Is it time to make the needed corrections about - ERR-atics?

originally posted by: Barcs

originally posted by: visitedbythem
The remains reported by the SDA guy is not the Ark. It is whole, and in a mountain of ice. I know it shakes your world, because it screams " Everything you know is wrong.

A boat in a mountain does not change a thing. We already know there were local floods when the last ice age was ending, and possibly others a bit later as well. But yeah, get back to me when there is actual research about it rather than conjecture and hearsay.

I threw those pearls out before you. Be what you want.

originally posted by: visitedbythem

originally posted by: Barcs

originally posted by: visitedbythem
The remains reported by the SDA guy is not the Ark. It is whole, and in a mountain of ice. I know it shakes your world, because it screams " Everything you know is wrong.

A boat in a mountain does not change a thing. We already know there were local floods when the last ice age was ending, and possibly others a bit later as well. But yeah, get back to me when there is actual research about it rather than conjecture and hearsay.

I threw those pearls out before you. Be what you want.

Yeah, that's the goal. I generally use scrutiny when people make claims or say something they claim will shake my world whilst offering no actual evidence.

originally posted by: Barcs

Yeah, that's the goal. I generally use scrutiny when people make claims or say something they claim will shake my world whilst offering no actual evidence.

Dude chilllllllll. The Hebrews, The Chinese, The Incas, The Sumerians, The Greeks, The Hindus, etc, etc, etc all talked about the massive flood that almost destroyed all life on earth.

You're the one denying history here.

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: Barcs

Yeah, that's the goal. I generally use scrutiny when people make claims or say something they claim will shake my world whilst offering no actual evidence.

Dude chilllllllll. The Hebrews, The Chinese, The Incas, The Sumerians, The Greeks, The Hindus, etc, etc, etc all talked about the massive flood that almost destroyed all life on earth.

You're the one denying history here.

I bet all you did was Google flood myths. No maps, no water tables or time scales, no comparison between cultures and character backgrounds or cross examination of any kind.

originally posted by: TzarChasm

I bet all you did was Google flood myths. No maps, no water tables or time scales, no comparison between cultures and character backgrounds or cross examination of any kind.

Gilgamesh, the hero of the Sumerian flood account, was said to have slain the celestial bull of heaven with the passing of the flood. This is a blatant reference to the constellation taurus the bull - the age of Taurus ended around 2300 BC. This is what it means to slay taurus the bull, an end to this era occurring around that date. Surely enough, the biblical flood account dates the flood to 2304 BC +/- 11 years. Therefore both these accounts attribute the global flood to the same time period.


Gilgamesh slaying the bull of heaven

This doesn't matter to you though, you will continue to deny history for your mutant monkey fairy tale.

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: TzarChasm

I bet all you did was Google flood myths. No maps, no water tables or time scales, no comparison between cultures and character backgrounds or cross examination of any kind.

Gilgamesh, the hero of the Sumerian flood account, was said to have slain the celestial bull of heaven with the passing of the flood. This is a blatant reference to the constellation taurus the bull - the age of Taurus ended around 2300 BC. This is what it means to slay taurus the bull, an end to this era occurring around that date. Surely enough, the biblical flood account dates the flood to 2304 BC +/- 11 years. Therefore both these accounts attribute the global flood to the same time period.

Gilgamesh slaying the bull of heaven

This doesn't matter to you though, you will continue to deny history for your mutant monkey fairy tale.

can you show me on a map where this flood took place and what regions were affected? and can you then correlate this flood with the other mythical accounts you posted?

See, here's a much more plausible theory, no godly wrath necessary, just nature doing what it does.

www.smithsonianmag.com...

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: Barcs

Yeah, that's the goal. I generally use scrutiny when people make claims or say something they claim will shake my world whilst offering no actual evidence.

Dude chilllllllll. The Hebrews, The Chinese, The Incas, The Sumerians, The Greeks, The Hindus, etc, etc, etc all talked about the massive flood that almost destroyed all life on earth.

Floods happen. Terrible floods happen occasionally, and every culture has experienced terrible flooding.

So its only natural for a culture's mythology to include stories (potentially made-up stories, as much of mythology is) about some long-ago mother-of-all-floods.

originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People

Floods happen. Terrible floods happen occasionally, and every culture has experienced terrible flooding.

