on conscience and sin

The Bible exposes us to a reality of sin, that humanity is born a sinner in nature. Without a doubt we know from experience a lot of wrong things have been done by people, whatever experience you have with it no matter your conviction of right and wrong.

What I would like to discuss here is whether we have a conscience because we are really born a sinner in nature?

If nothing was wrong with us, if we would never do wrong, if we would not 'sin'; would there be need for a conscience?

Is our conscience calling to make us realize of our bad nature?

Why would we have a conscience if there would be no universal right and wrong and is this conscience in itself universal?
If so, wouldn't that lead us closer to proof of a creating god?

a reply to: Out6of9Balance

Thanks for that...

Nothing's better than heavy metal and youtube to bring you closer to the Lord.

a reply to: olaru12

a reply to: Out6of9Balance

What sin can a baby have? Sin is a control tool entirely fabricated by the society you live in and forced upon you by your parents so you might one day function in that society.

a reply to: Out6of9Balance

Don't know nothin: but seems like concepts such as 'conscience' were being discussed thousands of years before the Bible was written.

But perhaps this doesn't matter to Christians, as they may see the beginning of sin from the 'original sin', so dating back to the beginning of all Mankind?

What do you think about the concept of 'sin', and 'conscience', for non-Christians?

What is sin?

Maybe what has been deemed a sin by our current religions isn't really a sin. I would say they are only about 25% correct with the other 75% of religion's thou shall nots being pure population control and greed.

I can understand 'don't kill' & 'don't lie' but the other stuff was simply created to make sinners of us all. Then we get to go to a religious sanctioned corp so we can get 'pure' again.

So OP, what do you consider sin?

originally posted by: ClovenSky
What is sin?

Maybe what has been deemed a sin by our current religions isn't really a sin. I would say they are only about 25% correct with the other 75% of religion's thou shall nots being pure population control and greed.

I can understand 'don't kill' & 'don't lie' but the other stuff was simply created to make sinners of us all. Then we get to go to a religious sanctioned corp so we can get 'pure' again.

So OP, what do you consider sin?

I don't know.

You make me think of buddhism where karma is punishment, if karma is considered punishment. When enlightened you move out of the law of karma. The Bible teaches us salvation.

Peeple wonders how babies are sinners. Well, they are babies and grow up to become murderers, liars, thieves, psychopaths, rapists.. The sinner grows up, it must be in their nature. Ofcourse as a baby they are incapable of talking and doing things besides sucking a nipple and peeing and pooing but once they are full grown the defects show, in case there is something as right and wrong.

What is sin? Can it be reduced to the claim not having any love? To lie is to not have any love? To kill is to not have any love? How much does one love him/herself when he/she does wicked things?

Love your neighbour as you love yourself, but what when you don't love yourself? What is loving yourself? And what when you are not loved by God?

Is our conscience the doorway to salvation? Is Jesus a conscience? Are we to humble ourselves to what we have withing?

I try to speak of God without doubting his existence while many doubt.

To sin is to do wrong, but what does it matter what is right and wrong without a universal morality for humanity and where would be its origin when it is simply not made by man?

Many things lead to the possiblity of a wise and knowledgeable consciousness as the origin of reality, at least in the way I think.

If there is any place to find God it's within.

a reply to: Out6of9Balance

Many things lead to the possiblity of a wise and knowledgeable consciousness as the origin of reality, at least in the way I think.

We've come a long way since "stryper" eh?

a reply to: Out6of9Balance

I guess it all depends on what you believe is sin or what it means to do wrong.

For me, I took most of the religious BS and threw it away, to start over at square one. Maybe there could be 2 simple levels of sin. Transgressions of the physical and transgressions of the spiritual. Transgressions on the physical is very simple, do not interfere with another person's free will if they are in turn respecting all others free will.

Transgressions on the spiritual is a little more difficult. I think sin of the spiritual is sin against your soul. Like lying. It is more of a sin against yourself than it is against others. You are not compelling another against their own will when speaking falsely and they still have responsibility to discern the truth. But you hurt yourself when deviating from honor.

Now the idea of karma is also very interesting. What is your idea on how karma works?

Classic riffs, classic progressions...

Now the idea of karma is also very interesting. What is your idea on how karma works?

It's all in the music....

originally posted by: ClovenSky
What is sin?

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance
I don't know.
...
To sin is to do wrong, but what does it matter what is right and wrong without a universal morality for humanity and where would be its origin when it is simply not made by man? ...

