Gillibrand's "Family Bill of Rights"...

originally posted by: G0DK1LL3R
a reply to: Krakatoa

Since you being annoying. If you pretend to care about child then yes you are included.

If you claim the child in womb is precious and must be protected but then turn around and say not my problem, not my tax money.

Then you are included.

What if I told you I was both pro-choice and pro-life? Seems there is a gray area that simpletons fail to grasp....because it is difficult to address. I'll explain....

I am pro-choice up to 8 weeks. By that time (about 6 weeks), the woman MUST have missed a period, indicating the potential pregnancy. Time to get tested and decide to abort. In addition, at that time the embryo has not fully developed a working nervous system (to feel pain) or the several lobes of the brain (that can process those nerve signals to indicate pain).

I am pro-life after 8 weeks since the nervous system has formed, and is working to deliver sensory input such as pain and touch to the working and developing brain. At that point, limbs have also formed (if all goes OK) giving the appearance of a human form.

However, if medical exams prove the baby is so malformed that life outside the body would be impossible, or the the life (not health) of the mother would be in jeopardy by not carrying to full term or to the point a C-section would remove the baby for artificial life support in infant ICU, then aborting would be acceptable.

In the cases of forced pregnancy (i.e. incest, rape, etc...) then charges MUST be filed to ensure it is a serious and actual offense AT THE TIME (not years later). Then, IMO, aborting the pregnancy is an option, one that I would discourage, but would respect HER decision.

Now, in all this discussion, not ONCE has the man's rights to be part of the decision process EVER come up. Why is that? His genetic material is part of that life form...is it not?

So, now where do I fit?

I made a conscious and responsible decision not to have children. I have had my share of female partners over the decades, and either used multiple forms of protection, or opted simply to NOT engage in the act to risk the chance I would inseminate her "accidentally".

Was it an easy decision, heck no boy...sometimes it was frankly quite difficult to make that decision. But, as a man, that is MY decision to make, and take responsibility for MY decision. Just as it is the woman's decision, and HER responsibility to take responsibility for HER decision.

Expecting the taxpayers to foot the bill for a poor decision is IMO irresponsible, and that in itself should disqualify them from parenthood.

Again I ask, am I still on that list of yours?

a reply to: Krakatoa

Blah Blah Blah , so Tell Us All what you Really Think then ? ........Yawn......

originally posted by: Zanti Misfit
a reply to: Krakatoa

Blah Blah Blah , so Tell Us All what you Really Think then ? ........Yawn......

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that it was sarcasm.

why you should care about this

the kids are innocent, but some of you seem to want to punish them for the mistakes of their parents.

all kids need the best chance that can be given to them.

these kids will grow up to be what you teach them to be. if they grow up getting the short end of the stick and hopeless, guess what you will get?

they will grow up and become leaders, workers, taxpayers. if you start their learning early, they become educated and better workers that pay more in taxes.

they will end up taking care of you. or they will try to rob you. how you treat them determines your own fate, so its in your best interest to treat them well.

lets try this another way.

jesus, whom many of you speak of yet know little about, said suffer the children and what you do to the least you do to me.

you have one intrinsic, god-given right. that is to procreate. "be fruitful and multiply" didnt have an addendum "if you can afford it". all those other "god-given rights" didnt come around until the constitution, which is why your "rights" end as soon as you step into a country that doesnt recognize those "rights". (if those rights which you think are "god-given" because the constitution says so, then illegals have those very same rights, granted by god.)

punishing children for the mistakes of their parents is just wrong.

many of you need to think with compassion instead of greed. "I dont want to pay!" Tough! its called being part of a society, and sometimes the needs of the many outweigh your petty greed.

a reply to: stormson

Why bring religion into this?

Why can't we have a rational discussion without the pro-abortion crowd bringing up religion?

originally posted by: stormson
why you should care about this

the kids are innocent, but some of you seem to want to punish them for the mistakes of their parents.

all kids need the best chance that can be given to them.

these kids will grow up to be what you teach them to be. if they grow up getting the short end of the stick and hopeless, guess what you will get?

they will grow up and become leaders, workers, taxpayers. if you start their learning early, they become educated and better workers that pay more in taxes.

they will end up taking care of you. or they will try to rob you. how you treat them determines your own fate, so its in your best interest to treat them well.

lets try this another way.

jesus, whom many of you speak of yet know little about, said suffer the children and what you do to the least you do to me.

you have one intrinsic, god-given right. that is to procreate. "be fruitful and multiply" didnt have an addendum "if you can afford it". all those other "god-given rights" didnt come around until the constitution, which is why your "rights" end as soon as you step into a country that doesnt recognize those "rights". (if those rights which you think are "god-given" because the constitution says so, then illegals have those very same rights, granted by god.)

punishing children for the mistakes of their parents is just wrong.

many of you need to think with compassion instead of greed. "I dont want to pay!" Tough! its called being part of a society, and sometimes the needs of the many outweigh your petty greed.

I respectfully disagree. I see it as me paying for others mistakes. When. all my life I have been careful to NOT make that mistake. Yet, somehow, folks want to reward me with having to pay for others.

