Oh boy...this one's gonna get ugly

a reply to: TheElectricPriest

It has been.

There are laws that say this kid, as a parolee, is not allowed "the power of the gun."

a reply to: Boadicea

An excellent response, and truly a gentle wisdom that I was hoping to find. I was very aware of this, I've dealt with police on several occasions, and you can even see his level of simple annoyance in the video he made shortly before getting shot while still in the car. You're absolutely right, the whole thing is screwed.

I guess my whole point in making the thread was my simple shock at the outcry. My roommate is black, and as we watched it together I said, "oh hell, they're not going to get any traction on this." And he completely agreed. Everything you said in your post was right, I agree completely, but I'm still curious about this particular case. Let me ask you a question, because I truly value your insight...

Why do you think this hasn't garnered any national attention?

originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

If this young man was on parole, which it definitely sounds that way, he is not allowed to possess a gun.

Case closed in my opinion.

So you are in favor of limiting 2nd amendment rights? You are agreeing that the Government can take away a "god-given" rights enshrined in the bill of rights? What part of "Shall not be infringed" do you not understand?
/sarc

You lose your "God given rights" if and when you are a convicted felon.

Get caught with one or in your car or home..in many states...automatic 2-5(?) years back in prison.

Commit a felony....any felony...get convicted....you forfeit your rights as a convicted felon...and a felon knows that.

Self defense? They can use a knife, car, golf club, pepper spray...frying pan...just not a firearm...

This happened very close to where we live, so I saw it on the news. First - I 100% agree that if you shoot a cop, you should expect to get shot no matter what color you are. I have no problem with that.

But, being fair in this case - I watched the video posted (first link) and didn't really see anything wrong. The family is asking to see the body cam footage. They were told by the other three passengers in the car that their son exited the car when asked, and was shot by a police officer, specifically contradicting the story told to them by law enforcement. They even say, "we are going to hold our comments for now, we're just going to let things play out the way they're supposed to" (and that is actually the only thing they say in the entire video). They have not yet been allowed to see the footage, but the video says that they would be allowed to view it on Thursday (today).

In several different clips, it seems like what is being asked for is transparency about what happened to their son, and the ability to view the footage. I can assure you that if my child was shot and killed and I was receiving conflicting reports about what happened, I would do everything I could to find out the truth. I don't think that makes these moms bad people, it just makes them parents.

It seems like this thread has taken a turn toward gun control (and I agree that he probably shouldn't have had a gun), but in terms of the moms coming out "in that angry, righteous fashion characterized by police shootings of young black men," I don't know about all that.

a reply to: TheElectricPriest

Probably because most of us understand that when the cops pull you over, you do what they say. You don't fight it.

I got pulled over and harassed for a crack in my windshield! Do you think I was fighting the cop over it? No. I did what he told me in every way and made no sudden moves.

a reply to: FilthyUSMonkey

If you commit a crime you lose all sorts of rights.

a reply to: TheElectricPriest

Something I can almost guarantee:

Cop shoots black suspect = Civil Rights Issue.

White shoots black = Civil Rights Issue.

Black shoots black = Snitches get stitches!

Black shoots white = Justified - Just another normal day in the neighborhood. Don't say a damn thing or it's racist!

Black shoots cop = That cop must have done something to deserve it.



This is the norm. If you say ANYTHING against what I posted above, you are RACIST!

originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

If this young man was on parole, which it definitely sounds that way, he is not allowed to possess a gun.

Case closed in my opinion.

So you are in favor of limiting 2nd amendment rights? You are agreeing that the Government can take away a "god-given" rights enshrined in the bill of rights? What part of "Shall not be infringed" do you not understand?
/sarc

Crime = no freedom. Can't be free and behind bars at the same time.

a reply to: TheElectricPriest

Thank you for the kind words

Why do you think this hasn't garnered any national attention?

Somehow, I think you know what my answer is, and that we already agree...

Because the divide-and-conquerors can't make any hay with it. The kid does have a violent record, he did flee, and he did shoot (as evidenced by the wounded officer). There's no way this kid can be portrayed as innocent. They would have to actually address the protocols and laws and everything that made this situation possible, and actually address those factors, rather than play the racial sympathy card.

And, of course, the agitators don't really want solutions. They want to agitate. And the status quo gives them exactly that. Except this time. This situation just doesn't fit their needs.

Side note but not off topic. What would have happened if this kid grew up in a nuclear family and had a mother and father?

If you want to end racism, black groups need to come out and call out when black people act stupid and get killed by cops.

