A little advice before I take the plunge?

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: BigDave-AR

Actually, I'm greedy... was gonna repurpose this build for the server and get me one faster!

I'll check out the 3400 then... 20% is substantial! Thanks!

TheRedneck

Not from 3000 to 3400 but from 2400 the difference can be 20%+ there’s charts in the linky I posted.
I just built my new rig a few weeks back got a killer deal on an i7 8086k and used it as an excuse to relegate my 6700k to media server/HTPC duty.


www.legitreviews.com...

Forgot to say I’m a big fan of G.skill memory I’ve been running them ever since my previous go to memory company got bought up by toshiba OCZ was awesome back in the day.
Whatever memory you decide on it’s best to check the QVL list for the MoBo available at the link below as Ryzen is picky about what memory it plays nicely with to avoid headaches.
www.asus.com...

a reply to: BigDave-AR

Thanks for the info on G-Skill. I've never dealt with them before, but they are a little easier on the wallet than the big name brands and their reviews looked good. RAM matters! Big time!

TheRedneck

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: BigDave-AR

Thanks for the info on G-Skill. I've never dealt with them before, but they are a little easier on the wallet than the big name brands and their reviews looked good. RAM matters! Big time!

TheRedneck

No problem I’m rocking 32gb (4x4 until I get a case for the HTPC build that my old system will become I don’t even get close to using 16gigs and tame prices are still too damn high (supposed to be getting a fair bit better Q1-19) of G.Skill TridentZ DDR3400 CL16 that I have OC’ed a bit to DDR3466 with CL14 and tighter timings all around on my rig and the stuff has been going strong on a system that’s running 24/7 for going on 2.5yrs so I can’t conplain. IMO Corsair has gone down hill and I never was a huge Corsair fan, had more problems with their sticks than any other company and I’ve handled lots of ram.

Current system
MSI Z370 Gaming M5 (I usually run ASUS or EVGA but it was a combo deal at Frys and I’ve been pleasantly impressed with the board great bang for the buck)
I7 8086k delidded running 5.1ghz across all 6 cores
Samsung NVME 970 evo NVME m.2 1tb
Intel 970 1tb 2.5”SSD for my most of my steam games (at least the ones worth having on an SSD)
Optane accelerated 4tb 7200rpm storage HDD
ASUS ROG Strix GTX1080 (has one crap out on me and got a killer deal on a used one until I get the card back from RMA and then I’ll run SLI since I have an EVGA 1kw PSU that needs to break a sweat now and again and I refuse to pay the “RTX tax”

I seriously considered going AMD again haven’t built an AMD rig since the OG Core 2 Duo E6600 came out and flipped the competition on its head. I very nearly went with the setup like I suggested for you with the X399 chipset and TR1920x and probably would have made the jump of it weren’t for the fact that the particular RAM I have doesn’t like AMD and the rig is 95% gaming use and I just happened to get a good enough deal that it made my stick with my tried and true team blue it was a very hard choice though.
Back in the 64x2 days I was a huge AMD fan still have the X24800+ laying around that I killed with condensation doing dry ice over clocking trying to get back the #2 spot I had in the OC hall of fame for that CPU as a souvenir in lucite on my desk. Had over a 50% OC on that bad boy
Have fun building the new system maybe do a build thread I’m always up for more PC hardware content on here I was thinking about making a thread on my delliding adventure for the 6700k and 8086k but got in a hurry and didn’t take enough pictures or document the results good enough but it did make a very nice difference in my OC and temps.

a reply to: BigDave-AR

You still running 3D mark? I noticed you had that running for awhile now.
What’s your previous score?

originally posted by: Allaroundyou
a reply to: BigDave-AR

You still running 3D mark? I noticed you had that running for awhile now.
What’s your previous score?

You stalker you I left it on stress testing the OC on the card and CPU haven’t done benching on the new setup yet for sure will when I get the second 1080 back in time spy I was running about 6800 points with the 6700k.

What’s your score for your lappy? Mine runs around 5300 in Time spy I know not a far conparassion but I’m curious.

a reply to: BigDave-AR

I wasn’t stalking just watching lol

I’m waiting to order the laptop. My desktop is nowhere near as powerful as yours.

Asus motherboard can’t remember model though
I7-2600k
12g ddr3ram highspeed but not oc
2 1 tb ssd
And now don’t laugh but a PNY GTX 1050ti super oc with 6 pin power adapter

originally posted by: Allaroundyou
a reply to: BigDave-AR

I wasn’t stalking just watching lol

I’m waiting to order the laptop. My desktop is nowhere near as powerful as yours.

