Retired FBI Agent claims "Cameras Covering Every Inch of MCC"

originally posted by: InfiniteTrinity
a reply to: Shamrock6

I would count his cell not having a camera at all, not having a working camera, or having a working camera that was turned off to be an advantage to anybody trying to harm him.

Ok so you do think Esptein was in a cell without a working camera.

You really can’t help but make things up, can you?

You asked if I thought it would be an advantage if there was no camera in his cell. I listed three different situations I would consider to be advantages when it comes to the cell/camera issue. You then turn that into “welp, you didn’t say it but this is what you actually meant.”

I assure you, I don’t make implications or hide my thoughts on a matter. You don’t need to try and find some hidden meaning in my comments. Read what I write, and don’t waste your time trying deduce what I must really mean. What I mean is what I said.

Given that you have made it plain you’re incapable of discussing what people say and instead want to have imaginary conversations in your head and expecting people to explain those conversations, this will be our last interaction. I’ve answered your questions, you refuse to acknowledge my answers and insist on attacking things I haven’t said as if you know what’s really in my head. We’re done here.

a reply to: EvilAxis

So basically he is lying? That is what you are saying because if he doesnt know than he cant honestly say he couldnt have killed himself.

because clearly there are not cameras surveying every inch of the facility.

Clearly? What makes you say that not every inch of that specific unit was covered?

originally posted by: InfiniteTrinity
The fact that they dont really care about human rights and hygiene doesnt mean the cameras in the special units dont work.

Of course, but if, as she suggested, it's a badly run, under-funded mess, cameras not working and protocols not being followed is more likely than if it's efficiently managed.

a reply to: Shamrock6

You really can’t help but make things up, can you? You asked if I thought it would be an advantage if there was no camera in his cell.

You already forgot what you said before?

Literally said I think somebody took advantage of conditions in the jail. Whether Epstein took advantage of them or somebody else took advantage of them remains to be seen.

So not having a working camera in his cell is the advantage, and you believe he or someone else took advantage of it, so it must mean that he had to have been in a cell without a working a camera. I dont care that you keep implying this, what I find strange is that you keep denying it even though that was clear from your first post. But hey whatever.

originally posted by: InfiniteTrinity

So basically he is lying? That is what you are saying because if he doesnt know than he cant honestly say he couldnt have killed himself.

Hyperbole is the word I used. His opinion that Epstein couldn't have killed himself wouldn't be a lie even if it turned out to be wrong.

originally posted by: InfiniteTrinity

Clearly? What makes you say that not every inch of that specific unit was covered?

He didn't say 'the unit', he said, 'every inch of the MCC'.
I think you would agree that's not likely.

a reply to: EvilAxis

Hyperbole is the word I used. His opinion that Epstein couldn't have killed himself wouldn't be a lie even if it turned out to be wrong.

I would call it a lie if he knows there are no cameras in his cell since he specifically mentions cameras.

a reply to: EvilAxis

He didn't say 'the unit', he said, 'every inch of the MCC'. I think you would agree that's not likely.

I would think that its likely that the special unit is fully covered.

Well that's where we differ.
I would only call it a lie if he said he knew there were cameras in the cell and it turns out there were none.

But he actually said, "There are cameras covering every inch of the MCC."

I too am bowing out now because I feel like I'm in the Monty Python Argument Clinic.

So it occurred to me that there must be some privacy issues for prisoners which would have to be a consideration in placement of surveillance cameras. And that would explain the special arrangements made for El Chapo. So while there might be cameras literally all over the prison, they would not surveil literally every inch of the prison. I found a couple interesting links. Apparently tampering and vandalism by prisoners is also a concern and therefore a reason for not placing cameras in each cell. And cost, of course.

Although upgrading your agency’s correctional facility video surveillance system has several benefits, there are a few associated risks with installation and usage.

