The American Civil War of 2005 as predicted by John Titor

Originally posted by syrinx high priest
ok lets get down to nitty gritty. I'm going to go way out on a limb here, and try to squeeze a straight answer out of the pro-titors on a few relative points.

1) define civil war. I'm going to start by using a general idea of; two or more groups of combatants who are citizens of the same nation.

2) define combatant. I'm going to go with a unit or individual engaged in mortal combat by using deadly force against another unit or individual.

3) a) define titors civil war by your understanding of who exactly the combatants are and b) exactly why they are engaged in mortal combat

thanks !

Finally reached the end (pats self on back)

Okay first off let me say I don't think JT is from the future. He is very much from our time. However, I do believe many of the things he predicts may come true. But in my opinion, JT is nothing but a unwitting mouthpiece for the NWO. JT may even believe his story enough to pass a lie detector test or possibly even regressive hypnotherapy.

One thing to keep in mind, before I go any further, is that the future is only probable. Meaning it CAN BE changed. People change their minds constantly, depending on their mood, new information, on the insistence of others, etc.

Now let's imagine JT is not from the future but someone programmed, either with or without their consent, to purposely leak this information about our coming future as a test to see how we react. Do not think for a minute your post has not been read by the NWO/Illuminati "Powers that Be" and added to their threat assesment database. These wolrd-hungry powermongers are more clever and more deceiptful then you could ever imagine. They are masters of propaganda and mind control. Is it really a stretch to see them planting a JT on us and seeing what happens?

Now to answer the questions above:

1) define civil war - What is any war? fighting between not just two people, but hundreds, maybe thousands of people who disagree with how they are being treated by either another country, another tribe, or even another state, or it's waged by the government leaders to secure safety for its citizens. Now, when there is a war between the populace of a single country, either due to a split in the views of the populace or a split from the federal government, you now have a civil war. Another possiblity that comes to mind would be a civil war started by a military coup.
Your description works too.

2) define combatant. Depends on which side you are on. Usually a combatant wants to either hurt you, imprison you, or they want want you have.

3) "a) define titors civil war by your understanding of who exactly the combatants are"
When JT talks about a fight between the country and the cities he does not mean with their current populations. Those who side with the NWO will surrender their rights in order to keep a lifestyle similar to thier current one, with fast food, t.v. , the net, etc. and control the urban centers of the country. Those who do not wish to give up their rights, will have to give up these luxuries and try to eke out an existence in the country, all the while fighting to get their cities back. Which brings us to "b) exactly why they are engaged in mortal combat?" I dunno, hrm maybe um Freedom? or maybe the fighting will end up just being about food.

And enough about waiting for WACO like events to occur...let it go. Roth Joint is looking in the right direction and you all should take off your blinders and take a peek. The United States is dangerously close to economic collapse, and those who say otherwise are either fooling themselves so they can keep that warm fuzzy feeling while driving 60 miles to work in their Hummers everyday, or they kinda know whats going on and plan to take the safe route and join the republic (term used loosely). OR even worse they are completely ignorant and are happy that America is the most powerful country on the planet. "Don't Tread on Me" eh?

peace,

StickyG

HR-1528: This new bill is quite effictively dubbed ...
"Defending America's Most Vulnerable: Safe Access to Drug Treatment and Child Protection Act of 2005."

Here are some of the NEW LAWS that this bill will enforce.

--Virtually eliminates the ability of federal judges to give sentences below the minimum sentence recommended by federal sentencing guidelines.

--Expands the federal “three strikes and you’re out” law to include new offenses, including mandating life imprisonment (with no possibility of parole) for anyone convicted a third time under the RAVE Act. (DRUGS)

--Mandates a 10-year minimum sentence for anyone 21 or older that gives marijuana or others drugs to someone under 18 (i.e. a 21 year old college students gives a joint to his 17-year old brother). A second offense would be life in prison.

--Expands what is considered to be a “drug-free” school zone to include almost any place in an urban area, and increases penalties for selling or distributing drugs in that area. (The result will be enhanced penalties for people in inner cities, while people in rural and suburban areas get less time for the same offense). Country vs. Cities

--Mandates a 5-year minimum sentence for any person that commits a drug trafficking offense near the presence of a person under 18 or in a place where such person resides for any period of time. The sentence is 10 years if they are parent. (I.e. a mother that sells her neighbor a joint will get a 10-year minimum sentence, even if her kids were at school at the time).

