Street Robbery

I live in London.

Three of my friends and i went to a party in Clapham Junction (winstanly estate).

It was ment to be full of chicks in shool uniforms!

Anyway, it was #, and anyone that lives around these ends knows that these estates are unsafe.

One of my friends was a girl and two were blokes, when we left the block, we were followed and surrounded by 12-15 kids from the block. They played the usual ruitine of trying to lull us into a false sense of security, and then seperating us, and starting fights with each of us individually.

I got beaten pretty bad, but my friend had his head gashed open with a bottle, and his phone stolen, i also had �20 stolen out of my pocket.

The boys ran back into the block, they will never be caught, *ucking bastards.

In the UK, we have no legal protection against criminals (firearms). If we had had a firearm, we would not have been harmed and would have have kept our items.

i was mugged by a gangbanger with a gun last year... so i know how you feel...

the dude jammed the gun into the back of my head when i was walking home from work.

I got a pencil. It's the best pencil ever invented.

It's like a regular pencil, but when you remove the eraser there's an inch blade under it. I have the entire kit at home.

When I run out of erasers, I replace it.

When I run out of lead, I unscrew what's left and grab a new 'clip' and screw it back on and it's a whole new pencil again.

Everyone who knows me knows me for one thing. I always have that pencil over my ear. I use it for school, writing, and everything else you'd use a pencil for.

It's my own very special pencil, I don't know what I'd do without it.



[Edited on 7-6-2003 by Illmatic67]

Interesting, the second post answered the first one inadvertantly.

If you had guns, you would just get held up / killed / assulted by people with guns , or with bigger guns that you own.

To think that you would have the gun, and your attackers wouldn't is niave...

[Edited on 6-7-2003 by Netchicken]

Originally posted by Peace
I live in London.

Three of my friends and i went to a party in Clapham Junction (winstanly estate).

It was ment to be full of chicks in shool uniforms!

Anyway, it was #, and anyone that lives around these ends knows that these estates are unsafe.

One of my friends was a girl and two were blokes, when we left the block, we were followed and surrounded by 12-15 kids from the block. They played the usual ruitine of trying to lull us into a false sense of security, and then seperating us, and starting fights with each of us individually.

I got beaten pretty bad, but my friend had his head gashed open with a bottle, and his phone stolen, i also had �20 stolen out of my pocket.

The boys ran back into the block, they will never be caught, *ucking bastards.

In the UK, we have no legal protection against criminals (firearms). If we had had a firearm, we would not have been harmed and would have have kept our items.

I believe you are one of the few Brits who understand this idea... Cops are wonderful... but they are there simply to clean up the mess afterward. Cops hardly EVER actually prevent an attack. Indeed, in the US, it has been ruled by the Supreme Court that police have NO OBLIGATION to protect the lives of civilians, just catch crooks.

I have not only been mugged, I have survived 2 attempted homicides. I live in a "shall issue" state for CCW permits. I carry this little guy




And he keeps me and my family safe.

Originally posted by Netchicken
Interesting, the second post answered the first one inadvertantly.

If you had guns, you would just get held up / kille / assulted by people with gun , or with bigger guns that you own.

To think that you would have the gun, and your attackers wouldn't is niave...

Correction, to think that you are better off when your attackers are armed and you are not is VERY niave...

Keep in mind, criminals are cowards. They will only strike when the odds are in thier favor. Even if firearms are denied to them, they will strike in superior numbers, or in terrain that favors surprise attack, ect. I know, I survived a home invasion of 4 unarmed men one night, thanks to what you see above.

I've never gotton mugged, and I hope I never get mugged, Cuz I'll need that 5 bucks for a soda and some chips later. If I get mugged I'll have to miss out on those tasty treats.

DR thats not what I meant.

The person who got mugged basically said they would have been safe if they carried a gun. My response is that the people who attack them would just carry a BIGGER gun, or more guns, or shoot first and rob later.

There is no more safety in everyone having guns than no one having guns. You can see that in American crime statistics.

Its just a different paradigm that you buy into.

Originally posted by dragonrider

Correction, to think that you are better off when your attackers are armed and you are not is VERY niave...

