who would you say the best heavyweight boxer of all time is or was?

a reply to: TinySickTears

I’m definitely biased in my affection for a pre-prison sentence Mike Tyson’s ability to end any fight by the 3rd round. My dad was friends with Bobby Stewart who trained Tyson as a kid and I went to school with Bobby’s kids so it’s kind of a home town thing. In the late 80’s he was an imposing MoFo but the nicest guy in the world. At least to a 14-15 year old kid who was scared out of his wits. It’s a toss up though because I think Ali would’ve got under his skin and inside Mikes head weeks before the fight and watching Ali was watching a master strategist. He could’ve been a chess grand champion the way he worked his opponents. Tough call for sure.

Ali is the best.
Doesn't mean he beats everyone, every time..
There is a couple year span where Mike Tyson would have beaten anyone, but that fell apart after his handler, aka trainer Cus D'Amato died.

People tend to forget too, that we may not have ever even seen the 'real' prime Ali, as he lost close to four years after refusing to go to Nam. I think he was around 25 or 26 when he was suspended for the four years.

Ali= Greatest
Both guys would run through the best the HW division has had to offer over the past 10 years at least.
(With the exception of the Tyson Fury that beat Klitchko and the version of him we saw last Saturday)

Tom Cribb. Bare knuckle champ for 13 years, 1809-1822. You know,back in the good old days of 50 round fights! Considered one of the best of all time, at any weight.

a reply to: TinySickTears

Tyson hands down. He was a once in a generation fighter.

Just watch all his fights and you can see just how good he is.

originally posted by: abe froman
In their prime Tyson would have murdered Ali

... and then eaten his children.

Pfft. Tyson wouldn't have been able to hurt Ali. He was hit by some of the heaviest punchers ever. Think Ernie Shavers. Hollyfield was Ali lite and he crushed Tyson. Ali for the win. Unless Sugar Ray Leonard put on 50 lbs and fought at the heavyweight level.

a reply to: intrepid

All are very valid points. I think it’s important to note though that there’s a huge difference in Tyson’s abilities in the ring before D’Amato passed away and after Tyson’s stint in prison and the defeat by Holyfield was post prison. I think it does a disservice to the man to ignore his early accomplishments. Youngest person to hold a heavyweight
Title at 20, first person to unify all 3 heavyweight titles at, I think, 21. And managed to regain 2 of 3 titles after prison which puts him up there with greats like Ali, Patterson, Holyfield and Foreman in regaining a heavyweight title after losing it. Greatest ever may be a rather subjective opinion but the man was a monster when he had his s# together.

a reply to: peter vlar

Take away the fact he had studied Ali all his life and would have known Ali's moves then that is the correct assumption Ali would have beaten him BUT add to the fact that he had studied Ali and knew his moves and it become's a bit more grey there, I actually would not like to bet a lot on either player in that fight.
Ali was by far the better boxer but Tyson was like the Looney Tunes Tasmanian Devil.
ha you could say like Bug's vs Tas

a reply to: LABTECH767

I can’t really argue with any of the logic in your statement. Ali was definitely much more disciplined and the Tasmanian devil analogy for Tyson is pretty spot on. Especially between ‘86 and ‘92 when he had 12 knockouts in the first round.

Tyson was an outright brute. He put straight fear into his opponents. I remember watching Tyson fights and the big question was always will the opponent make it one round or two. No, he wasn't as graceful or had the personality of Ali.

Tyson had just one job... to knock your ass out. Tyson was a basically a street fighter with a little bit of boxing skills imho.

Chuck Wepner.

"Smokin' Joe Frazier had it all , for me he was the best heavyweight of all time.

a reply to: Illumimasontruth

Probably not. We're talking Tyson while his first trainer was still alive. He was an unflappable unstoppable monster.

It was only after the trainer died that Tyson started getting messed in the head and losing.

Jaden

originally posted by: Flavian
Tom Cribb. Bare knuckle champ for 13 years, 1809-1822. You know,back in the good old days of 50 round fights! Considered one of the best of all time, at any weight.

i doubt it

maybe for back then

those were high level guys back then but they would not be high level in the modern world

back in the days where there was no head movement and they just stood in front of each other

a reply to: TinySickTears

If fighting now, he would have modern fitness levels. And techniques.

Frankly they were all much tougher back then, simply because all aspects of life were so much tougher.

originally posted by: Flavian
a reply to: TinySickTears

If fighting now, he would have modern fitness levels. And techniques.

Frankly they were all much tougher back then, simply because all aspects of life were so much tougher.

but is isnt.
so there is that

he fought back then when they fought as i said

he would not be high level today

a reply to: TinySickTears

If he was a Bare knuckle champ for 13 years he must have had a jaw of granite , I agree with Flavian with today's techniques he would probably have ruled , perhaps even without.

originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: TinySickTears

If he was a Bare knuckle champ for 13 years he must have had a jaw of granite , I agree with Flavian with today's techniques he would probably have ruled , perhaps even without.

i doubt it

people that fought like this would not be high level today.



but youre saying that if he fought like this today he might be successful?

come on man


there is a reason these fights went 35 rounds
50 rounds
60 rounds

sure they could take a punch and sure they were strong

they were not attacking the body
there was no head movement

it was basically circle circle circle and then one guys punches the other guy punches

far more shots thrown and landed in a modern 12 round fight today than a 30 round right then

basically a different sport


not just boxing but we can apply that logic to any other sport

I'd have to say Ali is the greatest. Sure, he'd have his hands full with a prime Mike Tyson. Maybe Tyson could beat him. But Foreman beats Tyson and Ali beat Foremen. Lennox Lewis beats Tyson. Maybe even Vitali Klitscho beats Tyson. Holyfield beats Tyson. I'd have to rank Lewis and Holyfield over Tyson.

Frank Bruno... no doubt about it.

His speed, quick feet, endurance, rock solid chin and big punch were unmatched.