The Bible's perspective on sin:

Sin: Reasoning From the Scriptures

Definition: Literally, a missing of the mark, according to the Hebrew and Greek Bible texts. God himself sets the “mark” that his intelligent creatures are to reach. Missing that mark is sin, which is also unrighteousness, or lawlessness. (Rom. 3:23; 1 John 5:17; 3:4) Sin is anything not in harmony with God’s personality, standards, ways, and will, all of which are holy. It may involve wrong conduct, failure to do what should be done, ungodly speech, unclean thoughts, or desires or motives that are selfish. The Bible differentiates between inherited sin and willful sin, between an act of sin over which a person is repentant and the practice of sin.
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Is there really such a thing as “sin” nowadays?

Illustrations: If a sick man was to break the thermometer, would that prove that he did not have a fever? If a thief said that he did not believe what is written in the lawbooks, would that make him innocent of crime? Similarly, the fact that many people do not believe it is necessary to live according to Bible standards does not put an end to sin.—See 1 John 1:8.

Some people may choose to do what God’s Word forbids. But that does not prove the Bible wrong. Galatians 6:7, 8 warns: “Do not be misled: God is not one to be mocked. For whatever a man is sowing, this he will also reap; because he who is sowing with a view to his flesh will reap corruption from his flesh.” The epidemic of sexually transmitted diseases, broken homes, and so forth, gives evidence of the truthfulness of what the Bible says. God made man; He knows what will bring us lasting happiness; He tells us in the Bible. Does it not make sense to listen to Him? (For evidence of God’s existence, see the main heading “God.”)
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How does sin affect a person’s relationship with God?

1 John 3:4, 8: “Everyone who practices sin is also practicing lawlessness, and so sin is lawlessness. He who carries on sin originates with the Devil.” (How forceful this is! Those who deliberately choose a course of sin, making a practice of it, are viewed by God as criminals. The course they have chosen is the one that Satan himself first took.)

Rom. 5:8, 10: “While we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. . . . When we were enemies, we became reconciled to God through the death of his Son.” (Notice that sinners are referred to as enemies of God. How wise, then, to avail ourselves of the provision that God has made for reconciliation to him!)

1 Tim. 1:13: “I was shown mercy [says the apostle Paul], because I was ignorant and acted with a lack of faith.” (But when he was shown the right way by the Lord, he did not hold back from following it.)

2 Cor. 6:1, 2: “Working together with him, we also entreat you not to accept the undeserved kindness of God and miss its purpose. For he says: ‘In an acceptable time I heard you, and in a day of salvation I helped you.’ Look! Now is the especially acceptable time. Look! Now is the day of salvation.” (Now is the time when the opportunity for salvation is available. God will not forever extend toward sinful humans such undeserved kindness. So, care needs to be exercised in order that we do not miss its purpose.)

How is relief from our sinful state possible?

See the main heading “Ransom.”

SECTION 9: What Is Sin?

...
Does sin include only serious crime?

Any bad action, feeling, or thought is a sin. That includes such things as uncontrolled anger, cursing at one’s mate or children, nurturing a wrong desire, or giving in to a selfish impulse.
...
Could anyone go through life without ever sinning?

Can anyone honestly say, for example, that he has never violated the tenth commandment: “You must not desire . . . anything that belongs to your fellowman”? (Exodus 20:17 [20:14, TNK]) Realistically, we know that “there is no man that does not sin.” (1 Kings 8:46) Completely avoiding all sin, even for a day, is beyond our ability.

How deep-seated is sin?

Our inability to avoid error shows that sin is a deeper problem than simply committing wrong acts. We all inherit sin. We get sick, grow old, and die, not because we choose to do bad deeds, but primarily because we are born imperfect, inclined to error. We cannot rid ourselves of this inclination by our own efforts. “Who can produce someone clean out of someone unclean? There is not one.”—Job 14:4.

Adam and Eve were created perfect—not inclined to error. When they chose to sin, they became like a dented cake pan that could produce only a dented cake. Thus, we have no choice in the matter. We all carry a dent like theirs—various imperfections and wrong inclinations. In a word, the sin we inherited from Adam and Eve. But does that really matter?

SECTION 10: How Does Sin Affect Our Relationship With God?

What Does the Bible Say About Sin? (Bible Teachings > Bible Questions Answered)

...The Bible also describes sins of omission​—that is, failing to do what is right.​—James 4:​17.
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Are some sins worse than others?