NC, actually your assessment of American crime statistics are incorrect. It is a long standing fact that the US cities with the strictest gun control (NYC, Chicago, LA, Washington DC) have the highest crime rates. Those that allow concealed carry of handguns have the lowest rates of crime.

During the first year that Florida allowed CCW permits, the rate for rape fell over 30%.

Criminals are not going to go searching for bigger guns, because they have had them all along. Indeed, gun control only guarantees that criminals will be the only ones to have guns, as the law abiding citizens will have turned thier in.

However, in a society where people go armed, the criminals are very nervous... as they dont know who to pick to take down, because little granny over there might have a .357 snubnose in her purse.

Also, one little fact that people overlook is that in armed crime, criminals are very unimpressed with cops... all they have to do is throw thier gun down and the cops have to arrest them, and they know within days they will be on the street again. Armed citizens are a different story... in an armed confrontation, the bad guy is much less likely to survive.

if you are caught with a firearm in the UK, you go straight to jail, f]c?k that, i don't wanna go to jail.

i want police patroling the areas where the criminals operate, not walking around trafalgar square talking to tourists!

I've been mugged 3 times, every time the person had a tool. I'm only 19.

You just have to stay away from certain areas, but things are getting a bit better here.

i want police patroling the areas where the criminals operate, not walking around trafalgar square talking to tourists! Posted by Peace

That would help, but as mentioned above, cops are still there to pick up the pieces afterward. Besides, the bad guys will always find ways to be around when cops arent.

I know its illegal to have a gun in England (doesnt seem to stop the bad guys though, does it?), so my first response would be to move to a country where you CAN own a gun. If not, what about other things like ASP batons, pepper spray, stun guns, ect?

Some non-lethal/less-than-lethal self defence alternatives

Sorry to hear of your misfortune. In situatuations like this even a small electronic camera flash can blind someone long enough to get in a good hit or two, or make a getaway.

Doubt moving to a country that allows carrying of firearms is gonna make your butt any safer...

...heck...here in NZ I think we might get one driveby A YEAR...across the whole country.

I have not heard of one schoolyard being shot up...ever.

Shootings in workplaces by disgruntled employees, umm, haven't heard of one of them for quite some years as well.



Peace,
ALIEN

Sorry to here that. I would carry a tazer or some hard stick with me, or try Ill67's pencil idea.

So far I was only inone attempted mugging. I was walking home from school and some punk druggie kid pushed me to the ground and punched me in my head. Luckily I have a good tolerance for pain, and I do have that slight anger thing....Anyway I managed to overpower him by kicking him in the stomach,than I stop up and threw him into a fence. That was the last time I was harrassed by him. Good thing I listend to my mother "If some bastard at school every tried to hurt you, punch him back."

Anyway, if you lived in the USA I would carry a small handgun or some weapon with you. Especialy if you go to NY City.

Try buying a tazer though, or peper spray.

I myself have been attack (least said the better?) but i think that if you want to carry guns knives etc I wouldnt blame anyone in the least.

But

Carrying them is 1 thing, knowing how to use/handle them properly is another!

Guns in the wrong hands could be leathal!



blackwidow

East European gunrunners boost UK gang weaponry

Jeevan Vasagar
Wednesday July 2, 2003
The Guardian

Criminals in Britain are taking advantage of gunrunning from eastern Europe to obtain heavier firearms, according to research published yesterday.
Police suspect that more potent weapons are arriving largely from the Czech Republic and the former Soviet Union, according to the Small Arms Survey 2003.

The Europe-wide report, produced by independent Geneva-based researchers, cites the discovery of a mortar and heavy machine gun by the Metropolitan police in 2001 and warns of a trend towards greater firepower in criminal hands.

"Instead of less capable revolvers, [criminals] increasingly have fully automatic pistols. Instead of hunting weapons, police are more commonly recovering sub-machine guns. Even larger weapons appear irregularly."

www.guardian.co.uk...