--Creates a new offense for persons who witness or learn about certain drug offenses that fail to report the drug offender to the police within 24 hours or fail to provide full assistance to the police in tracking and prosecuting the offender. Offenses that would get someone a 2-year minimum sentence, including failing to report a neighbor that is storing or selling drugs when that neighbor has kids, failing to report anyone that gives a joint to someone under the age of 21, and failing to report a college student that is selling marijuana on a college campus.

--Mandates a 5-year minimum sentence for any person that offers, solicits, encourages, or induces a person enrolled in drug treatment, or previously enrolled in drug treatment, to purchase, possess or receive drugs.

--Makes it a federal crime to provide "drug paraphernalia" to anyone. While the goal is to make it a crime - punishable by up to three years in prison - to give someone a bong as a birthday present, it would also make it a federal crime to provide someone with sterile syringes (except where it is explicitly authorized by local or state law). If enacted, it would essentially criminalize many needle exchange programs.

Here is the full text of the new legislation.

www.govtrack.us...




CIVIL WAR IN AMERICA

Thats right! I brought this up at a recent dinner discussion and the feedback that i recieved was very candid and unbelieveable! It looks like the fat and lazy americans have finally found an issue worth fighting for... And its the Bill of Rights! The very reason that our ancestors fought a bloody war against their oppressor KING GEORGE III. This novel idea that forming a more perfect nation has fallen apart. Do you want security or do you want freedom? Afterall the terrorists attacked us once 4 years ago, their war is with our govt. for mistreating them. Our war is against our govt. for mistreating us too. To quote a famous patriot who put it best ... "Give me Liberty of Give me Death!"

The American people will not spy on their neighbors, they will not spy on thier friends, and they will not spy on their own families FOR YOU!. This new law tears apart the 8th Amendment. How is life in prison fair for someone who smokes some weed and doesn't commit any other crime fair? If passed and if sold correctly (look at the title) This new law will turn neighbor against neighbor. it will turn friend against friend. and it will turn family against family. Anyone who has a grudge or a personal vendetta will use this law to perpetuate their will. This will turn into the new holocaust! Drug users will be the scapegoat of a failing economy. Drug Users will become infact the new Jews. This law will turn the Cities into Prison Camps while the Country folk get lighter sentencing. This is not a law that would be passed in a FREE COUNTRY! This is Fascism. This is HITLER's Nazi Germany circa 2005. And what is really funny... They don't see the civil war coming.


BE PREPARED ! WRITE TO YOUR CONGRESSMAN/WOMAN NOW !


Is this a War on Drugs? Or a War on Freedom?

People You Must Stand Up To The Police State!

Stand Up For Your Rights !



Thank you for your time ... i like ATS points ... and vote me for RATS ... PLEASE!!!

JT: "The West will become very unstable which gives China the confidence to "expand"."

www.kansascity.com...
Posted on Sat, Jun. 04, 2005

Rumsfeld confronts China

He challenges nation on freedoms, arms

The Associated Press

SINGAPORE — Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld bluntly challenged
China today, saying Beijing must provide more political freedom to
its citizens.

"Ultimately, China will need to embrace some form of open,
representative government if it is to fully achieve the benefits to
which its people aspire," he said.

Rumsfeld also questioned China's recent military buildup.

He said the Pentagon's annual assessment of China's military
capabilities showed China was spending more than its leaders
acknowledge, expanding its missile capabilities and developing
advanced military technology. China now has the world's third-largest
military budget, he said, behind the United States and Russia.

"One might be concerned that this buildup is putting the delicate
military balance in the region at risk — especially, but not only,
with respect to Taiwan," Rumsfeld said in remarks prepared for a
conference organized by The International Institute for Strategic
Studies. "Since no nation threatens China, one wonders: Why this
growing investment?"

The speech represented a direct verbal confrontation with China,
given that Beijing sent representatives to the annual conference this
year after skipping last year's event. Officials from Taiwan, a self-
governing island China regards as a renegade territory, were not
invited.

China has said it would attack Taiwan if the island tries to declare
independence, and it repeatedly calls on the United States to stop
selling weapons to Taiwan. The United States is urging the European
Union to keep in place its ban on selling weapons to China.

Rumsfeld prodded China to use its influence with North Korea to help
restart six-nation talks over Pyongyang's nuclear weapons programs.

