Oldest carving in East Asia found. But its maker is a mystery.

It is being claimed that this carved bone pushes back the date for such carvings to at least 60 thousand years older than other finds. If correct the carving is more than 100,000 years old. So the big question is who carved it..?

More than a hundred thousand years ago in what is now eastern China, an ancient human relative decided to carve a bit of bone. Surrounded by the fragmented skeletons of butchered animals, the ancient engraver chose a tidbit of rib hardened from its time under the sun and carved seven nearly parallel lines, highlighting them with a smear of vibrant ochre pigments.

Now, these straight lines are making waves among paleoanthropologists, who believe that this tiny fragment, along with a second engraved bone found nearby, provide the oldest evidence of intentional symbolic carvings yet found in East Asia. If so, the find would beat the previous record holder by some 60,000 years, the team reports in the journal Antiquity.

The branch of the human family tree to which the artist belongs remains shrouded in time. But fossil skulls from an unknown species found near the bones hint that the carvings were not the handiwork of our species, Homo sapiens.

Abstract ideas from another species ?
www.nationalgeographic.com...

Researchers have uncovered thousands of bone fragments at the site, including remains from horses, extinct wild oxen known as aurochs, and donkey relatives called onagers. Many of the bones sport cut marks made when they were still fresh, evidence of many successful hunts. A collection of stone tools found at the site also revealed surprisingly sophisticated methods of tool shaping.

In 2016, while studying the fossil menagerie, researchers spotted clues to something even more intriguing: evidence of purposeful engraving.

a reply to: 727Sky

I doesn't look like they'll ever figure it out.

The two fossil skulls found at the site contain a mosaic of ancient and modern features. Prior work hinted that they might be Denisovan, but thanks to the scant traces of Denisovan remains yet found, DNA evidence would be necessary to say for sure. Past research also suggested that Denisovans could be responsible for personal adornments, such as tooth pendants, found in Denisova cave. Still, scientists can’t exclude the possibility that modern humans had a hand in making those artifacts.

a reply to: 727Sky

Nice Find OP.

There is a lot of speculation in the article, but that's to be expected with something this old.

Very interesting none the less. If the dating is accurate, it somewhat shifts the OOA timeline paradigm.

a reply to: Mach2

Very interesting none the less. If the dating is accurate, it somewhat shifts the OOA timeline paradigm.

That's a problem in itself. There are too many articles out there showing the flaws in both radioactive and carbon dating.

a reply to: Deetermined
I didn't see the specific method used, in the article.

it's certainly too old for accurate carbon dating. I assumed they used the stratification of the area, which in most cases isn't that precise either.

a reply to: 727Sky

Nothing like a good mystery to start the day!

a reply to: 727Sky

Monkeys did it dont you know. Had to be monkeys ask the evolutionists they will tell you.

originally posted by: cognizant420
a reply to: 727Sky

Monkeys did it dont you know. Had to be monkeys ask the evolutionists they will tell you.

Come on man. There are many other threads for that argumentative nonsense, and I often enjoy those debates, but there is no good reason to bring it into this type of thread, where people are just having a friendly discussion about a recent finding on a subject that interests them.

I have to ask, why would you do such a thing? No one here was pushing an ideological agenda.

SMH

originally posted by: Mach2
a reply to: Deetermined
I didn't see the specific method used, in the article.

it's certainly too old for accurate carbon dating. I assumed they used the stratification of the area, which in most cases isn't that precise either.

I’ve emailed the author of the paper on the find, Zhanyang Li, for access to the full paper so hopefully I’ll have the data regarding what method was used to determine the age of the artifacts soon.

a reply to: peter vlar

Excellent, if you get a response, please PM me. I would like to read is as well (assuming it is available in English).

