Democrats Green New Deal + Medicare 4 All - Cost 93 TRILLION Dollars. Its Not About Cost Though.

a reply to: carewemust

They may promise a plan that would theoretically cost trillions of dollars, but through denial of care for some things, and wait times (allowing some folks to succumb), they will only spend a fraction of what they promise.

There is no way the government can afford to pay for people's healthcare, while also letting them keep their 'choices' of providers, procedures, medicines, and all that. If the government becomes our 'single payer', they get a monopoly, and can dictate the healthcare we receive, and it will most likely be less for the average person that what the average person currently gets, and with a higher price tag for anyone able to pay the 'tax'.

a reply to: carewemust

There is a partisan disconnect there, in my opinion. The left side capes up and white knights health care, mostly using other people's money while the right side take care of themselves with their own money and expects the rest of the country to do the same. If people want health care, they need to get jobs and provide their own health care... if they cannot, then well... welcome to natural selection.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: carewemust
The Democrat who wins in 2020

LOL!
Meanwhile, here in the real world...

Hey...I didn't think Americans hated their circumstances enough to give Democrats a House Majority....but they fooled me!

a reply to: carewemust

That fails to account for the stolen elections … oops, hope I am not disciplined for saying that on this thread *blush*

The Dem Party keeps showing how freaking stupid and asinine they really are. We can't even give our vets proper health care, yet they want to give medical to 325 million people. Seriously?

They want to do away with fossil fuels but can't even build a train rail between LA and SF without literally throwing away billions of dollars before getting started, now it's canned. These are Federal funds they're flushing down the toilet, not just state taxes and Ca doesn't want to give them back, they say it would be disastrous. Now they want citizens to fund another one of their f'd up pipe dreams.

The Democratic Party has literally become a Party full of clueless idiots and buffoons. I don't get what people see in them? These people couldn't even manage a lemonade stand FFS.

originally posted by: xuenchen

originally posted by: carewemust

originally posted by: xuenchen
Double or Triple the "$27,000" because many pay little to no taxes.

Since Obama had no problem with running up the national debt more than every President before him, combined... The Democrat who wins in 2020 will not hesitate to get loans from China, and print more $$$ either.

Treasury Yields will raise to 10% again.

Seniors will like getting a 10% return on their CD's again. Never mind that Hamburger will cost $20 a pound.

Once again we find an idea backed by people who just assume someone else is going to pay for it

and opposed by the people that would actually have to pay for it.



If "medicare for all" included a provision where those who pay no taxes had to work say, 15 hrs a week cleaning bedpans,mopping floors, etc., to make a contribution to the system, well, I wonder how many of these bums would still support it.

originally posted by: carewemust

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: carewemust
The Democrat who wins in 2020

LOL!
Meanwhile, here in the real world...

Hey...I didn't think Americans hated their circumstances enough to give Democrats a House Majority....but they fooled me!

Meh, the House is by far the most fluid and difficult to nail down of the two chambers. Had the GOP not seen a self imposed exodus of retiring reps, they'd have held the House.

a reply to: Fowlerstoad

All good points, backed by what other Universal Healthcare countries have experienced.

Also, if Ocasio-Cortez is any example, there will be a huge amount of "skimming" dollars from the top, to keep top politicians and their friends living the "good life", while everyone else sacrifices till it hurts.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

With ObamaCare as the law of the land, people who don't have health insurance through their job, can't afford to buy their own health insurance now. Obamacare health insurance plans have been "socialized" in their structure.

originally posted by: Fowlerstoad
a reply to: carewemust
That fails to account for the stolen elections … oops, hope I am not disciplined for saying that on this thread *blush*

I thought the Administration conducted an audit, and didn't find any significant 2018 election irregularities?

There is no way in hell that we can be paying that much money. I can see medicare for all, but you need to remember, they cannot allow all the expensive procedures that are being done, we have the highest priced health care system around and it is not as good as most cheaper industrialized countries have. We need socialized medicine with limits on what can be done, having the insurance pay a hundred thousand bucks so a person can get six months more life is not reasonable, especially when that six months turns to hell. We need to stop the greed and profiteering in the medical trade and the government agencies overseeing the healthcare need to come clean and tell the truth about all of this deceit being spread.

a reply to: rickymouse

The SCARY part to me is that regular health insurance would be outlawed. Every single American would be on the Universal Healthcare plan.