Articles from "The Armed Citizen" (just a few, there are thousands of them)

The Cherokee Scout, Murphy, NC, 02/26/03
State: NC
American Rifleman Issue: June, 2003
Tammy Clinger, of Murphy, N.C., had just returned home from dropping her son at school when she heard a knock at her front door. She and her husband, Brett, opened the door and found a strange man standing on their doorstep claiming to be looking for his sister. The man tried to enter their home, but the Clingers refused him entrance. Earlier in the day, Tammy had been stopped by a North Carolina State Highway Patrol officer who checked her vehicle for a fugitive on the run. She realized the man at her door might be the outlaw they were searching for and had her husband get his gun while she distracted the man. Brett Clinger armed himself with a handgun, went out another door and snuck up on the man who was later identified by authorities as fugitive William Thomas Hewlett. Clinger ordered Hewlett to get into his truck and detained him until a North Carolina state trooper arrived to take the fugitive back into custody.

Journal Star, Peoria, IL, 03/12/03
State: IL
American Rifleman Issue: June, 2003
The day after he was released from prison, where he served time for domestic battery against Charolette Gates, Christopher Winder broke into Gates' home. A fight broke out, and Gates reached for a handgun to defend herself. Gates shot Winder once in the chest. Police discovered Winder collapsed in a neighbor's back yard, and he was later pronounced dead at the scene. No charges were expected to be filed against Gates, according to Peoria County State's Attorney Kevin Lyons. "Your home is your sanctuary, and if an intruder breaks in and gets killed, then too bad for the intruder," Lyons said. "I am not going to victimize her yet again because a recently released felon decided to invade the quiet world of her home."

Los Angeles Times, Los Angeles, CA, 02/27/03
State: CA
American Rifleman Issue: June, 2003
Vanessa Perrigoue had just taken her 4-year-old terrier, Ethan, out for a morning walk in their Laguna Niguel neighborhood when two large dogs jumped the smaller dog. Perrigoue screamed and attempted to rescue Ethan, but the dogs, a pit bull mix and Labrador mix, continued their vicious attack. Upon hearing his wife's screams, Joseph Perrigoue grabbed his .45-cal. handgun and went to her aid. The Perrigoues' dog, Ethan, had been killed and his attackers had run off. Perrigoue followed the dogs' bloody tracks back to a nearby apartment. When he knocked on the door, both dogs jumped out an open window and attacked him. Perrigoue defended himself, shooting both dogs. Animal-control officers took the wounded dogs away and attempted to contact their owner, whom neighbors said had been out of town for several days.

Arkansas Democrat Gazette, Little Rock, AR, 02/18/03
State: AR
American Rifleman Issue: May, 2003
Charles Leon Downen, owner of Downen Oil Co., was in his business office one morning with his grandson (and employee), Charles Randall Downen, when two men entered and asked to use the restroom. When the men returned, one grabbed the elder Downen, put a gun to his head and said, "This is a robbery." The business owner struggled with the attacker, later identified as Troy Williams, to gain control of the gun. It went off, striking Williams. His accomplice, Phillip Williams, then ran from the store with Downen's grandson chasing after him with a .45-cal. handgun. Sergeant Alan Quattlebaum of the police department's homicide division reported that Phillip Williams "had a rifle down the leg of his pants." Phillip Williams and the younger Downen exchanged fire in the parking lot. When police arrived, Downen's grandson was holding Phillip Williams at gunpoint on the ground. Both suspects were pronounced dead. The Downens were unharmed in the incident.

The Sacramento Bee, Sacramento, CA, 03/05/03
State: CA
American Rifleman Issue: May, 2003
Chad Lewis answered a knock at the door of his Sacramento County, Calif., home late one night and was attacked by a frightening figure. The home invader, wearing a ski mask and armed with a metal pipe, struck Lewis repeatedly on the upper body and head. Lewis' roommate was recovering from knee surgery and could not physically assist him, but managed to call 9-1-1 and get hold of his rifle, as he feared Lewis would be killed in the attack. Meanwhile, Lewis broke free from his assailant and retrieved a handgun from his bedroom. A struggle ensued over the gun, but Lewis was finally able to pull free and shoot his attacker. When authorities arrived, both Lewis and the intruder were taken to the hospital. Lewis' condition was serious, and his attacker was in critical condition with a gunshot wound to the head.

