California Forest Fires, are They Caused by Climate Change or is Something Else Occurring.

a reply to: LtFluffyCakes96

Deny Ignorance

a reply to: Phage

No ignorance over here on my end? You mustn't forget I was going off of your mis-information.

a reply to: LtFluffyCakes96

You mean the OP, right?
I'm not the OP.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: muzzleflash

So really there is a lot of overlapping and integration going on in the sciences.

True. But it wasn't a change in climate that put the shell fossils on the mountains.

The event that put the shell in the mountains led to such drastic geological upheaval that it represents seemingly cataclysmic climate changes in the past.

a reply to: muzzleflash

The event that put the shell in the mountains led to such drastic geological upheaval that it represents seemingly cataclysmic climate changes in the past.

No.
It took a long time. A very, very, very long time.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: muzzleflash

The event that put the shell in the mountains led to such drastic geological upheaval that it represents seemingly cataclysmic climate changes in the past.

No.
It took a long time. A very, very, very long time.

Depends on what mountain. We were just speaking hypothetically so in my example we are referring to possible megaquakes thrusting up a mountain range in under a few thousand years.

a reply to: muzzleflash

We were just speaking hypothetically so in my example we are referring to possible megaquakes thrusting up a mountain range in under a few thousand years.

Not very high ones.

a reply to: muzzleflash

We have millions of people who do not have sufficient data, yet due to being bored humans will still comment on a subject they know nearly nothing about.

That datum/data. Your words. Like millions of unadulterated, cognizant minds capable of understanding simple physics/natural sciences are being denied the truth (read: data).

Please, speak truth to power and find your inner altruistic self and remind us (them). I’m begging you...the ‘natural’ order will rue the day that humans ‘know’ more than...well, Muzzleflash (same character that boarded a mothership, only to find out — during his debriefing of their life history — his ‘girl’ was porking someone else. Must’ve been a bummer of a revelation). Reckon that revelation of your’s was as eye-opening as those in Paradise, CA?

C’mon, man, your signature suggest something altogether different — prove us anti-capitalism, anti-humans, sick and delusional science-minded folk wrong. What data??

originally posted by: Wildbob77
I live about an hour from where the fires are in northern California. We have not had any rain since May. It is bone dry. My pastures have large cracks in them.

It is also unusually warm here. I'm still wearing shorts and T shirts. When the fire broke out, there were high winds gusting over 30 mph.

So it is not a normal weather pattern here this winter. Usually, we get our first rains in early October. I used to work in the tomato industry and the first rains would pretty much shut down the harvest so I am pretty aware of what the weather used to be like.

It is no longer the same. I'll let others decide what has caused the changed patterns of weather.

In the 80's to mid 90's I was involved in a Dendrology ( counting tree rings ) study of old growth timber and old Sequoia stumps, It was common to have 20 and 30 year droughts. It is not unusual in the life span of 1000 year old giants? Humans unfortunatley have miniscule lives and try to put everything in perspective of 70 years...
As a former forester, when I see the estimate of 100 million trees lost to bark beetles, my first thought is trying to average the water uptake of 50 to 100 gal. per day for mature trees, 20 to 30 for the mid size and up to 20 gallons a day for young trees, which will be a boon for springs, meadows and wells that have been drying up in the Sierra's.
Another factor is Ca. used to have the largest population of Pronghorn Antelope is north america, which would form large herds and mow the Sierras, including over mature brush which the deer will not eat. The gold rush was the end for Antelope.
The main issue is the overgrown brush cannot be control burned due to the increased heat, which cooks the soil making it repel water. So it must be cut down by hand.

New Mexico has changed their forestry practices by aggresivly thinning trees, which have brought springs and meadows back to life that had disappeared for close to 100 years.

Poor forest management, the loss of a major herbivore, and regular Santa Ana type wind events is and will be the cause.

The answer is a huge work force, hand cutting the overgrown brush? Maybe use the National Guard, or prisoners?
Its only gonna get worse.

a reply to: Knapperdude

Totally agree — multifaceted problem. Moreover, totally agree it is highly likely to get worse.

Back in your day, did you ever reference yourself (or others ‘label’ you and your cohorts) as professionals in “silviculture”? I ask because I worked with the NCSU Extension Service in grad school and spent a summer with the “silviculture” team, but have yet to encounter that term since (don’t remember encountering it in the forestry college either). Thanks in advance!

originally posted by: BeefNoMeat
a reply to: Knapperdude

Totally agree — multifaceted problem. Moreover, totally agree it is highly likely to get worse.

Back in your day, did you ever reference yourself (or others ‘label’ you and your cohorts) as professionals in “silviculture”? I ask because I worked with the NCSU Extension Service in grad school and spent a summer with the “silviculture” team, but have yet to encounter that term since (don’t remember encountering it in the forestry college either). Thanks in advance!