Yes. For example, the Bible says that the men of ancient Sodom were “wicked, gross sinners” whose sin was “very heavy.” (Genesis 13:13; 18:20) Consider three factors that determine the gravity, or weight, of sin.

1. Severity. The Bible warns us to avoid such serious sins as sexual immorality, idolatry, stealing, drunkenness, extortion, murder, and spiritism. (1 Corinthians 6:​9-​11; Revelation 21:8) The Bible contrasts these with thoughtless, unintentional sins, for example, words or actions that hurt others. (Proverbs 12:18; Ephesians 4:​31, 32) Nevertheless, the Bible encourages us not to minimize any sins, since they can lead to more serious violations of God’s laws.​—Matthew 5:​27, 28.

2. Motive. Some sins are committed in ignorance of what God requires. (Acts 17:30; 1 Timothy 1:​13) While not excusing such sins, the Bible distinguishes them from sins that involve willfully breaking God’s laws. (Numbers 15:30, 31) Willful sins come from a “wicked heart.”​—Jeremiah 16:12.

3. Frequency. The Bible also makes a distinction between a single sin and a practice of sin over an extended period. (1 John 3:​4-8) Those who “practice sin willfully,” even after learning how to do what is right, receive God’s adverse judgment.​—Hebrews 10:26, 27.
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Focussing on "spiritism" for a moment.

Leviticus 19:31 (NW)

31 “‘Do not turn to the spirit mediums, and do not consult fortune-tellers so as to become unclean by them. I am Jehovah your God.

The Bible is clear concerning attempts by the living to contact the dead—a practice that was common in ancient times. For example, Jehovah God’s Law to the nation of Israel said: “There should not be found in you anyone . . . who consults a spirit medium or . . . inquires of the dead. For whoever does these things is detestable to Jehovah.” (Deuteronomy 18:10-12) The Bible also states that those who practice spiritism in any of its forms “will not inherit God’s Kingdom.”—Galatians 5:19-21.

Can the dead influence the living?

“The living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing at all.”—Ecclesiastes 9:5.

WHAT PEOPLE SAY:

Many claim that the dead live on in some form (usually involving the concept of an immortal soul.*). Hence, they may try to communicate with the dead, perhaps to obtain information or to appease the dead in hopes that they will leave the living in peace.

*: Bible usage shows the soul to be a person or an animal or the life that a person or an animal enjoys. To many persons, however, “soul” means the immaterial or spirit part of a human being that survives the death of the physical body. Others understand it to be the principle of life. But these latter views are not Bible teachings. Spiritism is the belief that the spirits of dead humans survive the death of the physical body and that they can and do communicate with the living, especially through a person (a medium) particularly susceptible to their influence. The Greek word for “practice of spiritism” is phar·ma·kiʹa, which literally means “druggery.” This term came to be connected with spiritism because in ancient times, drugs were used when invoking the power of the demons in order to practice sorcery.​—Ga 5:20; Re 21:8.

WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS:

“The living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing at all . . . Their love and their hate and their jealousy [all of which they felt while alive] have already perished.” (Ecclesiastes 9:5, 6) Yes, the Bible teaches that the dead are just that—dead! They cannot think, act, or even worship God. “The dead do not praise [God]; nor do any who go down into the silence of death,” says Psalm 115:17.

a reply to: Out6of9Balance

A sinner is someone that misses the mark....
A cross has crosshairs..... in the center the point where the two lines meet is the mark.

Man is the horizontal line and God is the vertical.
The horizontal line is time and man is imagined to move along it.
The vertical line is not moving in time.

Stop moving in time and hit the mark.... Be still and know I am God.

Sinning is moving in time......
Can anything appear outside of now?

God is now.... be baptized in the flowing ever changing presence.

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
a reply to: Out6of9Balance

A sinner is someone that misses the mark....
A cross has crosshairs..... in the center the point where the two lines meet is the mark.

Man is the horizontal line and God is the vertical.
The horizontal line is time and man is imagined to move along it.
The vertical line is not moving in time.

Stop moving in time and hit the mark.... Be still and know I am God.

Sinning is moving in time......
Can anything appear outside of now?

God is now.... be baptized in the flowing ever changing presence.

There is no now but only everchanging presence in time.

a reply to: Out6of9Balance

There is just what is happening..

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
a reply to: Out6of9Balance

There is just what is happening..

I hope something is happening.