Is government intervention in poor areas worth it?

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ST. LOUIS (AP) — If a streetcar line ceases operating in the St. Louis area, the federal government may want to be paid back some of the millions of dollars it spent to support the project.
In St. Louis, the U.S. government paid for about two-thirds of the $51.5 million Loop Trolley, a 2.2-mile system running from University City’s Delmar Loop to the Missouri History Museum in St. Louis, the St. Louis Post-Dispatch reported on Wednesday. The trolley began operating in November after years of delays. Rider numbers have been low.

...............The project and the St. Louis’s trolley have been subject to similar criticisms, although Milwaukee officials say rider numbers on the local streetcar have so far exceeded expectations.

Is this the dumbest thing you've ever read? 51 Million for 2.2 miles!!!!
There are a few places I would not want to ride on public transportation and St. Louis pretty much tops the chart, Milwaukee is #2.

When the government gets involved it never seems to work out. It is very much fake news that they used the Milwaukee streetcars as an example. Those streetcars have been free for the first year. Yeah, a lot of people like to use free transportation. I've even read they were making some people ride it to skew the numbers. Once it stops being free we'll see how it does. My guess very similar to St. Louis.

Back to the title of my OP. No I don't think the government should get involved in poor areas. I think history has shown us that many areas can get gentrified on their own in a much more natural manner. In the same way they became poor areas, they can become more robust areas. When you try to force things it never works. When you let residents and businesses do it, it can be very successful.

BTW for both the cities mentioned (St. Louis & Milwaukee) I could think of 51 Million other ways that money could be used in a different manner!

a reply to: JAGStorm

Nope..
Atlanta built a streetcar to nowhere too...
They are not alone.

theweek.com...

The problem is those cities are not really dense enough to justify the expense or ridership.

People only use public transportation because it is inconvenient to drive.... i.e., it is pointless to try to drive in NYC because of the traffic and cost. You can get on the subway and get let off practically a block from your destination all over the city.

I was just in Milwaukee last week. You can easily drive all over the city. Hardly any traffic. Great city by the way. However, totally pointless to use public transportation.

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: JAGStorm

Nope..
Atlanta built a streetcar to nowhere too...
They are not alone.

theweek.com...

You got to be kidding me... Who is behind these streetcars? Epstein?

a reply to: Edumakated

I was just in Milwaukee last week. You can easily drive all over the city. Hardly any traffic. Great city by the way. However, totally pointless to use public transportation.

The people here complain about the traffic all the time. It drives me nuts. They have never seen true traffic.

originally posted by: JAGStorm

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: JAGStorm

Nope..
Atlanta built a streetcar to nowhere too...
They are not alone.

theweek.com...

You got to be kidding me... Who is behind these streetcars? Epstein?

I don't know, but Kansas City has them too, and we keep voting against them, but we get them anyhow. They're so desirable for whoever that they create what are called "special voting districts" until they find the right mix of people to get them voted in.

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: JAGStorm

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: JAGStorm

Nope..
Atlanta built a streetcar to nowhere too...
They are not alone.

theweek.com...

You got to be kidding me... Who is behind these streetcars? Epstein?

I don't know, but Kansas City has them too, and we keep voting against them, but we get them anyhow. They're so desirable for whoever that they create what are called "special voting districts" until they find the right mix of people to get them voted in.

pointless in KC too. My wife used to live there on the Plaza. I remember when they started proposing those street cars. A Again, you can easily drive through the city so not sure what point a street car serves.

Only time I've used a street car that made sense was in Portland in the Pearl District. Even then, it wasn't hard to drive other places, but I could kind of see it being somewhat useful.

a reply to: Edumakated

They put one through downtown.

In order to get it, they had to create a vote where the only people who could vote were more or less tenants along the proposed route and not property owners or business owners (basically the ones being taxed on it). Of course, most of the ones who voted for it would have been apartment renters, most of whom likely don't live there anymore.

originally posted by: JAGStorm

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: JAGStorm

Nope..
Atlanta built a streetcar to nowhere too...
They are not alone.

theweek.com...

