go back and read it again for clarification.

However, I do train and compete with my dogs and can tell you that they pick up on body language and signals way faster than verbal commands. As a matter of fact, when I am training them I use hand signals only until they are about 90% successful before I put a word to it. I condition certain words immediately though. It's a long explanation that I won't go into here but I condition a marker word as soon as possible.

ASMR is a new concept to me. I think the only part of it that I would care for is the scalp massage. I have watched/listened to some ASMR videos on YT but didn't have a positive reaction to any of them (granted, I didn't try all of them). I did have a few very negative reactions to some. Maybe like gallop I have misophonia? Not sure.

You could be right about the link between ASMR and bonding with our dogs. I know it certainly wouldn't hurt the bonding process.

S&F for a great thread!

originally posted by: DictionaryOfExcuses

originally posted by: gallop
Eating sounds drive me insane.

Me too! It is the worst. Do certain foods seem to be worse than others for you? Potato chips and apples are torturous to my ears.

Crunchy things, carrots, etc.. especially so if they chew with their mouth open..

I don't know how some people enjoy it. That's one reason I think it's a scale, like most things. Some people think soft, repetitive ASMR is annoying, and they're probably the ones who like those food eating videos.. yeesh!! lol

originally posted by: PokeyJoe
a reply to: F2d5thCavv2

I havent felt the ASMR sensation in a few years now! It sucks, I used to get it all the time. I found it would be triggered while listening to someone give a lecture in college and things like that.

I think I have a similar problem, but it's more because now people do it on purpose. I can't get it from most of them. But in public, just noticing someone lost in their own world, I still get it..

Even one asmr artist, asmr magic, she does a lot of tapping, etc, but it's her breathing that gets me.. the unintentional aspect of her videos.. lol..

I know what you mean about the lectures too.. makes it hard to stay alert though. ha..