Inmates have 24 hours a day, 7 days a week to come up with creative ideas and resources for bettering their time in custody. Tampering with electrical devices within a unit is a common activity. Sparking off of electrical wires, modifying or destruction of mounted video camera units is a likely possibility. Replacement of those damaged devices should be a cost consideration when budgeting for a system equipment upgrade.

Inmate privacy rights while incarcerated is always a hot topic of controversy and debate. Video surveillance equipment placement in prisons and jails is a precarious issue. Many facilities operate under the premise that inmate security and safety is the ultimate goal with camera installation in each and every cell. The other perspective believes individual cell monitoring is a violation of privacy for the inmate. Thorough knowledge of facility policy and state law is an important consideration when designing and installing surveillance systems.

Video cameras, although efficient and effective tools for facility security, are not a replacement for staff. A video surveillance system will only be effective when incorporated as a part of a larger security plan including officers, alarm systems and other security tools.

4 ways a modern video surveillance system can benefit a correctional facility

And:

Tampering
Prisoners have a lot of free time on their hands, so if they want to tamper with your near security cameras, chances are that they will be able to. Even if you invest in vandal-proof cameras and take extra measures to reduce the likelihood of tampering, there is the strong possibility that one or more of your cameras will fall victim to vandalism. For this reason, it is smart to invest in a backup security plan.

Privacy
Inmates are people too, and as such, they too need their fair share of privacy. If you have too many cameras in place, your facility may come under fire for prisons’ rights violations. However, if you have too little, the safety of your prisoners and guards is at stake. Finding a balance may be tricky, but it’s necessary.

The Benefits and Challenges of an Updated Prison Surveillance System

So I'm going to say that it's not uncommon for surveillance systems to not surveil each cell; rather, they would more likely surveil the length and breadth of the hallway (is that the right word?). I would assume it's not uncommon to find some blocks with a specific purpose -- such as suicide watch cells -- that would surveil individual cells.

originally posted by: Shamrock6
a reply to: KKLOCO

I agree Boadicea, but you have to agree, there was an equal (if not more plausible) reason to have Epstein on surveillance 24/7. Just too convenient in all this horse

Absolutely. At the very least it defies any sort of logical perspective on the danger to Epstein. And it only gets more sinister from that point, not better.

Exactly, the fact that monumental amounts of people were saying Epstein would be “suicided”, before this happened — is downright amazing.

What the most crazy part is, the narrative we are being given, after the fact — stinks to the high heavens of the All Proverbial Sh!t God!

a reply to: Boadicea

Thanks for that input. I had been mulling exactly that question.

a reply to: EvilAxis

Take a look at my last comment before you go! I think it supports what you're basically saying. The ex-FBI agent (and I am taking note that he's associated with the FBI) may have worded it poorly, but there could be surveillance cameras literally all over the complex, but not surveilling each cell for good reason.

Not lying, not necessarily wrong, just inarticulate!

a reply to: EvilAxis

LOL -- we cross-posted!

Glad you saw it and it makes sense to you too

a reply to: Boadicea

So I'm going to say that it's not uncommon for surveillance systems to not surveil each cell; rather, they would more likely surveil the length and breadth of the hallway (is that the right word?). I would assume it's not uncommon to find some blocks with a specific purpose -- such as suicide watch cells -- that would surveil individual cells.

As far as I know, that’s basically how the facility here works. Intake is covered because it’s a volatile area. Hallways and access/control points are covered. Common areas in pods are covered. But most individual cells aren’t. I genuinely don’t know if the “watch cells” have cameras or not, though.

a reply to: KKLOCO

What the most crazy part is, the narrative we are being given, after the fact — stinks to the high heavens of the All Proverbial Sh!t God!

Combined with all the leaks and rumors and unsubstantiated this, that and the other thing, it's almost as if we're being forced to think conspiracy... and then we're blamed for thinking conspiracy...

Oh wait. No almost about it

a reply to: Shamrock6

That makes sense. Make the most and best of your resources.

Even the logistics of surveilling each individual cell is crazy to think about. What a nightmare monitoring and managing that would be.

a reply to: EvilAxis

But he actually said, "There are cameras covering every inch of the MCC."