JT: "It is a mistake to give anyone your unwavering belief...but you will find that out yourself in 2005."

globalpolitician.com...
Russia's Alliance With America's Enemies
by Ryan Mauro - 5/16/2005

"And now, the bold state of Iran is openly expecting an American
assault and accelerating the pace of the reconstruction of ties with
the Arab states, and the construction of a Russian nuclear reactor
at Bushehr, which will allow Iran to have nuclear weapons in 2005."

www.antiwar.com...
The Bush-Bolton Plan to Bomb Bushehr
by Jude Wanniski - 5/16/2005
Memo to: Republican senators

Buried down in Saturday's New York Times report on President Bush
reaffirming his unqualified support for John Bolton as UN ambassador
is the reason why almost all of you are ready to vote for his
confirmation.

"Republicans are hoping to shame Democrats into a quick vote on Mr.
Bolton. They argue that he needs to be in place by June so that the
United States will have the latitude it needs to press its concerns
about Iran's suspected nuclear weapons program before the Security
Council."

Why the big rush? My reliable sources tell me it is because there is
a timetable that makes it urgent for Bolton to be ready for action in
June in order to cripple the Nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty (NPT) as
part of the plan to bomb the Iranian nuclear power plant at Bushehr.

That's because Bushehr, under construction with Russian supervision,
will soon be ready to receive the Russian fissionable material
enabling it to produce power. In 1981, remember Republican senators,
Israel bombed the Osiraq nuclear power plant near Baghdad just before
it was to be fueled by its French contractors.

Once fueled, bombing is out of the question because of the radiation
that would be emitted, with clouds traveling who knows where.

ROTH, what do the above threads have to do with wheather Titor is fake or not?

Originally posted by humbled_one
ROTH, what do the above threads have to do with wheather Titor is fake or not?

thats not important. what is important is that we pay attention to the world around us. I have and it seems everything is going to hell in a handbasket.

And if its coming, then i want to see it coming ... so i can get out of its way.

Where2hide, how are you going to get out of it's way? Please fill me in on this? I believe the world is going down the tubes also. i have felt that way for over 20 years. But how do you think you are going to get out of the way of anything? The reason i made the comment in my other post is that this thread is not about the troubles of the world, it's about if John Titor was really a time traveler and actually for real or not...

Originally posted by humbled_one
Where2hide, how are you going to get out of it's way? Please fill me in on this? I believe the world is going down the tubes also. i have felt that way for over 20 years. But how do you think you are going to get out of the way of anything? The reason i made the comment in my other post is that this thread is not about the troubles of the world, it's about if John Titor was really a time traveler and actually for real or not...

If we are going to discuss whether Titor was a real time traveller or not on a thread being called: "The American Civil War of 2005 as predicted by John Titor" I believe it is only fair we imply his chronicles as well, especially the ones that are pointing to this year 2005 which define what will happen on a global scale.

Whether one believes John Titor to be the real deal or not, one cannot deny the global events taking place in the exact chronicle order as he "predicted" them.

can any US poster honestly say they would take up arms against another US citizen, or join an army/militia to fight our military ?

"The American Civil War of 2005 as predicted by John Titor"

war means combat to the death
american means american
2005 is this year

so, can any of you see yourselves killing another american over the patriot act this year ?

ROTH, i don't see where anything is happening as Titor predicted??? Not yet anyway. As far as events happening right now, books have been written to interpret the Revelations of the bible and they have explained events very simular to what is going on in the world right now. The books were written like over 20 years ago and people are writing books up until this day on the Revelations and events that are ahppening right now. I read a book about 20 years ago by Hal Lindsey called "Countdown to Armaggdon" (spelling is not right) and it seems to me Hal was pretty close if not right on with how events would start in the Middle East and progress further to world war (let's hope it does not get that far though).
As far as Titor, give me one "literal" event he said would happen that actual has happened. Remember we are not talking about someone who "predicted" how things would or might come about, we are not trying to "interpret" something he said and how it "might" apply to what is going on in the world, we are talking about someone that says he actually knows "literally" about events as he time traveled. so what is one "literal" event that has happened that Titor said would happen? Then of course if civil war does not happen in 2005, then people will say, well the time stream must have changed or something (which i guess could happened, but i don't know as i never really traveled through time)...

You people don't see our rights bein taken away????

How many deaths this years from "non-lethal" weapons???

Police Vs. Citizens

wait till your laid off or replaced by a mexican....

Waco was police vs. citizens

Approx. 2 million american citizens in prison for Non-violent drug crimes...that number is growing by 900 people a week since 03-04

I know this may be alittle off the record but do you really think china has the guts to stand to the US?

For one thing i hope that china will develop into an economic power and i hope it will become an economic power to that of the US.I dont like the fact that the US is the ony real true superpower.I believe that theres no government that can be somewhat honest and clean but at the sametime be the only global power in the world.If theres two or more global powers,atleast we know theres somewhat a balance(if you understand me).Europe has already lost all hope in becoming one because they cannot work as \one,china is the only other hope.