News-Sentinel, Knoxville, TN, 02/23/03
State: TN
American Rifleman Issue: May, 2003
A man armed with a knife approached Wanda Petty in the Merita Bread Bakery Outlet and demanded money from the business owner. Petty's husband, James, was working in a back room when the commotion started. When the would-be bandit heard James Petty in the store, he ran toward him. Petty then shot the suspect twice with his handgun. The suspect, Larry Thomas Young, was charged with attempted aggravated robbery, aggravated assault and violation of parole.

Tulsa World, Tulsa, OK, 01/26/03
State: OK
American Rifleman Issue: April, 2003
A "good Samaritan" came to the rescue of a woman who was the apparent victim of a sexual assault in downtown Tulsa, Okla. The man was surveying possible construction sites in the area when he saw two partially disrobed people struggling in an alleyway. When the woman screamed for help, the man ran to assist her. The suspect then jumped into his vehicle, a Ford Taurus, and tried to hit his victim with the car. The Samaritan responded by drawing a .40-cal. handgun and firing several shots at the woman's assailant, who was killed. Sergeant Mike Huff said the woman tried to get a ride home from her attacker, when the man pulled into the alley and attempted to assault her. Referring to the woman's rescuer, Huff said, "It appears that this man really interrupted a bad situation."

Kingsport Times-News, Kingsport, TN, 01/20/03
State: TN
American Rifleman Issue: April, 2003
A masked man armed with knives approached a pharmacist and demanded narcotics, but the pharmacist dispensed lead instead. The suspect entered Marcum's Pharmacy in Kingsport, Tenn., at 2:10 p.m. and approached pharmacy owner Carl Marcum, demanding the narcotic drugs OxyContin and Percocet. Marcum pulled his .38-cal. handgun and shot the suspect, who fled out the back door and drove off in a Buick. Police notified local hospitals to be on the lookout for a man suffering from a gunshot wound. Two hours later the suspect, Jeffery Jessee, was arrested at a local hospital, where he was treated and released. Jessee was charged with aggravated robbery.

The Birmingham News, Birmingham, AL, 12/19/02
State: AL
American Rifleman Issue: March, 2003
Marine Corps Sgt. James Lowery was on leave in his hometown of Gardendale, Ala., at the end of an eventful year. Lowery had started the year by marrying his sweetheart, April Leigh Fitzgerald, and soon after he spent two months in Afghanistan. Now he was home enjoying the holidays with family and had stopped at the drive-in window of the local McDonalds for a quick bite. That's when a man with a .38-cal. handgun ordered him out of his customized Chevy Suburban. Lowery complied and got out of his SUV, but the man then shot the Marine in the face. Lowery reached back into his vehicle, drew a .45-cal. pistol and shot his assailant several times. The robber, Thaddeus Antone, was pronounced dead at the scene. Lowery was listed in fair condition at a local hospital.

Desert Dispatch, Barstow, CA, 12/26/02
State: CA
American Rifleman Issue: March, 2003
A Lenwood, Calif., man shot one of two men who broke into his home early Christmas morning. The 66-year-old man called 9-1-1 at 12:20 a.m. to notify authorities that two men had just broken into his home. He said he had shot at the men, and one had escaped on foot. Police investigating the scene discovered a Barstow man, dead from a gunshot wound to the head, dressed in dark clothing and armed with a handgun. Further investigation revealed the deceased and an accomplice had forced their way into the home to commit burglary.


www.nraila.org...

NYC is soft. It's not like it used to be. I'm originally from New York (Queens) so I hate when people today try to say NYC is still bad. It's not bad. Bad NYC? Try the late 80's, early 90's. That's when NYC was the WORST. Not anymore since Guliani sent everyone up creek.

Miami by far is the worst city in USA.

Originally posted by Illmatic67
NYC is soft. It's not like it used to be. I'm originally from New York (Queens) so I hate when people today try to say NYC is still bad. It's not bad. Bad NYC? Try the late 80's, early 90's. That's when NYC was the WORST. Not anymore since Guliani sent everyone up creek.

Miami by far is the worst city in USA.

Havent spent any time in Houston Texas have you?