Yes after saying that it was impossible he killed himself in his cell.

I too am bowing out now because I feel like I'm in the Monty Python Argument Clinic.

Maybe you need to read better because what I say is the logical result of your suggestion that he wasnt refering to the cell.

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: KKLOCO

What the most crazy part is, the narrative we are being given, after the fact — stinks to the high heavens of the All Proverbial Sh!t God!

Combined with all the leaks and rumors and unsubstantiated this, that and the other thing, it's almost as if we're being forced to think conspiracy... and then we're blamed for thinking conspiracy...

Oh wait. No almost about it

Yes! We are being force fed CRAZY PILLS!!

I found this on Wiki of all sources,

The correctional center is housed in a 12-story high-rise building located at 150 Park Row in the Civic Center neighborhood. As of 1 February 2017, it had 796 inmates, both male and female.[8] The facility has one female wing; seven General Population male wings, six of which feature cells and one is a dorm; one Special Housing Unit (SHU); and one "supermax" unit. Each unit takes up two stories. All General Population units feature a gym (no weights), a kitchen (microwaves, hot water, ice), and five TV sets (1 in the gym and 4 on the floor). Offices, classes, and computers are located on the unit's second floor. ]

Inmates in the 10-South wing are locked inside single-man cells 23 hours a day with lights and CCTVs on at all times. The cells are equipped with a shower. In 10-South the food is served only by a "white shirt" (Sergeant or Lieutenant), never by a "blue shirt" (Correctional Officer).[citation needed] The 9-South wing is a designated SHU. It houses inmates that violated prison rules; new arrivals that have not been medically cleared for General Population yet; and inmates in Protective Custody (PC). Both inmates in a cell are cuffed in the back through a food slot every time the cell door needs to be opened. Inmates are escorted to the shower three times a week, always cuffed.[citation needed

en.wikipedia.org...

According to this source the 10 South wing has cameras in the cells, there is no mention of cameras in the cells of 9 South wing where Epstein was housed allegedly. The article was edited on 14 aug to include Epstein. Assuming that any mention of cameras in the cells of South 9 wasnt edited out, than I would have to agree that he might have been in a cell without camera.

originally posted by: InfiniteTrinity
I found this on Wiki of all sources,

The correctional center is housed in a 12-story high-rise building located at 150 Park Row in the Civic Center neighborhood. As of 1 February 2017, it had 796 inmates, both male and female.[8] The facility has one female wing; seven General Population male wings, six of which feature cells and one is a dorm; one Special Housing Unit (SHU); and one "supermax" unit. Each unit takes up two stories. All General Population units feature a gym (no weights), a kitchen (microwaves, hot water, ice), and five TV sets (1 in the gym and 4 on the floor). Offices, classes, and computers are located on the unit's second floor. ]

Inmates in the 10-South wing are locked inside single-man cells 23 hours a day with lights and CCTVs on at all times. The cells are equipped with a shower. In 10-South the food is served only by a "white shirt" (Sergeant or Lieutenant), never by a "blue shirt" (Correctional Officer).[citation needed] The 9-South wing is a designated SHU. It houses inmates that violated prison rules; new arrivals that have not been medically cleared for General Population yet; and inmates in Protective Custody (PC). Both inmates in a cell are cuffed in the back through a food slot every time the cell door needs to be opened. Inmates are escorted to the shower three times a week, always cuffed.[citation needed

en.wikipedia.org...

According to this source the 10 South wing has cameras in the cells, there is no mention of cameras in the cells of 9 South wing where Epstein was housed allegedly. The article was edited on 14 aug to include Epstein. Assuming that any mention of cameras in the cells of South 9 wasnt edited out, than I would have to agree that he might have been in a cell without camera.

So we have proven that the MCC DOES have cameras in some cells. El Chapo had one and now the entire 10th south wing has them.

The real question remains then, why wasn’t Epstein in a cell with a camera? It’s all too perfuct.