British mountain biker shot dead by hunter in French Alps

originally posted by: DictionaryOfExcuses

originally posted by: Kandinsky
a reply to: DictionaryOfExcuses
Forests have bike trails as well as game so I guess the two pursuits will cross paths.

Forests do not "have" bike trails in the same way that they "have" game.

Bike trails could easily be limited to areas closed to hunting. The fact that some are not means that the participants are aware of and accept the risk.

It maybe different in Europe compared to the US. Hikers and bikers outnumber hunters by a huge number here. There's less incentive to restrict recreational hikers/bikers because hunters are a small minority. Seems to me like awareness needs to be raised on all sides to avoid accidents and fatal incidents.

In the US gun safety and hunting safety course’s are mandatory in many states at least it is in my state.

a reply to: seeker1963

I see this kind of stuff every year during hunting season where a city slicker decides to try being an out doorsman. They pass the hunters safety test, which isn't hard to do if you have some intelligence to learn. They get their hunting license, buy a rifle and they most likely step in the woods for the first time in their life with intention of being a great hunter.

So you're agreeing with my point that the hunters could be more careful.

Don't worry man, the bad taste in your mouth won't last.

a reply to: Nickn3

All of them, last I heard. I was 10 when I took mine, though I'd been hunting with my Dad for a couple of years prior...shh, don't tell anyone.

originally posted by: Kandinsky
a reply to: seeker1963

I see this kind of stuff every year during hunting season where a city slicker decides to try being an out doorsman. They pass the hunters safety test, which isn't hard to do if you have some intelligence to learn. They get their hunting license, buy a rifle and they most likely step in the woods for the first time in their life with intention of being a great hunter.

So you're agreeing with my point that the hunters could be more careful.

Don't worry man, the bad taste in your mouth won't last.

I am saying just because someone takes a test to get license doesn't mean they are qualified to hunt. I am also saying that when it is hunting season, hiker and bikers should have enough sense to stay the hell out of the woods!


It's a culture thing for me. I grew up with guns and hunting and witnessed many idiots who passed the test, yet had no experience in the woods. Ever hear of "deer fever"?

This is the most IMPORTANT thing you are taught in hunters safety. "NEVER TAKE A SHOT IF YOU ARE NOT CERTAIN OF YOUR TARGET.". In other words if you think your target is a deer but not 100% certain, put your weapon down.

It is the main reason there are so many hunting accidents. Lack of experience and "deer fever".

a reply to: seeker1963

That's what my point is!! I'm not calling for bans and not criticising hunters in general. The point was some training will reduce the accidents and deaths. Experienced hunters are safer than others so train the rest and France won't have so many deaths and accidents.

originally posted by: Kandinsky
a reply to: seeker1963

That's what my point is!! I'm not calling for bans and not criticising hunters in general. The point was some training will reduce the accidents and deaths. Experienced hunters are safer than others so train the rest and France won't have so many deaths and accidents.

Perhaps I took your OP the wrong way. If I did I apologize. I don't hunt anymore, but I still see the city slickers who come up to my neck of the woods every hunting season and they are dangerous. NOT ALL OF THEM, but to be honest I have seen my own get "deer fever". Maybe it's what my pops taught me and my military service that makes me have the opinion I have? My pops would have broke my fingers if he ever saw me using a weapon inappropriately. Maybe that's why I shined on the rifle range in the Army.

a reply to: seeker1963

It's cool. You sound like a guy who knows the difference between responsible hunters and risky assholes. Not saying the poor guy who killed the biker is an asshole. He might be, he might not. France is having a ban guns/ban hunting debate and it seems more logical to educate those getting started in hunting.

All the best

A Hunter not knowing the difference between a human on a bike with bike gear on and an animal 🤔

A good friend of mine accidently shot his son in law when out deer hunting. I guess he shot at a deer and his son in law was behind the deer off through the thicket. He felt really bad but things like that happen occasionally. I avoid talking about the incident with him, his son in law and him were pretty close. His daughter was traumatized when that happened.

Hunting accidents do happen, even the vice president shot his lawyer when hunting.

I am more afraid of having a heart attack in the woods than getting shot. Just wear some orange or red when out in the woods during hunting season. There are lots of hunters in the woods up here, don't be walking down the road with a fuzzy brown hat during hunting season.

originally posted by: lSkrewloosel
A Hunter not knowing the difference between a human on a bike with bike gear on and an animal 🤔

Stray bullet is what it says, the guy could have been a quarter mile away. Also, when a deer is running, you have to watch behind the deer, I have missed a chance to shoot many times because I could not see if there was a clear field behind the deer. A friend of mine shot his red grand torino because it wouldn't start out on the bush road.

