how drug testing situations really play out

originally posted by: Asktheanimals
Companies have no business telling employees what they may do or not do in their personal time. It's an invasion of privacy.

I don't know about that. It's in a companies interest that you're able to show up for work. If you're involved in illegal activity, you may go to jail. I see nothing wrong with companies wanting to avoid people who may not be able to reliably show up for work.

a reply to: Aazadan
People are getting sacked in states where MJ is legal so the 'it's the law' argument is moot.
I'm in general building/property maintenance, wouldn't have a guy on site for any job if THC testing was something we did.
Most people I know smoke pot.
...being stoned on the job is different to failing a THC test, massive difference.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: Aazadan
People are getting sacked in states where MJ is legal so the 'it's the law' argument is moot.
I'm in general building/property maintenance, wouldn't have a guy on site for any job if THC testing was something we did.
Most people I know smoke pot.
...being stoned on the job is different to failing a THC test, massive difference.

It gets very contextual. In anything where work is done for the federal government, the employees need to adhere to federal guidelines. Remember that weed is not legal under federal law in the US. In some states it has been decriminalized, but even then there will be employers who simply don't want to hire drug users for various reasons. And of course, in many states it is still criminal. And even then, we're talking about one specific substance. There are still many other substances to test for. So I think that rather than arguing against drug testing as a whole, if it's really weed that people have a problem with... then argue that weed testing shouldn't be part of a non accident related drug test. But, so far the only argument I'm seeing anyone really put forward is that smoking is extremely commonplace so we should simply tolerate it. Rather than any sort of benefit/harm analysis.

Also, behavior stipulations outside of work aren't that uncommon in the US. In certain professions an employee may even be put under morality clauses which stipulate things like not being allowed to go out and drink. Many teachers have lost their jobs due to appearing on Facebook photos where they've gone out and legally partied on the weekends.

a reply to: Aazadan

you keep talking about jobs for the federal government.

why?

a reply to: TinySickTears

Not sure how Tony carries fake piss around, the specimen cups have a temperature indicator strip along the side that has to be in a certain range, something impossible to fake if carried outside the body

originally posted by: TinySickTears
what do you say on this issue?

I say that i agree with you and i have a story to share. Not so long ago, my friend worked in a warehouse. He was a kind of a "backup employee" who was called in when needed. Then he got a chance of getting to be a regular worker with better paycheck.

Well there were drug testings to go through. And he just could not pee when a nurse is looking at him from the opening of a wall. The tests would have been ok, but he didn't get the job. He tried to explain about this "shy pee thing" to his boss and the boss only said "tell me straight and honest, do you get high on something?" I think that was uncalled for.

No fakin' drug tests of any kind where I work...aviation.

They don't mess around...at all! Urine, breath and blood.

Incident based 100%, scheduled and random.

Can't pee? Fine, they'll take blood instead. Don't like it? See ya!

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: TinySickTears

I say he'd fail my company's test. How can anyone be so incompetent to allow fake piss to be used.

Oh and what's a burner.

Well that's because fake urine cannot be distinguished from real urine, as it actually contains urea. Nobody would fail your company's test with a fake bag. People pass 21 panel drug tests with fake urine.

The only way to stop fake urine from working is to take saliva or hair samples, and you cannot do that legally because they come with DNA. A burner is someone who smokes weed. They "Burn" bro.

originally posted by: Abbby
a reply to: TinySickTears

Not sure how Tony carries fake piss around, the specimen cups have a temperature indicator strip along the side that has to be in a certain range, something impossible to fake if carried outside the body

Absolutely not. They come with warming packs that take 30 minutes to reach the appropriate temperature. If you forgo the warming pack, all you have to do is tuck it into your waste band and it will get to the correct temperature.

Super easy, has always worked for me.

Drug tests are dumb because they only cost 35$ to pass.

originally posted by: Flyingclaydisk
No fakin' drug tests of any kind where I work...aviation.

They don't mess around...at all! Urine, breath and blood.

Incident based 100%, scheduled and random.

Can't pee? Fine, they'll take blood instead. Don't like it? See ya!

Welp, that's not legal at all. An employer cannot take your blood, or anything that contains DNA. Piss doesn't contain DNA. Unless it's a government job, in which case, the rules are different.

Also, the only tests that will catch anyone are the incident based ones. Even randoms are easy to pass with the fake bag. A random isn't on the spot, it still has to be administered by a control, which gives you more than the 30 minutes to warm it to the right temp.