So its only natural for a culture's mythology to include stories (potentially made-up stories, as much of mythology is) about some long-ago mother-of-all-floods.

All the links I gave were to flood myths that destroyed almost all the world. These people were not stupid, they recorded what was important to them, and it is unlikely that all these cultures are exaggerating. Believe it or not, but it is a component of the history of most longstanding cultures.

Archaeology even admits there was a global catastrophe that almost wiped out all life on the planet. We would be stubborn not to match science with history.


These are polystrate fossils which are old trees embedded into the sediment. Some standing upright indicating a rapid sedimentation event.

originally posted by: cooperton
Archaeology even admits there was a global catastrophe that almost wiped out all life on the planet. We would be stubborn not to match science with history.

If you mean extinction level events such as the Snowball Earth, or Chicxulub impact event, or the magma flows that may have contributed to Permian extinction, or even the latest glacial period that ended 11,000 years ago, they have nothing to do with a global civilization-ending single-flood event occurring during human history.

These are polystrate fossils which are old trees embedded into the sediment. Some standing upright indicating a rapid sedimentation event.

Can you show that these trees are a global phenomenon, and all occur at the same global sediment layer -- i.e. globally laid down at the same time?

I mean, I have no doubt whatsoever that floods have occurred in the distant (and even recent) past that have caused forests of trees to be in a sediment layer. However, that does not mean there was a global flood.

There were in fact meltwater flooding events that occurred at the end of the last ice age, but those were separate localized events occurring over a span of a couple of thousand years, not a single event that occurred all over the world all at the same time.

originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People

If you mean extinction level events such as the Snowball Earth, or Chicxulub impact event, or the magma flows that may have contributed to Permian extinction, or even the latest glacial period that ended 11,000 years ago, they have nothing to do with a global civilization-ending single-flood event occurring during human history.

Science insists on a mass extinction event.
History insists on a global flood that almost destroyed all life on earth.

These are not conflicting points of view.

Manu from the Hindu epic survived the great flood with a select few, same with Deucalion of the Greek tradition, and also Gilgamesh from the Sumerian account, all of which involved a global catastrophe.

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People

If you mean extinction level events such as the Snowball Earth, or Chicxulub impact event, or the magma flows that may have contributed to Permian extinction, or even the latest glacial period that ended 11,000 years ago, they have nothing to do with a global civilization-ending single-flood event occurring during human history.

Science insists on a mass extinction event.
History insists on a global flood that almost destroyed all life on earth.

Let me fix that:

Science insists on a mass extinction event.
H̶i̶s̶t̶o̶r̶y Mythology insists on a global flood that almost destroyed all life on earth.

Edit to add:
There is no evidence of a single flooding event that occurred all over the world during the span of human history -- and the evidence of a simultaneous global flood should be there in the sedimentary record if it did happen, but it's not there.

originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People

Let me fix that:

Science insists on a mass extinction event.
H̶i̶s̶t̶o̶r̶y mythology insists on a global flood that almost destroyed all life on earth.

The few elite literate people back in this era did not waste their time writing harry potter novels, they wrote what was meaningful to them. They also so happened to match accounts from around the world. Deny history all you want, but it remains.

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People

Let me fix that:

Science insists on a mass extinction event.
H̶i̶s̶t̶o̶r̶y mythology insists on a global flood that almost destroyed all life on earth.

The few elite literate people back in this era did not waste their time writing harry potter novels, they wrote what was meaningful to them. They also so happened to match accounts from around the world. Deny history all you want, but it remains.

So you're saying mythology isn't a thing? Or are you saying the myths are all literal records of civilizations' past?

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People

If you mean extinction level events such as the Snowball Earth, or Chicxulub impact event, or the magma flows that may have contributed to Permian extinction, or even the latest glacial period that ended 11,000 years ago, they have nothing to do with a global civilization-ending single-flood event occurring during human history.

Science insists on a mass extinction event.
History insists on a global flood that almost destroyed all life on earth.

These are not conflicting points of view.

Manu from the Hindu epic survived the great flood with a select few, same with Deucalion of the Greek tradition, and also Gilgamesh from the Sumerian account, all of which involved a global catastrophe.