Sorry, enough is enough.

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: stormson

Why bring religion into this?

Why can't we have a rational discussion without the pro-abortion crowd bringing up religion?

this thread isnt about abortion in any way, shape, or form, no matter how some of you have tried to co-op it into being one. its about taking care of living children.

so far i have seen only two types of negative responses. punish the children because of their parents, and i dont want to pay for it. one is misplaced morality, the other is greed. both are bad and short sighted.

originally posted by: stormson

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: stormson

Why bring religion into this?

Why can't we have a rational discussion without the pro-abortion crowd bringing up religion?

this thread isnt about abortion in any way, shape, or form, no matter how some of you have tried to co-op it into being one. its about taking care of living children.

so far i have seen only two responses. punish the children because of their parents, and i dont want to pay for it. one is misplaced morality, the other is greed. both are bad and short sighted.

How many full paychecks have you donated to the local planned parenthood? If you are soooooooo "woke" about all of this, and morally superior and not one of the greedy folks. If the answer is less than all, then you too are a greedy person,. and have misplaced morality.

a reply to: Krakatoa

so let the innocent children suffer?

originally posted by: stormson
a reply to: Krakatoa

so let the innocent children suffer?

See, there are already programs in place that I already pay for to care for those children. Is it perfect. no. However, no family is perfect...and if you think so you are insane.

Again, I ask you directly, how much of your paycheck have you personally donated to care for these children?

Or, are you simply a virtue signaling hypocrite?

originally posted by: stormson

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: stormson

Why bring religion into this?

Why can't we have a rational discussion without the pro-abortion crowd bringing up religion?

this thread isnt about abortion in any way, shape, or form, no matter how some of you have tried to co-op it into being one. its about taking care of living children.

so far i have seen only two types of negative responses. punish the children because of their parents, and i dont want to pay for it. one is misplaced morality, the other is greed. both are bad and short sighted.

I refuse to give the government more of my money so it can go to others.

Government does not spend wisely.

If they did, I wouldn't have an issue.

But government is filled with idiots who want to buy votes with my money.

a reply to: Krakatoa

i dont support planned parenthood.

again, get off the abortion line. more than enough threads for that without coming here.

this is about taking care of children in need. i do that in the small ways that i can.

children are blank slates, and if you treat them right, or give them someplace that treats them right, then they will see another path if they are surrounded by less than desirable circumstances.

from an egoist point of view, i care about the well being of children to make my life better in the long run.

a reply to: Krakatoa

a direct answer, nearly half.

originally posted by: stormson
a reply to: Krakatoa

a direct answer, nearly half.

Got a receipt to show us all, for proof of that statement?

At least I am honest in my actions AND statements.

a reply to: stormson

If their parent can not or will not take care of them, then they can be adopted by someone who will .

Just because the adults are irresponsible ... they are creating the problem . And they should never be allowed to collect any kind of public benefits after that, ever. And any wages or tax refunds they ever managed to get from that point on should be paid to whomever took care of the offspring until legally adopted.

Sex is a choice , and a responsiblity. Their choice, their responsibility.

a reply to: DBCowboy

so, doing nothing is your solution?

the gov isnt perfect, but its really the only thing that has the size capable of doing a project on this scale. its the only pool large enough.

look at it this way. individual states cant mount an effective army to defend the country. only the gov can by taking from some and giving to others for the nation as a whole.

individual states couldnt build an effective interstates system. only the gov had the size and scope to accomplish it.

sometimes you have to be a team player.

a reply to: stormson

You neglected my response varietal...who pays for the costs associated with private businesses being forced to pay people who arent working?

All compassion understood, but our constitution does not provide for stealing money from one entity while another doesnt show up for work while caring for a dying family member.

originally posted by: stormson
a reply to: Krakatoa
....
again, get off the abortion line. more than enough threads for that without coming here.

this is about taking care of children in need. i do that in the small ways that i can.

....

So, the #1 and #2 of the proposed bill, the one the thread discussion is about, has NOTHING to do with abortion rights?

Are you seriously trying to move those goal posts because you are not getting the positive reinforcement for your virtues that you expected?

a reply to: dragonlover12

with hundred of thousands of kids waiting for adoption, with taxpayers footing the bill, you want to add to that?

either way, your gonna pay. orphanages and fosters homes have a not so good track record.

pay now, or pay later with they grow up to be less than respectable.

originally posted by: stormson
a reply to: DBCowboy

so, doing nothing is your solution?

the gov isnt perfect, but its really the only thing that has the size capable of doing a project on this scale. its the only pool large enough.

look at it this way. individual states cant mount an effective army to defend the country. only the gov can by taking from some and giving to others for the nation as a whole.

individual states couldnt build an effective interstates system. only the gov had the size and scope to accomplish it.

sometimes you have to be a team player.

If being a "team player" means socialist bullcrap programs and higher taxes, then you can stuff your "team player" mantra where the sun don't shine.

Team player.

*Christ!*

What's next? You going to tell me it's my "patriotic duty" to pay more taxes?