Asus motherboard can’t remember model though
I7-2600k
12g ddr3ram highspeed but not oc
2 1 tb ssd
And now don’t laugh but a PNY GTX 1050ti super oc with 6 pin power adapter

I actually bought a MSI GTX1050ti when I was diagnosing my 1080 and was surprised by just how good it is for the size and low TDP so I kept it it to go into the the HTPC it actually gets better 3D marks than my lappy with the 8086k which amazed me (but that’s the beast cpu carrying it through). I like my MSI Dominator Pro the thing is beast and has great build quality I think you’ll be very happy I’ve actually been considering selling the lappy though as it was acting as my HTPC and it’s getting replaced by the 6700k rig for HTPC duty. You got first dibs at it lol.😉

a reply to: BigDave-AR

Sounds like 16 GB is a good size to have... as I said before, mine has never paged and I've had it running with several Office apps, Firefox with over 100 tabs, PoserPro, MultiSim, Photoshop, MATLAB, a PC scope, and AutoCAD, plus a ton of Notepads and Eclipse all at the same time. No paging. 32 GB is going to just be icing on the cake for when things get heavier (as they always do).

I became an AMD fan way way back when... Intel was overpriced and underperformed compared to them back then. To be honest, they've boomeranged back and forth with Intel since they started. Intel back then was getting lazy, being the only major CPU manufacturer. My first video card was an ATI Radeon, one of the old ones before they had dedicated RAM, and it ran awesome... never had any trouble with the drivers like others had (found out later because I was running AMD), and when AMD bought out ATI... well, this was one happy redneck!

Never got into gaming much... I have a couple EQ characters, and I played UO for a while way way back when. Just never had time for them. I love video and so when I found Poser 4, I thought I was in heaven! Now with PoserPro (Poser 8+), it's even better. I can spend hours, sometimes days, just setting up a scene and weeks cutting it and never get bored. I guess you could say it's my game. That's why I went with onboard video... not needed unless I want to do real-time rendering like in gaming.

I do have a Radeon 1GB card my son gave me... never used it. It's in my shop computer, but not being used.

Been hearing a lot of good things about MSI lately... but I'll stick with ASUS for now.

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck


You are aware the Win7 is nearing end-of-life as we are approaching Jan. 14, 2020?

You are correct about Win10 being that "OS as a service" really does suck. The IT dudes let a known bad patch go even after they were told it was not to be applied (kills Citrix) but they never took it out. Wonderful Win10, as an ever so helpful service, applied all the patches it found. BAM! Citrix dead. I now have to switch networks to do my job. Usually requiring a full reboot as they do not give me admin rights.

Anyway, enough b!tching about me. I just wanted to point out that Win7 is going the way of XP in a couple years.

a reply to: TEOTWAWKIAIFF

I was using XP until a couple years ago. Just because an OS is unsupported, as long as software is written for it, it will continue.

Plus, I don't upgrade software often. I find what works, and hang on to it. I still wish I could roll Firefox back about 20 upgrades...

TheRedneck

You have too much invested in storage architecture. Concentrate on Internet Speed, CPU power, sufficient memory, Virtualization and by all means, the GPU''s.

All of your work, business and home accounting infrastructure should just run in a VM (I like VM Workstation for this) You can run XP or Win7 VM hosts which are just fine for office, email and general bookkeeping. Snapshots are the way to just keep everything backed up, and if you get any malware or a virus or other instability, just kill the VM image and reload it from the last known good snapshot (hell with all of that system restore nonsense that rarely works).

Run your realtime stuff on the host directly, with a pair of GPU's in crossfire with 2 monitors. You can get incredible graphics performance from a pair of 7970's in crossfire for much cheaper bucks than the new stuff.

You can and use a 1tb SSD for local storage that will meet the I/O demand of gaming.

The cloud is really where you want to be for an enterprise Storage. Forget all that raid and redundancy. This is storage nirvana, especially if you have multiple systems that use much of the same data, and you can configure it any way you want without using your own hardware solutions. Invest in Internet Speed. Your software and data are all accessible here, and you do not need to back anything up, it is part of the service. Want to have the best of both worlds?, buy a service that provides a NAS interface. If you buy a NAS as a hardware server, it is costly and you have to maintain it as well. A universal NAS lets you get at all of your data from anywhere.