But not a global flood and certainly not flooding caused by an angry god.

originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People

So you're saying mythology isn't a thing? Or are you saying the myths are all literal records of civilizations' past?

When multiple civilizations that had no contact describe the same event you can be sure it is history and not mythology

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People

Let me fix that:

Science insists on a mass extinction event.
H̶i̶s̶t̶o̶r̶y mythology insists on a global flood that almost destroyed all life on earth.

The few elite literate people back in this era did not waste their time writing harry potter novels, they wrote what was meaningful to them. They also so happened to match accounts from around the world. Deny history all you want, but it remains.

Do you mean like Beowulf or the chronicles of Odysseus or Plato's writings on Atlantis?

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People

Let me fix that:

Science insists on a mass extinction event.
H̶i̶s̶t̶o̶r̶y mythology insists on a global flood that almost destroyed all life on earth.

The few elite literate people back in this era did not waste their time writing harry potter novels, they wrote what was meaningful to them. They also so happened to match accounts from around the world. Deny history all you want, but it remains.

To add to my earlier response:

It should be noted that there aren't accounts written of global floods by the people who were part of these alleged global floods. The writings of the Mesopotamians and Hindus and Sumerians who wrote about global floods were writing about events that allegedly happened in their own pasts. These weren't historical first-hand accounts. These writings were of stories that had been passed down to that writer.

That's not necessarily a "historical account".

And even if there were some first-hand accounts of flooding, they could have each been writing about a local deluge flood that virtually wipes out civilization as they knew it -- but those accounts may not have been a global event.


Again, where is the sedimentary evidence that a single flood occurred that covered the earth all at the same time? You'd think the evidence would be relatively...uh... "evident", and would have been found by now.

originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People

It should be noted that there aren't accounts written of global floods by the people who were part of these alleged global floods. The writings of the Mesopotamians and Hindus and Sumerians who wrote about global floods were writing about events that allegedly happened in their own pasts. These weren't historical first-hand accounts. These writings were of stories that had been passed down to that writer.

That's not necessarily a "historical account".

Oral tradition and written documents (both describe the global flood from various cultures) are historical accounts.

And even if there were some first-hand accounts of flooding, they could have each been writing about a local deluge flood that virtually wipes out civilization as they knew it -- but those accounts may not have been a global event.

All the accounts included regarding a global flood include waters reaching the peaks of mountains, or totally submerging the world. This is not a simple flood that ruined a few houses close to sea level.

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People

It should be noted that there aren't accounts written of global floods by the people who were part of these alleged global floods. The writings of the Mesopotamians and Hindus and Sumerians who wrote about global floods were writing about events that allegedly happened in their own pasts. These weren't historical first-hand accounts. These writings were of stories that had been passed down to that writer.

That's not necessarily a "historical account".

Oral tradition and written documents (both describe the global flood from various cultures) are historical accounts.

No; not necessarily. If that were true, then the literate and learned people who wrote about Zeus and the Olympic gods based on stories that were orally passed down to them were writing historical facts.

All the accounts included regarding a global flood include waters reaching the peaks of mountains, or totally submerging the world. This is not a simple flood that ruined a few houses close to sea level.

And what is the physical evidence that backs up these accounts?

Again, a story about a global flood that gets passed down to a future author who writes about those accounts may not necessarily be true. And the total lack of any physical evidence showing that the world was once totally submerged all at the same time at some point during human history leads me to believe the orally handed-down stories are just myths.

The myths may have some basis in reality (i.e., there may have in fact been devastating flooding that covered much of the "known" world to some past storyteller), but they would appear to be exaggerations/extrapolations if they do have a kernel of truth to them.

originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People

No; not necessarily. If that were true, then the literate and learned people who wrote about Zeus and the Olympic gods based on stories that were orally passed down to them were writing historical facts.

Zeus was supposedly the Father of all humans to the Greeks and matches almost identically to Adam. Also similar to Atum of the Egyptians. There may be some embelishments but they believe in the historical aspect of these figures. Most records indicate that humans in the pre-flood lived longer and performed amazing feats.

And what is the physical evidence that backs up these accounts?

Matching fossils that span across oceans. They attribute this to pangea, but it would also be what you would expect after the occurrence of a global flood.