About the size of a thumb

I guess the pigments were the clincher.

the ancient engraver chose a tidbit of rib hardened from its time under the sun and carved seven nearly parallel lines, highlighting them with a smear of vibrant ochre pigments.

originally posted by: SeaWorthy

About the size of a thumb
I guess the pigments were the clincher.

in the link, the large red piece of rib bone has what seems to be 5 "freehanded" straight lines...

the 6th etched line (or possibly two lines side-by-side) is totally straight as if the etcher used a straight edge to make that Line significantly different from the earlier lines made to the left of the exactly straight, line etching..

sure the iron oxide was significant or 'holy' to distinguish that item from any others which may have been grouped together for some community reason (think in terms of a Draft Lottery and that 7 stripes on a red rib, was that individuals' ID.
~pulling a name out of a hat~ )

was this Unknown species … really That Smart already ? ~hmmm

a reply to: St Udio

Right! The pigment proves it was not natural.

was this Unknown species … really That Smart already ? ~hmmm

Seems like no matter how far back things are pushed man was already smart! When they found Göbekli Tepe they said man was unable to do anything but live in caves and hunt but they again were wrong!

Its time that the "Human" species were reclassified, to reflect modern times.

The current old system is Soooo 1800s it is obsolete.

Humans would be better grouped in their geographical location.

Therefore we would have, Homo Europa, Homo Africanis, Homo Asia Centralis, Homo Asia Ostenia.

There are just too many individual tribes of humans to use the old 1800s systems of classifying each, evey time a finger bone is found.

We are ALL the same creature, our differences are from our environmental adaptation, hence, we are a result of our environment and where we live.

That being said, these individual adaptations take 1000s of years to develop.

Case in point, I am a White Fella of Euro stock, and my genes have live in Australia for only 150 years....basically 2 average human lives.

I have not turned black in the Sun, I still burn in the Sun, I still have allergies in this land, I still hate the hot weather, I enjoy the cold, etc etc.

In deference to the native peoples, who are the opposite to me, Because they have adapted to this land over the millennia.

In saying that, I still maintain that the "Homo Australis" people, will be found to be the direct descendant of the "Homo Europa" people, as Ive said before, there are native people in central Australia born with blonde, sandy and light brown wavey hair....and they didn't get that from the "Homo Africanis".

Not to mention the 40,000 year old cave paintings of the Negative hand and spirals in Europe, are exactly the same as the 40,000 year old cave paintings of negative hands and spirals in Australia.......makes you wonder.

Come on down here Peter and do some research....you could become famous.

originally posted by: gort51
Its time that the "Human" species were reclassified, to reflect modern times.

The current old system is Soooo 1800s it is obsolete.

Humans would be better grouped in their geographical location.

Therefore we would have, Homo Europa, Homo Africanis, Homo Asia Centralis, Homo Asia Ostenia.

There are just too many individual tribes of humans to use the old 1800s systems of classifying each, evey time a finger bone is found.

We are ALL the same creature, our differences are from our environmental adaptation, hence, we are a result of our environment and where we live.

That being said, these individual adaptations take 1000s of years to develop.

Case in point, I am a White Fella of Euro stock, and my genes have live in Australia for only 150 years....basically 2 average human lives.

I have not turned black in the Sun, I still burn in the Sun, I still have allergies in this land, I still hate the hot weather, I enjoy the cold, etc etc.

In deference to the native peoples, who are the opposite to me, Because they have adapted to this land over the millennia.

In saying that, I still maintain that the "Homo Australis" people, will be found to be the direct descendant of the "Homo Europa" people, as Ive said before, there are native people in central Australia born with blonde, sandy and light brown wavey hair....and they didn't get that from the "Homo Africanis".

Not to mention the 40,000 year old cave paintings of the Negative hand and spirals in Europe, are exactly the same as the 40,000 year old cave paintings of negative hands and spirals in Australia.......makes you wonder.

Come on down here Peter and do some research....you could become famous.

I do not know how the details of your proposal would work but I think your idea has certain merit. The question for me would be how old the finger bone needed to be to fall into your proposed classifications ?

Adaptation to local environment IMO is a strong influence on our species.

a reply to: gort51

Excellent post. I don't know if your classification will pass the muster from people used to using what we have but I do think we should think about starting the classifications over