When Physics gets Spooky!

Take a look at the following picture. At first it doesn't seem like much, a simple magnet floating above another apparent magnet held in stasis by the opposing magnetic fields, right? But wait...



That's not what's actually going on here. The black object is indeed a magnet, but the object it's floating above is actually a high temperature superconductor cooled with liquid nitrogen. Perpetual electric current in the superconductor creates a field which excludes the magnetic field of the magnet. It's not a new concept, the Meissner Effect; it was discovered in 1933.

Superconductivity Link

However, when we couple the notion of a superconductor with the notion of a superfluid there are some pretty mind boggling implications.

Now, if we consider that up to 30% of the mass of the planet Jupiter is comprised of Metallic Hydrogen, a superfluid, and scientific research is advancing in the areas of high temperature superconductors (i.e. room temperature), well, WOW! So, we don't really understand what we're looking at exactly. There are things going on which we can cause to occur, but we don't understand fully why.

Now go back and look at the picture again for a moment.

It is both breathtaking and mind blowing in the same moment.

Perhaps even a bit...Spooky.

In some respects, if you stare at that picture long enough, you can almost begin to envision a relationship between electromagnetism and gravity, the Holy Grail of Physics.

...and perhaps even catch a glimpse of God in the process.

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

A lot of our members think the electric universe theory is B.S. yet every few months there are papers pointing out how that is exactly how certain aspects of the universe work. Everyone always wants one simple answer to everything when in actuality the real world or the universe does not work that way IMO..

Spooky action at a distance is far more spooky to me .

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Yes, Jupiter has a very strong and complex magnetic field.
www.space.com...

But afaik there is no evidence pointing to superconductivity. Metallic-hydrogen is a conductor. That alone is enough to create a planetary dynamo. You also have to consider that Jupiter core is pretty hot, estimated 35,000 degrees Celsius (it is almost a star after all).

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

That is really cool man!

The first thing I thought of was how can this be applied to future space travel? As in possibly a way to keep astronauts safe from cosmic radiation during travel and colonization.

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Well anytime you have a moving current you should get an oscillating magnetic field, even if a weak one, and if the polarity is reversed it should have the same effect you described above.

Now a superfluid isn't exactly room temperature. Generally Bose-Einstein condensates are supercooled. But imagine running an ac current through a superconductor like this...What would that magnetic field look like? What would be its intensity?

This is weird. Our only sample of metallic hydrogen was lost in a laboratory mishap in 2017.

We can create ideal models using math and simulations, but we won't know what this will look like until we have a better sample.

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk
There is nothing spooky about this. The Meissner effect has been known to physicists for 85 years.
The word "spooky" is legitimate only for circumstances where the behaviour of the phenomenon appears to violate the laws of physics. This doesn't.
The Higgs field permeating all space is a Type 2 superconductor. Gluon flux lines between quarks are expelled by the superconducting Higgs superfluid and squeezed into quantised flux tubes that extend between quarks, confining them permanently so-called "asymptotic freedom"). This is the non-abelian counterpart of what Meissner discovered for the abelian electromagnetic field (the U(1) piece of the electro-weak symmetry group U(1)xSU(2) unifying weak and electromagnetic forces).
The same mechanism confines the particles that make up dark matter. This is the E8-singlet state of the E8xE8' heterotic superstring. The Higgs field has a counterpart (not yet detected because it couples only gravitationally to E8'-singlet superstrings) whose coupling to dark matter particles contributes to their mass.
What happens when the Higgs field in either sector is made a normal conductor of colour flux, allowing it to pass through it instead of expelling it everywhere? The quarks fly apart when their string bonds (vortices in the Higgs superfluid) disappear and they become free (or, rather, unconfined - they still interact by long-range forces). Discover a way of heating up the Higgs field in its ground state until it reaches its critical temperature for a superconductor without turning all ambient matter into charcoal and you could turn an object into a cold plasma. It achieves the effect of a hydrogen bomb without all the collateral damage...

originally posted by: Quadlink
Spooky action at a distance is far more spooky to me .

The speed of reality is always faster than our ability to measure it. It's almost like there's someone watching what we are doing and making sure we never fully understand how reality works. It just seems reality always turns out to be so much stranger than anything we could have ever imagined. And there exists a force in the Universe that keeps our full understanding of reality and nature's behaviors just one step beyond our full comprehension.

It's not only spooky action at a distance. It's spooky action in our minds as well.

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Now if only we could mass produce a superconductor that functions at room temperature the future may be very bright indeed.

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

I wonder what the purpose is of wrapping the magnet with electrical tape? Is that what prevents lateral movement? Cause normally magnets do not hover in place...it would fall away to one side.

Or is the tape being used to connect Two disc shaped magnets together? I almost see a crease in the middle where it looks like an Oreo shape with one disc sitting on top of another.

a reply to: andy06shake

Cars would get 500 mpg!

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Very, very cool.

For anyone who hasn't seen this, it's a ridiculously cool video showing some examples of a similar process that'll blow your mind.

a reply to: dfnj2015

They may even fly.

If they ever get the AI fully functional.

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Great read FCD

Didn't know you were interested in physics, I am to a degree but lack a lot of understanding of the core concepts involved. I always found the results of various experiments and especially relativity and the study of what time is and how it works to be interesting and also dumbfounding.... and when you start to consider the implications these results have on the world around us and maybe even our reality... it is unsettling

Thanks for such a fascinating post.

superfluidity and superconductors are another area of research I semi-actively keep up with (mostly through phys.org and arxiv)

Sure you are familiar with this, but here is a good resource for anyone else that enjoys staying up to date on all sorts of sciences: arxiv.org...

a reply to: micpsi

I have questions.

