Meet project often-MK-ULTRAS' baby brother

(sorry if this is the wrong forum, but I believe this it where it belongs.)

You all know MKULTRA right? of course you do-this is ATS-but in case you don't you can find official CIA documents here.

But did you know MKULTRA had a baby brother? but this child was more rosemary's baby then a bouncing baby boy, it has to be read to be believed (or not believed) let's just say it would make Alistair Crowley proud, and apparently he inspired the CIA.

Believe it or not, the CIA wanted to go witch doctor on their enemies butts.

According to some sources, MKOFTEN went beyond the mere research of mind control and incapacitation of enemies, and branched out into the world of black magic, witchcraft, and the occult. The accusation was first put forth by British investigative journalist and author Gordon Thomas, who wrote the 2007 book Secrets and Lies, and who claims that a Dr. Sidney Gottlieb, chief of the CIA’s Technical Services Branch and also known as the “Black Sorcerer” due to his expertise with poisons, used the program to “explore the world of black magic and harness the forces of darkness and challenge the concept that the inner reaches of the mind are beyond reach.”

But wait-it gets better as apparently the CIA's extensive research went full on new age hippie, employing a plethora of "experts"

Agents spread out across the country in search of fortune-tellers, palm readers, psychics and clairvoyants. The agents would introduce themselves as researchers from the Scientific Engineering Institute (SEI), but they were dubbed the “Department of the Unorthodox.”

Hungry yet? don't worry as the tale gets a lot tastier.

Thomas posits Gottlieb really living up to his nickname, meeting with astrologers and fortune-tellers, “Chinese palmists,” voodooists, practitioners of Satanism, and who knows what else. (This is about when Army Intelligence officer Michael Aquino joins Anton LaVey’s Church of Satan, by the way.)

Any story with the prince of darkness is a good one.

So what's the deal? for me it could be another Dulce base, because internet. However the evidence of MK-ULTRA is clearly provided by the C.I.A itself makes you wonder. The question is why? a bolstered military budget, breakthroughs in satellite technology, were they hoping to defeat their enemies with a oiuja board?

Who knows, I'd like to know your thoughts.

human history is all wrong, all religions are false, and we live in a control system.
and for me Magick is everywhere and controlling us in ways we dont even know.
evidence of this is everywhere
feralhouse.com...

“The Great Beast” has been the subject of several biographies, some painting him as a misunderstood genius, others as a manipulative charlatan. None of them have looked seriously at his career as an agent of British Intelligence.

Using documents gleaned from British, American, French and Italian archives, Secret Agent 666 sensationally reveals that Crowley played a major role in the sinking of the Lusitania, a plot to overthrow the government of Spain, the thwarting of Irish and Indian nationalist conspiracies, and the 1941 flight of Rudolf Hess.

a reply to: Thecakeisalie

These so called practitioners that were being sought after are merely tricksters and hucksters. Professionals in the art of manipulation and confidence earning. Just the type of people that can teach agents how to trick people. Experts at slight of hand, cold reading, and idea planting. I can see how these skills would be very valuable to teach any undercover agent.

When a gov agency wants to learn something, they spare no expense to gather knowledge from every source. If you learn every trick from every huckster, and make a database to be used as a training book, you wind up with very efficient liars. Which is the most important skill for cloak and dagger operations.

Also, it makes it look as though the gov puts a lot of stock into the paranormal, so other countries may waste their time looking into ghosts and fairies while you are teaching your agents real skills.

a reply to: ManyMasks

“The Great Beast” has been the subject of several biographies, some painting him as a misunderstood genius, others as a manipulative charlatan. None of them have looked seriously at his career as an agent of British Intelligence. Using documents gleaned from British, American, French and Italian archives, Secret Agent 666 sensationally reveals that Crowley played a major role in the sinking of the Lusitania, a plot to overthrow the government of Spain, the thwarting of Irish and Indian nationalist conspiracies, and the 1941 flight of Rudolf Hess.

I'm Glad you mentioned that, I forgot to mention Crowleys' alleged links to British Intelligence, his role I do not know of but it is known that remote viewers have been pursued by the military.

There is a movie called The men who stare at ghosts starring George Clooney and Ewan McGregor, it's a somewhat funny take of what the C.I.A psyops were really up to.

a reply to: Woodcarver

when you have read up on occult/esoteric teachings and see it everywhere
that rationalisation of yours becomes laughable

originally posted by: ManyMasks
a reply to: Woodcarver

when you have read up on occult/esoteric teachings and see it everywhere
that rationalisation of yours becomes laughable

You are just the type of person who is most susceptible to manipulation.