Judge everything by the content of the chcaracher and not the color of the skin. This kid sounds like he was a POS...

a reply to: Weagle

Ahhhh...I'm torn! You make excellent points. You see, this is why I was reticent to start this thread, because this is not only a touchy subject among others, but is also so inside of me! You're completely correct, if my child was killed I would want to know what happened. I guess the difference is, would I be holding a press conference about it? I don't think so. And so for me it reeks of this pandering to the press and a complete absolution of the young man, as if he was solely a victim here. This disturbs me because, whether I'm right or not, it gives the perception to me of an attitude that will only self-promulgate as the black community tries to alleviate itself of any sense of responsibility.

As I said, I find the whole thing to be tragic, and I'm certainly not waving the flag of the police can do no wrong (God forbid), but at some point even the mothers need to take responsibility. What is a world without responsibility?

Someone need to teach young black men that shooting at people is dangerous to their health.

Jesse?

a reply to: Boadicea

Ha! Well, I certainly didn't mean to set you up, and I certainly believed at the time that my question was not wholly rhetorical, but you're right, I did suspect what your answer would be and yes, we are in agreement. Hey, it's really nice to run into you today. Very level headed and eloquent...a good meet.

Both Miller and Lawson were involved in another shooting together in August 2017. According to police, 18-year-old London Tyrece Lane shot someone outside Nordstrom at the Frisco mall and Miller drove Lane and Lawson away from the scene, according to police at the time.

Link

Miller (shooter in OP) Lawson (driver in OP)

So these two have already been involved in a previous shooting.

originally posted by: FilthyUSMonkey

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

If this young man was on parole, which it definitely sounds that way, he is not allowed to possess a gun.

Case closed in my opinion.

So you are in favor of limiting 2nd amendment rights? You are agreeing that the Government can take away a "god-given" rights enshrined in the bill of rights? What part of "Shall not be infringed" do you not understand?
/sarc

Gawd, excellent point!

originally posted by: SocratesJohnson
Side note but not off topic. What would have happened if this kid grew up in a nuclear family and had a mother and father?

If you want to end racism, black groups need to come out and call out when black people act stupid and get killed by cops.

Judge everything by the content of the chcaracher and not the color of the skin. This kid sounds like he was a POS...

If you want a nuclear family you have to end poverty...

originally posted by: TheElectricPriest

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: TheElectricPriest

If this young man was on parole, which it definitely sounds that way, he is not allowed to possess a gun.

Case closed in my opinion.

I'm watching the news now and they were just talking about it. Apparently they have now released the body cam footage and, from what is being said he fired first. Really, however, the point of this OP was simply my surprise that there was all of this civil rights buzz around this shooting, lumping it in with so many of these senseless shootings of black men by police (which is real and is absolutely abhorrent, so let there be no mistake about my position on this particular topic). Seeing the mothers coming out as if their son was this great victim after shooting a cop is, to me, a sense of group think that abrogates any sense of responsibility, and is truly emblematic of an institutional mindset inside of that community that is revealing itself as ridiculous, invalidating honest and sincere incidents of police overreach and brutality, and moves the whole cause back a major step. Live by the gun, die by the gun. If you don't want to get shot by the police, don't shoot at them.

I think it’s less an abrogation of responsibility, and more an ideology that teaches or exaggerates how much police target black youth. This is broadcasted non stop by everything from colleges to CNN and Blm. It’s basically a liberal article of faith.

a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14

Yeah...good point, and also goes to why this is still just a local story. It doesn't fit the narrative and so hasn't gained any prominence.

a reply to: TheElectricPriest

My apologies -- I didn't feel set up at all. And I appreciate the question. It is an important question to ask, because it's at the root of why these shootings keep happening with no end in sight. And it is what it is because some folks want it that way and work very hard to make sure it stays that way. In fact, as much as I hate to say it, I think Black Lives Matter was designed to be an agitator -- not a solver -- and to take money, resources and attention away from those genuinely trying to make effective reforms and improvements.

For example, there is a man in Chicago, Rev Michael Pfleger, who has been fighting the drugs and violence in Chicago for decades, and he gets little to no national recognition or credit -- much less help!

Pfleger: Divide Between CPD And Community ‘Worse Than I’ve Ever Seen’

There is a group of predominantly women in Chicago who are doing their damnedest to stop the drugs and violence destroying their children's lives, who also get little to no national recognition or credit -- much less help!

We Are Reclaiming Chicago One Corner at a Time

But BLM shows up and gets massive media attention, massive donations, and massive federal (Obama) support. And all BLM does is agitate. No practical solutions offered.

At some point, it's impossible to brush off as incompetency. It can only be by design. "Ye shall know them by the fruits of their labor."