I bet all kinds of people are smoking trees where you work. Even NYPD smokes.

a reply to: SRPrime

They don't force you to submit to a blood test. You have a choice (three choices actually); a witnessed pee test, or blood test...or there's the door! If there's an incident involved, "the door" will lead to a unformed police officer who will take you into custody...and then they will get a Court Order.

Like I said; they don't mess around! (Oh, and you agree to all this, in writing, as part of your employment terms).

Zero tolerance. Zero.

You just slightly bump something in this business and you can do $30m in damage (or more). Leave something where it shouldn't be, or be in the wrong place at the wrong time and lots of people can die.

originally posted by: SRPrime

originally posted by: Abbby
a reply to: TinySickTears

Not sure how Tony carries fake piss around, the specimen cups have a temperature indicator strip along the side that has to be in a certain range, something impossible to fake if carried outside the body

Absolutely not. They come with warming packs that take 30 minutes to reach the appropriate temperature. If you forgo the warming pack, all you have to do is tuck it into your waste band and it will get to the correct temperature.

Super easy, has always worked for me.

Drug tests are dumb because they only cost 35$ to pass.

correct

thats why i said it is little more than an annoyance.

keeping in hand warmers gets old.

originally posted by: Flyingclaydisk
a reply to: SRPrime

They don't force you to submit to a blood test. You have a choice (three choices actually); a witnessed pee test, or blood test...or there's the door! If there's an incident involved, "the door" will lead to a unformed police officer who will take you into custody...and then they will get a Court Order.

Like I said; they don't mess around! (Oh, and you agree to all this, in writing, as part of your employment terms).

Zero tolerance. Zero.

You just slightly bump something in this business and you can do $30m in damage (or more). Leave something where it shouldn't be, or be in the wrong place at the wrong time and lots of people can die.

Similar rules where I work. I'm in software so it's not all that important in my job, but 90% of our companies employees are either building very expensive and very sensitive equipment, or running that equipment.

In addition to the usual drug screen when you're hired on, they do randoms. There are also incident based ones, any sort of incident at all that results in injury or lost time will get one for all involved parties, and the bar for these is very low. I've triggered one of these before actually. I was testing some virtual reality software I was working on, and my coworker came up behind me, I turned and moved my hand (with the headset on so I couldn't see him) and hit him in the mouth. Not serious damage to either of us, but we both had to do a drug test.

In addition to that, there are other rules. For example, you're not allowed to have any alcohol within 12 hours of the start of your next shift, and they'll even do things like check your social media to make sure you don't post any photos violating that.

Thought I'd make a reply because I'm now at a job that carries out urine test after an accident at work whether someone is injured or not.

I work in distribution we have fork trucks driving about 100s of people moving stuff about. I use to be a big time smoker I'm mid 30s and I had been smoking from about 19 years old I completely stopped at the start of this year as I was starting this new job and heard that they carried out drug testing. There was no test done prior to starting the job you were only tested if you were to damage something, have a bump in your fork truck or injure yourself or someone else. the tests they carry out are for dug use and alcohol abuse and I agree with it to a certain extent because I'd be pissed if someone injured me and they were steaming drunk because they enjoy drink too much and came into work still drunk. But that's down to were someone has consumed alcohol or drugs say within the last 12 hours

What I'm not happy is with, say if I were to have two weeks holiday and during the first week I decided to have a smoke or two. Say I went camping for a few days and enjoyed a smoke by the fire and a smoke out in the mountains etc. I might smoke for say 2 days out of those two weeks. After I go back to work I have an accident where I haven't caused injury to anyone but maybe misplaced a pallet in some racking and it's fallen through. I'd be sent off for a piss test. Piss test will show I had consumed MJ in the past few weeks and I'd be fired. Now that sucks. havjng an accident after a week of smoking MJ, the MJ would not of played any role in causing the accident but because it's in my system my work could fall back on that and say 'well you have drugs in you system you're at fault'

That's where I find urine tests stupid they can pick up on drugs or alcohol which you have consumed while being off work for a period of time but yet your employer could use that against you. I would however support tests that determine whether someone has consumed in the past 12 hours

Anyway I'm clean now and have been for almost a year so I don't have to worry, do I like it ? Yes and no. Do I miss smoking, yes I do. But considering I'm along in life where I could be potentially be driving a semi rig and trailer I think it's best to stay clean .. you know just in case. Who knows at some point I could end up doing a desk job and not have to worry about drug tests as I'd only have to worry about crashing a computer. But as I'll be driving a vehicle that could potentially kill I think it's best to stay clean and eliminate any possibility that could effect my driving

a reply to: TinySickTears

I failed a test once because of pot too. I told them I would fail for weed before I took it. I got the job.