When you truly understand what magic is, you see past the paranormal claims and see that it is all a big charade to trick idiots into believing in ghosts instead of seeing the slight of hand.

a reply to: Thecakeisalie
Interesting. That reminds me of The First Earth Battalion.

a reply to: Woodcarver

am i now, and you know what type of person i am.
my conditioning fashioned my thinking, and my conditioning
has been one of ever changing environments, ive experienced a
# load in my 39 yrs mate, i see things very clearly...

have you been in the same job your whole life and followed the same religious teachings
i believe nothing, yet accept that anything is possible.
and i know!

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: ManyMasks
a reply to: Woodcarver

when you have read up on occult/esoteric teachings and see it everywhere
that rationalisation of yours becomes laughable

You are just the type of person who is most susceptible to manipulation.

When you truly understand what magic is, you see past the paranormal claims and see that it is all a big charade to trick idiots into believing in ghosts instead of seeing the slight of hand.

Can you explain, what you seem to understand personally, what magic really is then?
Can you de-bunk the idea of the paranormal/ supernatural? I'd be very interested in what you would have to say.

originally posted by: ManyMasks
a reply to: Woodcarver

when you have read up on occult/esoteric teachings and see it everywhere
that rationalisation of yours becomes laughable

Laughable? don't shoot the f'in messenger dude, the member didn't come up with the stories! merely reporting them and offered my opinion.

a reply to: Gravelbone

From my experiences looking into this stuff, I always came to the same type of conclusion.
Magic = Manipulation
A magic word is not something you say as you wave a wand..
It's all metaphor.
Magic words are telling two different people that the other one said they could kick their ass. Now you created a fight with your 'magic' (manipulation)

I do believe in some paranormal forces, I just don't believe humans can control them.
When it comes to crowley and his 'sex magic,' well, I think his intentions were obvious..

a reply to: Thecakeisalie

im agreeing with the OP, WC is saying that magic is about pulling bunnys out of hats

im saying its about so much more

and its in everything, sigils are everywhere

its in advertising, imagery, even language and words.

psychology is catching up, finding more unexplained phenomenon
that can be easily explained by the occult/hidden
and theres the oxymoron
how can you explain with something that is hidden?

Magic is what science will be called in 50 years.

a reply to: ManyMasks

There is magic and there is 'magic.'

For me magic is prestidigitation, for others it's inciting lines from Crowleys' Ruby Star. The word 'magic' has many interpretations.

a reply to: Thecakeisalie

some people will never be able to accept what magic is
thats why they will always be controlled by it


heres a link about some famous magi
ultraculture.org...

originally posted by: o0oTOPCATo0o
a reply to: Gravelbone

From my experiences looking into this stuff, I always came to the same type of conclusion.
Magic = Manipulation
A magic word is not something you say as you wave a wand..
It's all metaphor.
Magic words are telling two different people that the other one said they could kick their ass. Now you created a fight with your 'magic' (manipulation)

I do believe in some paranormal forces, I just don't believe humans can control them.
When it comes to crowley and his 'sex magic,' well, I think his intentions were obvious..

Interesting ideas. Can't say you're wrong in regards to manipulation being a part of it.
But, to think that is the totality of it all would be short-sighted to say the least.
I lead no one down that path myself, it's a tangled web, but let's just say that if you require more proof to change your paradigm on this subject, believe me when I say it's out there. You just have to look in the right places.

The earliest form of magic I can remember hearing about was from Ray Mears, when I was reading about people like Austin Osman Spiers, Robert Anton Wilson, I watched a documentary with the survivalist Mears explain how tribes used animal headresses as part of their rituals and the paintings of animals in the caves with spears in them is basically how sigil magic works,
Cause and effect

a reply to: Thecakeisalie

This article is not pretty but neither is the truth
It's ugly and hard to contemplate never mind accept...
www.collective-evolution.com...

originally posted by: Thecakeisalie
The question is why?

Because knowledge is power.

You either know it exists and can use it to your advantage, or you know it doesn't exist and can't be used against you.

a reply to: Thecakeisalie

To all intents and purposes we're sort of hard-wired as a species to be superstitious. Yes, we have atheists, and militant ones too, who will argue about nature versus nurture regarding superstitions. Despite that, the history of humanity has been influenced by superstitions and they're a hot button for most people across the planet.

For that reason, it's logical to have a program that exploits that primitive part of our brains where the darker fears exist. I've read about the Mongol general, Subotai, and Sun Tzu (Chinese strategist, philosopher, warrior) using superstitions to screw with the minds of their enemies. It's got ancient provenance.