Silviculture is the study of trees, so in part yes, there were individuals who majored in Silviculture that were also registered professional foresters, my degree included some courses, but there were those who specialized in that field...Tree doctors...Foresty was mainly involved with timber harvest and managment (thinning, planting, ect). "Cruising" is the estimation of standing timber and just a estimate, setting up plots of land, hiking and measuring live standing trees." Scaling " is done at the mill, and the actual board feet of logs, using math formulas to subtract beetle damage, lightning damage and fire damage from the usable wood for the mill.
The Silviculturist dealt with systemic issues, like bark beetle, fungus, ect. I worked with them from time to time...they are tree doctors...literally giving trees shots. like wildlife biologist they are tasked with massive areas of responsibilities... maybe 1 guy per 100,000 acres or even more. a waiting game to get a job like biologist, with degree in hand and a waiting list exceeding 5 to 10 years.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Remember all the signs from not so long ago all over the Middle East the majority of which read either “death to America” or “America will burn” probably the 2 most dominant of the many slogans on the myriad of signs in the massive crowds....

Well I’m sure that some of those individuals played a role in the increased rate of forest fires everywhere...

Of course the sheep must not become frightened nor should they be aware of the inability of leadership to prevent such forms of terrorism...

So it is much easier to blame the weather/climate forest mismanagement etc...

Which is of course a factor... but no... this is all just a little too much...

a reply to: BeefNoMeat

Or it's just California and they notoriously mismanage their land to a dangerous degree. Also, it should be a desert and is heading back that way.

CA wildfires are often deliberately set. The Santa Ana wind events have been happening since I can remember, and with them is often the onset of wildfires. Yes it is dry here in California, but I think its supposed to be, NO? I mean I'm originally a New Yorker, we never had to irrigate everything to keep it alive. When there is very low humidity like less than 20% you can literally feel the moisture being sucked from your body. It does the same thing to every living thing turning it into kindling. The winds are furious and there is nothing stopping a 40mph wind driven blaze.

The unmentionable (SSSSHHHHH!!!) cause in this year's biggest fire is rumored to be PG&E; now you look at Gov. Brown's connection to PG&E and you'll see why no one in CA Government is talking about this...Do your research!
Climate change my ass...! Climate change deniers partly at fault my ass, Jerry Brown.
Power Line Fault

People are setting fires in California...
www.latimes.com...
3 cases of arson
Arson

Homeless encampments:
Homeless encampmnets

Firemen are setting wildfires:
www.laist.com...

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

They are caused by piss poor land management plan and simple .

a reply to: Xcathdra Don't forget about the research many people have spotlighted on the link between DEW (Directed Energy Weapons) which is glorified lasers and Agenda 21. I.E. burn down existing houses and bring in "stack and pack" housing for the new homeless people.

Its been 15 years but I read a science book about the environment of California.

Supposedly its combination of the ground and weather that starts these natural occurring fires.
Add lighting as well

They have been occurring naturally in the area way before man would want to burn it down

The interesting aspect was that after these fires the land becomes very fertile, very good for growing. Very fresh.

So there is a natural purpose of the earth to burn these areas to bring in the new and fresh

And it's been going on in patterns throughout history

originally posted by: Knapperdude

originally posted by: BeefNoMeat
a reply to: Knapperdude

Totally agree — multifaceted problem. Moreover, totally agree it is highly likely to get worse.

Back in your day, did you ever reference yourself (or others ‘label’ you and your cohorts) as professionals in “silviculture”? I ask because I worked with the NCSU Extension Service in grad school and spent a summer with the “silviculture” team, but have yet to encounter that term since (don’t remember encountering it in the forestry college either). Thanks in advance!

Silviculture is the study of trees, so in part yes, there were individuals who majored in Silviculture that were also registered professional foresters, my degree included some courses, but there were those who specialized in that field...Tree doctors...Foresty was mainly involved with timber harvest and managment (thinning, planting, ect). "Cruising" is the estimation of standing timber and just a estimate, setting up plots of land, hiking and measuring live standing trees." Scaling " is done at the mill, and the actual board feet of logs, using math formulas to subtract beetle damage, lightning damage and fire damage from the usable wood for the mill.
The Silviculturist dealt with systemic issues, like bark beetle, fungus, ect. I worked with them from time to time...they are tree doctors...literally giving trees shots. like wildlife biologist they are tasked with massive areas of responsibilities... maybe 1 guy per 100,000 acres or even more. a waiting game to get a job like biologist, with degree in hand and a waiting list exceeding 5 to 10 years.

Gotcha. Makes sense...it was a Army Corps feasibility study trying to determine optimal dam releases and there were a bunch of hardwoods that were on private lands and obviously those hardwoods had salvage, if not, timber value — those guys told me “hey, if it’s 7-10 days of inundation it’s roughly ‘x amount’ of damage” and so on and so forth.

I’ll be honest, they seemed pleased to have something to do. Almost like they were sitting on their hands most days.

Thanks again.

(update 11/15/2018)

Wasn't able to post before, but today there are two large events occurring in the world. There is one still affecting parts of California, and the count is now 1.2k events in that region. There is another large event occurring in Russia, that one has a count of 921 events.



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