Go figure.

originally posted by: TinySickTears

originally posted by: KansasGirl


Dude you probably should lay off the weed. You're slow.

you should probably get on some
kind of a dick

I'm not arguing there.

a reply to: snowspirit

It seems like they should be able to come up with some reasonable table that must correspond to how recemtly a person has smoked ("they" being any authorities who test for weed). Right? Shouldnt that be possible with today's technology? 😳.

originally posted by: generik

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: Carcharadon

originally posted by: KansasGirl
REPLY TO OP (why didn't it show which post I'm resoonding to? 😡):

I'm not one to talk from way high up on a horse, dude: I am an UBER alcoholic. I checked myself into the ER once- meaning I walked myself in and talked to the nurses and filled out my own paperwork, etc..and my BAC was .49. Yes, you read that correctly.

I drank on the job, once my alcoholism got out of control. I would put vodka in with some Gatorade so it looked like I just had Gatorade, but it was not just gatoroade. That was the only way I could get through the day without shaking so much that I couldn't hold anything, or without puking. The hardest thing, in the morning, was to get three or four shots of vodka down without puking it up. If I could keep it down, he shakes would stop in about 20 minutes and I wouldn't be in danger of puking with every move of my eyes.

If I had been tested at work, I would have blown over the limit, and yes, I drove myself to work. When I finally got some help and checked into Detox, I hadn't had a drink for over twelve hours and my BAC was .28. Keep in mind I hadn't had a drop in half a day, so imagine what my levels were when I was sipping my "Gatorade" at work. And here is the worst part: I was working WITH KIDS.

So, I am not on a high horse. I was the worst of the worst.

About the job thing: I lost my dream job because of my drinking. The situation I descobed so far, that was my SECOND rendezvous with being a drunk. Before that, I had been in my dream job- went to rehab, and when I "relapsed" a month later, I got fired. Was it maybe a tad unfair, since it usuly takes a person a year of starts and stops to get sober? Yeah, maybe it was a bit harsh, but it was their decision, and no one forced me to drink gallons of vodka every night by myself in my living room.

So: I know it sucks, but when we are the employees, we have to follow their rules. And honestly, having no THC in your system while at work, it's really not a bad rule.

I had to grow up that way, so I feel I can say I think you need to grow up in this area. Worst of the worst right here, man. I'm sure you've not been as irresponsible and immature as I was, but you probably could straighten up a little.

Stop talking about pot and THC as you are utterly clueless about. The only thing worse than a drunk is a drunk that thinks they know everything about pot and pot testing.

In other words zip it until you educate yourself.

What did I get wrong? Do they not test for THC levels? If that's thhe case, then please forgive me, and correct me. What did I get wrong? I thought that's what they test for, but I have no problem being corrected.

if they tested for levels of THC, then it would be a different story. but they are not testing to see if you are stoned while working at all. what they are testing and thus firing people over is whether they have used the drug at all, period, end of story. so it would have been like if you never drank before or while working, and were in fact stone cold sober at work, yet they tested you to see if you drank at all, and fired you because you drank after work. and as mentioned marijuana will show a positive weeks after being exposed to it. so if you were say at a New Years party where some people were smoking up inside for example. and you of course breathed some in. then you got hit with a random drug test on Feb 1, you would still likely show up as positive for using marijuana, and thus loose your job.

So they DO test for THC. Which is all I said, and which is what you so rudely and immaturely accused me of "thinking I know everything about pot and pot testing" for. Your reading comprehension and logic skills need brushing up on. Can't wait to see your sweet response to this one!

About breathing in some air around people who are smoking weed: really, if you were around some (dopey) smokers on New Year's, would you really still have traceable amounts of it in your system an entire month later? From breathing the air at a party with potheads?

Also: I think you meant to say you would LOSE your job, not "loose" it. You can't "loose" a job.

originally posted by: TinySickTears

originally posted by: SRPrime

originally posted by: Abbby
a reply to: TinySickTears

Not sure how Tony carries fake piss around, the specimen cups have a temperature indicator strip along the side that has to be in a certain range, something impossible to fake if carried outside the body

Absolutely not. They come with warming packs that take 30 minutes to reach the appropriate temperature. If you forgo the warming pack, all you have to do is tuck it into your waste band and it will get to the correct temperature.

Super easy, has always worked for me.

Drug tests are dumb because they only cost 35$ to pass.

correct

thats why i said it is little more than an annoyance.

keeping in hand warmers gets old.

Do you have kids? Please say you don't.