Oh, and the motherboard... I recommend ASUS ROG CrossHair Formula X/Y/Z class running something equiv to an Intel® Core™ i7-9700K Processor is my pref. Lots of USB3, 4 PCI16 slots that let you separate the GPU's is crucial. 32GB of memory does the trick but if you run more than one VM, put in 64 and they will use all of it. The power supply is a Corsair AX1200i , and you will definitely need that kind of PS.

Main OS is Win10. You must have the better driver architecture for a powerful machine as well as the home network capabilities and security that go far beyond what XP and Win7 provide. Get rid of the stupid Win10 start menu with Classic Shell, free and probably worth more than the OS itself, since you get your Win7 and XP navigation familiarity. Replace the horrid Win10 search function with SearchEX , which emulates the XP search engine (best interface).

The game in designing the best work-at-home system is by taking the best core software that the industry has to offer and replacing their antiquated and biased interfaces with what works the best, produced by the most awesome entrepreneurial developers ever known.

Also, as a last requirement of your new home system.... Security. Easy enough for software, but If you have a large investment in hardware, a company like ADT is important. Why do it yourself, when they have so much for relatively cheap bucks. Not advertising for them, but wishing in the past that I took a few of their offers. We are software people, and while we can protect our cyber assets, we most often ignore the assholes that see your systems when coming to your home to repair stuff..... and they tell others who cannot be stopped by a firewall......

a reply to: TheRedneck

◾On-board Radeon graphics

go for G force graphics instead more stable

originally posted by: AthlonSavage
a reply to: TheRedneck

◾On-board Radeon graphics

go for G force graphics instead more stable

Have to comment there. The stability I get out of Radeon Adrenalin drivers vs on-board Radeon in other machines is significant. Passing I/O on to other chips, especially DSP's not originally designed to handle such throughput is a wildcard presently, and until the entire data chain is engineered to run that way, I would avoid it like the plague and stick to what really works. Obviously a cheaper way to get the same or better performance, but opens up a can of squiggly worms that may be it's demise.

I have always loved NVIDIA, however, especially in the BTC era, the versatility in persuading a DSP to do certain functions was certainly an architectural issue that software could not rectify.

a reply to: charlyv

You have too much invested in storage architecture. Concentrate on Internet Speed, CPU power, sufficient memory, Virtualization and by all means, the GPU''s.

One of my main goals is to have the storage architecture. I tend to create a LOT of data in what I do, and that data needs to be kept secure. As it stands now, I try to back everything up on multiple media (multiple hard drives, external drives, USB, and even DVD sometimes), but I also realize that doing so has one inherent flaw... forgetfulness. Adding in a RAID 5, where even a catastrophic single HDD failure does not jeopardize data, means much less chance of losing data, especially in conjunction with my present backups.

I have considered the cloud, and I know it is much faster and easier, but that comes with a cost I cannot pay: the possibility of data being stolen. While the majority of what I do would not be a problem, a substantial part of it is highly secretive. I cannot take that chance. My data must remain on site.

The GPUs really do very little for me. They are essential for real-time rendering as in gaming, but what I do is number-crunching. Raw 3D rendering cannot be handled in real time; games have most of the pre-processing already completed before the rendering happens. Raw 3D rendering is more dependent on CPU power than GPU power. There would be some increase in speed, but at a huge cost... two top-end Radeon cards would cost as much as I plan on putting in the whole system.

That said, everything I have looked at has a minimum of two PCIe16 slots with Crossfire support... there's always the future!

I have my monitor already... I'm using it for TV temporarily. It's a 54" LCD TV with HDMI, wall-mountable. As soon as I repair my old trusty LED DLP 65" Samsung (LED Driver card issue, probably needs new capacitors), it's not needed any more for that. Additional monitors can be added as needed, and probably will be... I know I use both the standard 25" monitor and the 42" wall-mounted LCD TV as monitors in my shop... that TV comes in very handy for keeping datasheets in view while soldering and for collaboration with others (not to mention watching movies), but sometimes I like the monitor. I'll likely have two smaller monitors, one on each side, before all is said and done.

And yeah, I know everyone has their preference. Most games are written for the Gforce instruction set, but I'm not that heavily into gaming... Radeon seems to work best for my needs.

Main OS is Win10. You must have the better driver architecture for a powerful machine as well as the home network capabilities and security that go far beyond what XP and Win7 provide. Get rid of the stupid Win10 start menu with Classic Shell, free and probably worth more than the OS itself, since you get your Win7 and XP navigation familiarity. Replace the horrid Win10 search function with SearchEX , which emulates the XP search engine (best interface).