You got to be kidding me... Who is behind these streetcars? Epstein?

Liberals.. They are in control of all these cities.
They are attempting to help the poor, or so they say, but have no clue how...

I think it's just a way to get federal money.

originally posted by: Bluntone22

originally posted by: JAGStorm

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: JAGStorm

Nope..
Atlanta built a streetcar to nowhere too...
They are not alone.

theweek.com...

You got to be kidding me... Who is behind these streetcars? Epstein?

Liberals.. They are in control of all these cities.
They are attempting to help the poor, or so they say, but have no clue how...

I think it's just a way to get federal money.

I'd say something like "let's look into who got the contracts and who voted for all this", but I would be wrong and racist to do such a thing. Unless it pointed to Trump, then it's all good.

a reply to: Bluntone22

Or someone just wants their name on something sexy instead of putting it on something actually useful and necessary like a sewer system or new pipes like they needed in Flint.

you gave a trillion dollar tax cut to the rich... what has that produced?

City buses? Not sure on that. Some cities probably great... other cities, I have ridden them....

a reply to: JAGStorm

IF it is done correctly, the youth in the poor areas receive better education than they would and job opportunity's giving them a future AND policing is made FOR the people of those areas so that they form friendship and community relations with those community officers and special department's rather than mercenary with gun's and shoot on sight policy's then YES it is most definitely worth it.

What value is a man, his bank account or his nationality and if it is the latter then does he not have equal right's to the rich guy under your constitution - all men created equal.

So should not your government work for him as much as it does for the rich guy.

The alternative is to leave poor areas to be over run by Drug's, riddled with crime and dangerous not only for those that live there but for all around those areas as the feral youth armed and angry seek money, status and power the only way they know how.

But when thing's have gotten as bad as they have in some areas of the world such as the US it will never be an easy prospect to fix those broken community's, in the long run it will be well worth it for the US as a whole since turning destructive and destroyed lives into productive and talented citizens' is always going to good for any nation but that does not mean it will not be hard to accomplish and it require a lot of money, time and a concerted effort to both fulfill the goal of such policy's and to make certain that the money meant for them is not being creamed off into private bank account's by private contractors and corrupt official's and politician's.

a reply to: network dude
You blame the liberals because what? we dont pray to jesus to fix everything?

a reply to: tinner07

Hey I am in another part of the world but my understanding of LIBERAL is that such beliefs stem from Victorian era Christian reformists and in fact Liberal's - not in todays corruption of that term but in it's correct use - are men that believe in Liberty, Equity and Morality (with emphasis in the latter believe it or not since Moral use of wealth is not hoarding that wealth but creating job's, employing people and helping the needy, the poor and the sick).

a reply to: LABTECH767

IF it is done correctly, the youth in the poor areas receive better education than they would and job opportunity's giving them a future AND policing is made FOR the people of those areas so that they form friendship and community relations with those community officers and special department's rather than mercenary with gun's and shoot on sight policy's then YES it is most definitely worth it.

A 2 mile trolly is not going to benefit the youth or poor in those areas. If we really wanted to help them that money should have gone into the schools.

a reply to: JAGStorm

Symptoms of USA prosperity. San Diego is spending $1.5 Billion to build houses for the homeless. Completely furnished!

a reply to: LABTECH767

They put our trolley in a more gentrified area. Not much help to the poor unless you count the homeless who can hop on a ride it for free to get out of the weather.

a reply to: JAGStorm

No it requires a concerted large scale intervention and strong law enforcement that is properly done is also a necessity since you also have to clean those neighborhoods up before you can really get started, that is the hard part were the police are automatically seen as the enemy which is why outreach program's need to be ramp'ed up and short term amnesty's could help along with the use of genuinely reformed former gang members since Gang's are a very big problem these day's not only in the US but around the world.

Pffft...that aint nuthin.

en.m.wikipedia.org...

Thing is...government involvement never works. Even Roosevelts New Deal has been proven to not have ended the depression....in fact it may have extended it.