The best doctors would focus on wealthier people who can afford them. All other doctors will either exit the business, or be the ones you and I would see.

originally posted by: rickymouse
There is no way in hell that we can be paying that much money. I can see medicare for all, but you need to remember, they cannot allow all the expensive procedures that are being done, we have the highest priced health care system around and it is not as good as most cheaper industrialized countries have. We need socialized medicine with limits on what can be done, having the insurance pay a hundred thousand bucks so a person can get six months more life is not reasonable, especially when that six months turns to hell. We need to stop the greed and profiteering in the medical trade and the government agencies overseeing the healthcare need to come clean and tell the truth about all of this deceit being spread.

the reality is that they first need to fix the overcharging involved in anything to do with medical care. the problem really is not being able to afford insurance or not. it's the fact that thanks to things like medical insurance, and even those countries that have socialized medicine, the prices of anything to do with medical care have been let go to insane levels. price levels that ONLY an insurance company or country can afford to pay. forget about what you are calling an expensive procedure that only costs one hundred thousand. that is actually quite cheap. there are people like a relative of mine who take a single medication which costs just under THREE MILLION DOLLARS A YEAR, and that is every year (well at least until prices go up like they tend to do), for the rest of their life. and then on top of that an eppipen type medication they need to carry 3 doses of to use at need. but they are only TWENTY THOUSAND DOLLARS each. wonder how much that ends up costing the tax payers a year on top of that almost $3,000,000? well at least they have Medicaid that pays for it.

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: rickymouse

The SCARY part to me is that regular health insurance would be outlawed. Every single American would be on the Universal Healthcare plan.

The best doctors would focus on wealthier people who can afford them. All other doctors will either exit the business, or be the ones you and I would see.

What doctors? What nurses? What staff?

You do realize that this would have to include government salary controls on all medical professions. And subsequent caps on costs for companies auxiliary to the healthcare field, which would lead to massive lay-offs.

It would depress the entire US economy, Obamacare almost did it and it didn't have a fraction of the control and authority that a government-run system would have.

a reply to: carewemust

How about we ask for some accountability from the taxes we already pay, where are they going what are they doing for us. Why would we want to give the most inefficient system on earth more money when our only return on investment has effectively been a rationing on our dollar value.

Everybody realizes by now that politicians use these social systems to put their family in friends in business to siphon off as much as they can. Why would we agree to keep feeding a machine that is destined to eat us. If you think you have something to benefit you're in it with them or you hate the people around you soo much you're willing to suffer to see them suffer.

Politicians are morally inept, greedy power hungry war mongers,.... skip to,.. "we should hand all of our money and freedoms over to them". Where is the logic in that? Is the power supposed to make them feel guilty? Are we going to satiate their need for power somehow leveling them out. This is like if in negotiating with lil' Kim we decide instead of leveraging them out of nukes we instead decide to fulfill his dreams by giving him nuclear capabilities.

a reply to: carewemust

Obviously, the healthcare cartels and monopolies will need to be broken up.

I read some article where some $3000 procedure outside the United States cost the healthcare provider $65000 in the United States. This is making the Pentagon purchasing corruption of the 80s and 90s look like chump change.

originally posted by: carewemust
March 5, 2019

Virtually every major Democrat running for President is promising America that they will implement a "Green New Deal that includes Medicare For All", if elected President.

Germany does it, why can't we?

But I don't think even the most ardent and trusting Democrats will go along with these programs, when the final costs are revealed.

Yes they will.

It's been the left's wet dream of creating a monopoly over healthcare since the days of FDR.

Any democrat elected in 2020 will be a disaster for this country, that's understating the pure snip that would follow.

a reply to: carewemust

The entire problem with healthcare is that the system is designed for maximum control and profit... not our health. Sure, they want to keep us alive so that they can keep gouging us -- and so they can't be sued for our deaths -- but that's about it. We're told to get this test and that test and any other test they can possibly justify, but not for our benefit. We're given lots of medications to "manage" our illnesses and conditions, but not cure them. Government controls who and what healthcare we can use.

I read about a guy in England yesterday who has shrunk a tumor by half in three months using high CBD oil. Cannabis. That awful awful marijuana that has absolutely no medicinal benefits according to government. But we're supposed to believe that they don't know that??? A few hundred bucks to cure cancer with an oil you can make and dose all by your lonesome? Can't have that!!! Nope. Gotta spend millions -- or hundreds of thousands at least -- on chemo and radiation and let them just about kill you to get a cure from Government approved medicine.

ETA: Striking scans show how 'lung cancer patient's tumours SHRANK within three months of him taking daily drops of cannabis-derived oil'

Socialist medicine is no different than crony capitalist medicine. Either way, only the few are going to receive quality healthcare. And it ALL COMES BACK TO CONTROL!!! And right now, we do have the poor paying for the rich's healthcare. Because whether you want to believe it or not, if you live and breathe, you pay taxes somehow and some way. But not everyone is benefiting from those massive government dollars paying into the healthcare system. All those oh-so-expensive medicines that our tax dollars pay for the research and development of said drug, then someone is given a patent and we pay out the wazoo -- IF we're lucky enough to get it. Same for medical tests and procedures.

Literally all we have to do is take away the government controls, and all the special privileges and entitlements for healthcare providers, require pricing transparency, and the cost of healthcare would plummet. Overnight. The entire system is propped up by crony capitalist rules, regs and laws.

The only solution is to institute both a bare bones public option and customizable private option. And to teach people how to take care of themselves -- starting as kids in school -- so that we are not forced to be so completely and totally dependent on a system (and people) that don't give a rat's patootie about us and our best interests.