I have Win10 on this laptop, so I'm becoming familiar with it. So far, I have a couple issues. One I mentioned earlier, the automatic removal of software... and if that extends beyond Microsoft software, I would consider it completely unacceptable. I have several older apps that still run on Win7, and their interface is much easier and faster for me to use than the newer, greater versions. Sometimes developers tend to sacrifice usability for cosmetics. Other times, upgrading is little more than an exercise in budget-breaking wit no real return... Office falls into that category, as my old 2007 version does everything I need. So does Photoshop; I am unable to fully realize the capabilities of CS3, so why upgrade? I do use a lot of graphics, but not enough to make that leap.

I will check out SearchEX, though. I have had to disable the search services on here just to keep the HDD from running at 100% constantly. That's another one of the problems I have with Win10... it seems to be very hard on the drives. Firefox drives the HDD crazy at times, and while I have bettered that issue with (far too much) tweaking the settings, it still exists at times. Win10 also seems to have much more issue with extreme multitasking, which would be a major issue for me.

Also, as a last requirement of your new home system.... Security.

That's really not an issue in my case. No one looks at my work computers without me being present and in control. No one repairs my machines except me. If anyone does come into one of my work spaces to repair something else (which has never happened; I tend to fix everything that needs fixing), the computers will be off and anything I have in process will be covered.

I also have some software that constantly monitors that pipe and restricts data transfer if anything is out of the ordinary. Don't ask where it came from.

That was one reason I started considering the home office... it has a locking door to it and is not needed for anything else. There is no reason anyone will need in there unless they are working on something in there. Plus, for presentation purposes (aka online tutoring), I can place a pull-down screen between the door and the computer. that will give me a good white background (hard to get in a shop environment) as well as a visual shield for anyone entering.

Thanks for the comments!

TheRedneck

a reply to: charlyv

The stability I get out of Radeon Adrenalin drivers vs on-board Radeon in other machines is significant.

That sounds like something I need to check out. Thank you!

I have always loved NVIDIA

As a general rule, NVIDIA tends to play well with Intel and Radeon tends to play well with AMD. The instruction sets have developed over time to compliment each other. Most high-end games are written on and optimized for Intel systems, so the NVIDIA cards tend to have higher benchmarks for gaming.

Radeon has as much power as NVIDIA, but the instruction set is slightly different and tuned more to general usage. My experience is that Radeon provides better performance in non-gaming applications. Other than that, it's a personal preference like Mopar vs. Ford (Mopar rules, btw ).

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

As you have noticed Firefox is being a pain and after 8+ years i have jumped to Opera another platform O/S nobody mentioned was windows 8.1 which is supported until 2023 i believe , other than that this thread is way over my head

a reply to: stonerwilliam

I am on the verge of abandoning Firefox, so thanks for the Opera referral!

Win 8.1 is pretty buggy though...

TheRedneck

a reply to: TheRedneck

One of my main goals is to have the storage architecture. I tend to create a LOT of data in what I do, and that data needs to be kept secure. As it stands now, I try to back everything up on multiple media (multiple hard drives, external drives, USB, and even DVD sometimes), but I also realize that doing so has one inherent flaw... forgetfulness. Adding in a RAID 5, where even a catastrophic single HDD failure does not jeopardize data, means much less chance of losing data, especially in conjunction with my present backups.

In that case, you are definitely a candidate for a NAS. Your network needs to be at 1000 Mbps (1 gigabit). That means router and NIC's at that speed. You can also have 2 NIC's in the servers, and one dedicated to just the NAS traffic.

I like ReadyNAS, which is a NetGear product, as well as Synology. If you get an 8-bay, the internal NAS firmware will supply Raid 5 with Stripe Sets, allowing for 2 drive simultaneous drive failures, if you can afford the redundancy. You can fill it with 1 tb SSD's or 10TB fast hard drives... As always, money vs functionality vs reliability vs speed.

Good luck with your systems. It is so much fun coming up with a workable architecture tuned for what you do.

P.S. Here is a Cortana dialog I would like to hear when installing Win10...

Hi, my name is Cortana.

I am here to help you install Windows 10 on your new hardware.

If you continue to install and configure WIndows 10 on this piece of #, it will never work as you expect it to.

This can also cause extreme user anxiety and could possibly lead to suicidal tendencies.

Why not cut your losses and immediately return this junk pile to the dubious vendor you purchased it from.

You can also include this message if you so desire.

Please come back when you have a piece of hardware that can run this beautiful, bloated OS.

Thank You for choosing Microsoft.