Its time for the US to become one of the two global powers,instead of the only one.

Originally posted by blackSt33L
I know this may be alittle off the record but do you really think china has the guts to stand to the US?

For one thing i hope that china will develop into an economic power and i hope it will become an economic power to that of the US.I dont like the fact that the US is the ony real true superpower.I believe that theres no government that can be somewhat honest and clean but at the sametime be the only global power in the world.If theres two or more global powers,atleast we know theres somewhat a balance(if you understand me).Europe has already lost all hope in becoming one because they cannot work as \one,china is the only other hope.

Its time for the US to become one of the two global powers,instead of the only one.

Hmmmm...let's see. Population of U.S. is approximately 300 million and look how much resources we consume compared to the rest of the world. Population of China is approx. 1.3 billion. Nope, not enough resources to go around that's for sure. I'm almost positive we won't see two starbucks across the street from each other in China anytime soon. It's a nice dream to think of China as a salesman's paradise having such a large possible consumer base, but in my opinion, there simply isn't enough to go around. For the rest of the world's population to catch up to our rate of spending and consumption, we would have to take serious cuts to our share of the resource pie. And quite honestly, I don't think the majority in this country wants that to happen, ever. Seems to me certain powers have worked hard to keep the majority of the world economically retarded so as to not infringe on our unproportionatley large percentage of the world's natural resources, with the most important being oil. This may seem to simplistic as I didn't factor in the other major consumers such as Europe, Japan, Russia, South America, etc., but this wasn't neccessary to prove my point. The point is, that if every single Chinese citizen consumed as much raw materials and oil as the average American, we'd be out of oil next week!

Just something to think about...sorry for swaying off topic.

cheers,

StickyG

Originally posted by LDragonFire
You people don't see our rights bein taken away????

How many deaths this years from "non-lethal" weapons???

Police Vs. Citizens

What's happening now that hasn't been happening for the past 100+ years?

wait till your laid off or replaced by a mexican....

What does this have to do with anything?

Waco was police vs. citizens

lol, it was more than that...

Approx. 2 million american citizens in prison for Non-violent drug crimes...that number is growing by 900 people a week since 03-04

Again, what does this have to do with Titor and the civil war between the Country and the City?

Then you explain Waco to me?????
ATF vs. Armed civilains
Police Vs. Armed and unarmed civilains, I believe All taser deaths in America were Unarmed citizens.

We have lost more rights or the Fed authories have Gained more rights in the last five years than in the last 100 years.

It is my guess that if the America economy crashes....then civil war will break out soon after. So what im sayin is if you loose your job to a mexican or any other emigrant, you loss you car, house, family,dog ect..ect ....how close will you be to fighting for a change.

We "America" has the largest prison population on earth...most from NON-violent drug offenders....where does it read in the costitution that you must be christian or christain like to be free in America

Waco was a defining moment in our history, it was the first use of pool reporting, basicaly how you get your news from mainstream media today.
These people were tried [labeled child molesters, gun toteing religious nutjobs].....convicted...[by same pool reporting]..........and summarly exicuted...by who? ATF

Now about JT:
Things he has been correct on so far:
1 Just using the term Weapons of Mass Destruction, Waaaay before Sept 11
2. Mad cow problems....problems with the food supply
3. War with Iraq based on BS about WMD
4. problems with the 04 elections....look at Ohio, Diebold Republican voting machines.
5. He mentioned nukes the size of basket balls....This adminitration research and development of bunker buster nuke bombs.
6. USA largest prison population, the use of Non-lethal weapons by the police Vs. civilain populations, mostly unarmed.


I do not want a civil war in america.....but i see it coming.....look at the size of this thread, the economy, A presidenb\t that is oblivious to half the American population.

Patriot= Defending the constitution of the United States of America, from enemys both foriegn and domestic.

freedom and power to the people in uniform only


This administration acts like the constiution is a hinderance, or a problem for them, this is crap the constitution of THE USA is what sets us apart from the rest of the world, the Fed has WAAAAY two much power, it was never ment to be so powerfull

the patiot act is anything but.....it is the start of a police state....patiot act II is nothing but a police state, and after the next staged terrorist attack an it is emplimented as law you can kiss the constiution goodbye

good luck

this is my last shot at getting t the heart of THIS THREAD's subject matter




maybe I';m wrong, but the general idea about titors civil war prediction is that it is not republican vs democrat, east vs west, army vs citizen, it is urban vs rural citizens. the rural citizens went out there to escape a police state, and then they need food or something so there is conflict with the urban folks


can you see in the year 2005 american citizens killing each other ?? not demonstrating, not a picket line, death. violence, death, war. american citizen vs american citizen.

titor is a hoax.


lets start a pool of when the titor hold outs start to claim there are no waco events or a civil war because there was a type-o in titors post or we are in a different time line


I say 12/1

Although I tend to think Titor is a hoax I also found it interesting that he mentioned an Iraq War. Not that that in itself would be unpredictably but that he mentioned that weapons of mass destruction would be the reason for the conflict and that they wouldn't be found.

