Should fake accusers be punished

originally posted by: BrianFlanders
Frankly, I think someone who knowingly makes a false claim against someone deserves to be sent to jail. Rape is no laughing matter and men get the book thrown at them whether they did it or not. The damage done to someone's reputation for even a claim they can prove is false really can't be calculated. It's a monstrous thing to do to someone.

Ummm...yes...not to mention possible loss of livelihood...how do you recover that...?

Restitution could never cover that...





YouSir

a reply to: Bluntone22

It would be nice if they did.

originally posted by: nfflhome
Hell yes. The school presumed guilty before a trial. Their decision was reckless and
makes them libel.

I live near where this happened. I worked with the boy's father. I have no respect for the Seneca Valley School District, but, this is the one time that they did it right. The counselor was required BY LAW to report the girl's claim that she was sexually assaulted. The school district didn't presume "guilt before a trial". They actually did it right for once. There was a plea agreement of Probation. That had nothing to do with the school and everything to do with our current system of always believing the woman in situations like this. There was no way that they boy was going to get a fair trial in the current trial by media society in which we live. The plea was probably his best option.

a reply to: Bluntone22
No, but this was part of the "administration of justice" part of the legal code.
It's an example of the way a different legal system can cope with the issue, and that's a legal system aiming at being as just as possible to everyone. Possible model? It certainly touches on the moral question posed by your title.

a reply to: Bluntone22

it's quite scary that all it takes is a female to file a complaint without evidence and the male is automatically considered guilty.

the two female students should have to be brought before a jury and tried for their crimes. if found guilty then they should complete the sentence handed down to them by a court of law.... definitely not the court of twitter.

a reply to: Bluntone22

Absolutely they should be punished, and some states have laws against false accusations of rape and sexual assault, specifically (instead of, say, filing a false police report), and they often carry with them the same penalties that a rape and sexual-assault conviction carry.

That should be a national law, IMO.

Of course, just like with a rape allegation, an allegation of a false allegation would require the same beyond-a-reasonable-doubt standard, so it would be very hard to prove, too.

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: DISRAELI

I dont think the ten commandments apply in a courtroom

They do. LOL.

Bearing false witness is what the courts call perjury which is why it's a crime.

originally posted by: Bluntone22
I came across an article today that made me do some thinking. In light of recent events with the kavanaugh hearing, I was wondering if people accusing someone falsely should be punished in accordance with the accused crime.

Now before anyone jumps the gun, I'm Not saying that miss ford should be jailed because her claims couldn't be proven. If proven she lied then that's a different story.

The linked story is about a boy accused by two females of sexual assault just because they didn't like him.

He was removed from school, placed under house arrest and I'm sure had all kinds of harrassment sent his way.

"The girls—dubbed "mean girls" in the lawsuit, a reference to the 2004 Lindsay Lohan film—admitted on tape that they made up the assault story. One said, "I just don't like him" and "[I] would do anything to get him expelled," according to The Toronto Sun."

Now it has been discovered that he was innocent and is now suing the school. I dont understand how the school is responsible but maybe that will come out later.

My question is, do these girls deserve punishment equal to the punishment the boy would have received if found guilty?

I say yes.

reason.com...

In the U.S. we can sue for defamation of character...a real prosecutable issue.

Not criminal I don't believe...but do-able

if its proven they lied or confess to such i think they should get the maximum sentence their accused would have gotten if convicted, every fake rape claim sets back real victims and those afraid to come forward so yeah throw the book at any one proven to have faked an allegation

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: DISRAELI

I dont think the ten commandments apply in a courtroom

Doesn't make them wrong...

The presumption of innocence and due process is meant to protect such injustices. The accusation alone is ruinous to a person's life. Knowingly making false accusations should be punished, and it should be a crime if it isn't already.

Remember Obama's "Dear Colleague" letter back in 2011, requiring all federally funded schools to essentially deny due process to the accused. What have we taught people during those seven years?

Here's another recent case in Canada proving that these accusations are ruinous:

An Academic Mobbing at McGill

I think false accusations happen a lot. I've known several guys who have been falsely accused. Women know the system is biased towards them and they use it to their advantage. Think about how many women "trap" men with babies. Lie about domestic abuse and all kinds of other conniving sh*t.

What irks me is that some people think women are all innocent which is far from the truth.

I think if it is without beyond reasonable doubt that a woman falsely accused a man of sexual assault/rape, they should face the same sentence. Heck, I think any kind of false accusation should be punished harshly.

a reply to: Bluntone22

I was wondering if people accusing someone falsely should be punished in accordance with the accused crime.

Look at the Casey Anthony case. The state accused her of killing her child. To me it seems like she did but the state did not prove its case and she was found not guilty.

Would your "sentence the accuser" apply to the prosecutor in that case? Probably not.... But... Here local a few years back a homeless man was charged and convicted of the murder of a community college professor. It was later revealed that the prosecutor had withheld video evidence that he could not have been the killer and he was released from prison and I would guess acquitted.

Now that bastard prosecutor should be held on charges in my eyes.

But I know what you are saying.... charges more than just "filing a false police report".... IDK what the min-max sentence is for filing false report, but maybe make the max fit the crime falsely reported

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: DISRAELI

I dont think the ten commandments apply in a courtroom

The Ten Commandments are the basis of law for most western nations.

If there is 100%, beyond a shadow of a doubt, irrefutable proof that it's a false accusation, then yes, the accuser should be punished to the fullest extent of the crime. Perjury/Defamation? Not sure what it'd be, but definitely not the same punishment as a rapist. Those 2 crimes aren't on the same scale.


There has to be undeniable proof that it's a false accusation though. Such as, it's proven that they were in different states at time. Something hugely obvious like that.

Otherwise, it opens a big can of worms, and a lot of actual rapists/etc could end up getting away with it because people would be scared to report it. It absolutely can't be: "oh, we couldn't convict them, so you're being punished instead". That would be disastrous.

Another thought....

but on ATS we are a international forum, so we all come from different cultures and more importantly for this thread operate under different systems of justice.

So while for a individual like me sitting sipping on a fine whisky in Scotland might say its a slippery slope, lets not do it, that is very much a view based on how our justice system works. Under a different legal system it could be a much more reasonable suggestion.

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: DISRAELI

I dont think the ten commandments apply in a courtroom

Those aren't the 10 Commandments. That's old school Old Testament style law where you find the tough stuff.

However, I think it's pretty fitting although I'd modify it slightly. I think in this case I'd say the false witness should suffer what the accused suffered. So if the penalty was supposed to be 15 years but the accuser didn't actually suffer that, then we don't set the false witness up for that amount. However, they should be marched out of school in handcuffs and the other things this kid suffered because of their accusations, including the juvenile detention time.

a reply to: tinner07

I would say anyone making up false testimony or withholding evidence should be punished.
With Casey anthony the prosecutor wasnt lying, he just failed to prove the case beyond reasonable doubt.

a reply to: ketsuko

I was just saying that the bible isnt really allowed in the courts, even though many of our laws are closely based on some of its teachings.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

You are correct, laws are different form country to country.