"The Higgs field permeating all space is a Type 2 superconductor."
How do we know that to be factual? What proof do we have that the Higgs field indeed permeates all space, and not just the areas where we have measured it or it's effects?

I like the next sentence about the Gluon flux lines between quarks working as quantised positioning constrainers. We'll let this pass as is, it makes good sense.

Ok, so the next part: "This is the non-abelian counterpart of what Meissner discovered for the abelian electromagnetic field (the U(1) piece of the electro-weak symmetry group U(1)xSU(2) unifying weak and electromagnetic forces). "

Are you saying that Meissner's discovery is such that any true super conductor may behave in this way, relative to weak forces and/or electromagnetic forces from non-super conductors?

Is there an implication here, that this goes beyond EMF and can be applied relative to other fundamental forces? It seems like you're implying this type of action should be possible with some form of matter and gravity, independent of EMF. Like, you're implying an EMF independent anti-gravity interaction being a possibility, are you not?

Not to discredit any of the rest of your post, but I don't openly address any suppositions relating to dark energy nor dark matter interactions. If dark matter and dark energy are real, I'll go to dark matter/dark energy hell for not being a believer, I guess.

The gist of your dark matter section is that, mathematically, you are applying the same logic of what Meissner found. To a calculated relationship, we assume exists for dark matter relative to the Higgs field.

My understanding is you're essentially subbing in the Higgs field for the superconductor, because it should be the same.
How do we really know that?

originally posted by: projectvxn
a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Well anytime you have a moving current you should get an oscillating magnetic field, even if a weak one, and if the polarity is reversed it should have the same effect you described above.

Now a superfluid isn't exactly room temperature. Generally Bose-Einstein condensates are supercooled. But imagine running an ac current through a superconductor like this...What would that magnetic field look like? What would be its intensity?

This is weird. Our only sample of metallic hydrogen was lost in a laboratory mishap in 2017.

We can create ideal models using math and simulations, but we won't know what this will look like until we have a better sample.

Not to mention the fact that their metallic hydrogen sample either isn't REALLY metallic hydrogen OR they have some fundamental misunderstandings of it's properties. As can be highlighted from this single sentence in the article:
"nearly 20 times the pressure initially predicted"

It took 20 times their initial calculation, pressure wise. To me, this indicates that there is something they inherently do not understand, or they did not actually create their predicted matter-form, but created something else entirely.


Furthermore this accident:
"they used the low-powered red laser to measure the pressure of the system once more.

But this time, the energy from the laser immediately destroyed the system, and caused one of the diamonds to disintegrate.

"As soon as we turned the light on, 'click', the diamonds broke. One of them catastrophically, it just became powder," explained Silvera."


So... a low powered red laser turned a diamond to dust.
Riiiiiiiiight, so they don't know wtf they made, but whatever it was, a red laser juiced enough energy in the system to powderize a diamond.
:|

a reply to: Archivalist

It would seem there may be things going on which we do not even begin to comprehend yet, yes?

Hence my OP.

originally posted by: Flyingclaydisk
a reply to: Archivalist

It would seem there may be things going on which we do not even begin to comprehend yet, yes?

Hence my OP.

Absolutely yes there's stuff beyond our comprehension. When you start talking about string theory multiple dimensions and particles that blink in and out of existence. It's truly bizarre stuff. The universe itself is mind bending. It's like being a sea snail in the ocean with no concept of the rest of the world. Science is advancing fast though. I remember astronomy before we put Hubble into space. We knew even less just a few decades ago. Our understand in quantum physics has come a long way since then too.

originally posted by: Archivalist

originally posted by: projectvxn
a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Well anytime you have a moving current you should get an oscillating magnetic field, even if a weak one, and if the polarity is reversed it should have the same effect you described above.

Now a superfluid isn't exactly room temperature. Generally Bose-Einstein condensates are supercooled. But imagine running an ac current through a superconductor like this...What would that magnetic field look like? What would be its intensity?

This is weird. Our only sample of metallic hydrogen was lost in a laboratory mishap in 2017.

We can create ideal models using math and simulations, but we won't know what this will look like until we have a better sample.

Not to mention the fact that their metallic hydrogen sample either isn't REALLY metallic hydrogen OR they have some fundamental misunderstandings of it's properties. As can be highlighted from this single sentence in the article:
"nearly 20 times the pressure initially predicted"

It took 20 times their initial calculation, pressure wise. To me, this indicates that there is something they inherently do not understand, or they did not actually create their predicted matter-form, but created something else entirely.


Furthermore this accident:
"they used the low-powered red laser to measure the pressure of the system once more.

But this time, the energy from the laser immediately destroyed the system, and caused one of the diamonds to disintegrate.

"As soon as we turned the light on, 'click', the diamonds broke. One of them catastrophically, it just became powder," explained Silvera."


So... a low powered red laser turned a diamond to dust.
Riiiiiiiiight, so they don't know wtf they made, but whatever it was, a red laser juiced enough energy in the system to powderize a diamond.
:|

Now I'm sure the red laser did not cause the diamond to turn to dust. The reason is simple with the pressures involved any release of pressure will cause the molecules in the diamond to expand rapidly. Basically, the diamond would explode in a cloud of dust. To get metallic hydrogen they used 495 gigapascals (71.7 million pounds-per-square inch) even a diamond under that pressure has to be flawless by the way will want to explode the moment the pressure is released. Imagine the pressure built up in the diamond.

So the exploding diamond was likely caused by a pressure release and not adding energy to the system. As for it being metallic Hydrogen, there was nothing else it could be. It started as hydrogen was put under pressure and gained metallic properties.