Titor's biggest weakness is his apparant lack of knowledge of the events of 9/11. If he was remotely aware of America history in his day he would know that the loss of rights he seems to focus on are a direct result of 9/11 and the ensuing conflict.

For those who think the end of 2005 will mean Titor's predictions will go away I think you will be surprised. Although Titor said the American Civil War starts in 2005 (or 2004) he says it builds up over time and its not until a few years later that everyone comes to accept things have really changed for good. In fact the President from now to 2008 is written as a good man who is really overcome by events. As such I think most of us would tend to see any anti-government activity as simple extremist kooks not a Civil War in the next few years.

Even if Titor was correct we are getting a version of history as presented by an anti-government insurgent after they have "won" a war with the help of a foreign power. I am sure that the vast majority of the American population, who unfortunately will not live past 2012 according to Titor would have seen things very differently.

How about this:

As a result of increased terrorism and economic chaos brought on by America's inability to finance the War on Terror and our massive domestic spending program America suffers severe economic chaos. In order to prevent soaring crime and foreign sponsored terrorism the government institutes a series of policies to control the economy and crack down on violent anti-government groups. The situation continues to spiral downward and America's overseas war on terror drags on. Seeing America's internal weakness and poor position overseas a miscalculating Russia/China attacks America outright in 2012. When America collapses the survivors blame the former government. The relatively small groups of insurgents blends into the new society as politics in our sense suddenly is not a priority anymore. People realize that we need to make some big changes and work together. In the minds of the insurgents they think their part in the change was far more significant than it was.

For those that want to put a nail in the Titor coffin you will have to wait until 2006. The only marker that is black and white in Titor speak that is coming soon is his quote that there are no more Olympic Games after 2004. As of today we still have Olympic Winter games scheduled for 2006. If these games happen the Titor story is over. If they don't occur Titor still won't be proven correct but the next definite marker doesn't come until 2012.

Originally posted by LDragonFire
Then you explain Waco to me?????

This has been explained already somewhere in this thread
If you don't find it, this also explains alot
en.wikipedia.org...

We have lost more rights or the Fed authories have Gained more rights in the last five years than in the last 100 years.

Could you be more specific?

It is my guess that if the America economy crashes....then civil war will break out soon after. So what im sayin is if you loose your job to a mexican or any other emigrant, you loss you car, house, family,dog ect..ect ....how close will you be to fighting for a change.

But this thread is about Titor and how he thinks a civil war will happen.

We "America" has the largest prison population on earth...most from NON-violent drug offenders....where does it read in the costitution that you must be christian or christain like to be free in America

We also have laws here in America. If you break the law, you get punished. Whether you violently break the law or not, you still broke the law.

Now about JT:
Things he has been correct on so far:
1 Just using the term Weapons of Mass Destruction, Waaaay before Sept 11

Many people used that word Waaaaay before 9/11. Even before the first Gulf War.

2. Mad cow problems....problems with the food supply

I thought you were listing things he was right about

3. War with Iraq based on BS about WMD

Please specify....

4. problems with the 04 elections....look at Ohio, Diebold Republican voting machines.

He only talke about the problems with the '00 election. He said there'd be civil unrest for the '04. Didn't happen.

5. He mentioned nukes the size of basket balls....This adminitration research and development of bunker buster nuke bombs.

6. USA largest prison population, the use of Non-lethal weapons by the police Vs. civilain populations, mostly unarmed.

Titor didn't mention any of that.

Originally posted by antelope
For those that want to put a nail in the Titor coffin you will have to wait until 2006. The only marker that is black and white in Titor speak that is coming soon is his quote that there are no more Olympic Games after 2004. As of today we still have Olympic Winter games scheduled for 2006. If these games happen the Titor story is over. If they don't occur Titor still won't be proven correct but the next definite marker doesn't come until 2012.

But did he imply the Summer Olympics, which take place in 2008? I think Titors a hoax on the most part but thats what some will argue.