A friend of mine’s brother got hit with a “stary” .308 round in the arm while on red large quad, he was wearing full orange and so was his wife behind him, the bullet passed through both their upper arms, they both almost lost a arm. They survived but their limbs will never be the same.

The hunter however admitted to shooting at them because he some how thought they were a deer, he got charged with attempted murder. Courts didn’t buy his story.

a reply to: Kandinsky

a reply to: rickymouse

Reminds me of that movie Calibre.. If you not seen it . Good movie to watch. Especially if you like hunting

I am a Brit living in France for 28 years.

I am also a hunter and have been for over 20 of those years and also president of our local hunting syndicat.

Here is what I can tell you firstly concerning the incident and according to the newspapers le Dauphine liberé which is the local newspapaer and l'independant which is a non biased news source over here :

According to the Dauphine Liberé :

Link here : www.ledauphine.com...

A tragic accident occurred yesterday at 6 p.m. in the town of Montriond. While a hunt was organized by a handful of members of the ACCA (Association communale de chasse agréée) de Montriond. The hunt was composed of seven hunters, including guests.

It was during this hunt that a mountain biker who was running down a track at the edge of a wood was fatally shot by a 22-year-old hunter.

The deceased man, an English national, was a restaurateur in Les Gets.

Under the orders of the prosecutor, Philippe Toccanier of the Thonon prosecutor's office, the gendarmes collected evidence on the spot that should make it possible to establish the conditions under which this accident took place. In a state of shock, the young hunter was hospitalized. He was not taken into custody. The investigation opened in flagrante delicto concerns the charge of aggravated manslaughter.

This terrible accident, which causes misunderstanding within the Haute-Savoie hunters' federation, comes just 15 days after the young hunter who killed a traileur in December 2015 with a bullet to the head in Semnoz was sentenced to one year in prison.

An accident that had raised awareness in the department and led to many measures such as banning hunting in certain areas too busy for hikers and creating an application to find out the days and areas where hunting takes place.

On social networks, this new accident provoked many reactions, including that of Rémi Gaillard, who called on the President of the Republic to ask him to immediately stop the hunting season.

Story according to l'Independant with link here :

www.lindependant.fr...

A British mountain biker, who was hurtling down a road at the edge of a wood in the town of Montriond (Haute-Savoie), was fatally shot by a shotgun this Saturday, it was reported on Sunday from the prosecutor's office.

The accident occurred around 6 p.m. during a big game hunt organized by local hunters, in the presence of guests, said the prosecutor of the Republic of Thonon-les-Bains, Philippe Toccanier.

The victim, Mark Sutton, is a 34-year-old restaurateur from Wales who has been living in the area with his partner for four years. He owns two establishments, one offering a home cooking service in Morzine, the other specialising in healthy cuisine in Les Gets, a town very close to the scene of the tragedy.
"Perfectly identifiable"

An assiduous mountain biker, the man was "perfectly identifiable" on this busy, steep and difficult to access road, located at an altitude of 1,350 metres.

In a state of shock, the 22-year-old hunter, who was invited by the hunt, was hospitalized. "He could not be taken into police custody," the prosecutor said, confirming an information from the Released Dauphiné.

An investigation was opened for manslaughter aggravated by the Thonon-les-Bains research brigade in order to shed light on the circumstances of the tragedy.

My thoughts.

This is one of many unfortuante hunting accidents that may happen.

The majority of people in hunting regions here in France are made aware of the opening and closing dates concerning hunting via town hall announcements that are posted in front of the town hall. These announcements also include any new SAFETY laws that have been brought into place.

This sadly was an unfirunate accident bacause of either a starybullet or even a ricochet.

To be continued....

6pm? Would be getting pretty dark by then no? And getting a fatal shot on a fsst moving target in heavy woods is pretty impressive.....though tragic of course.a reply to: Lagomorphe

originally posted by: lakenheath24
6pm? Would be getting pretty dark by then no? And getting a fatal shot on a fsst moving target in heavy woods is pretty impressive.....though tragic of course.a reply to: Lagomorphe

Over here in France a shot can be fired as long as the sun is still setting depending on which region (County) you live in.

originally posted by: seeker1963
Those of us who grew up with fathers who taught us how to hunt before we were old enough to legally use a weapon, laugh at the city folk who come to our woods with their brand new weapons that cost a lot more than the hand me downs we use for hunting.

But the salesman at Cabella's told me I was a natural!!!

I decided to learn to hunt this year with no background in shooting other than the ranges at Boy Scout camp as a kid. I'm learning now with none other than a humble slingshot. I've been practicing all year and can hit a golf ball from 20-30ft. My neighbor is a 30-year bowhunting veteran and is going to teach me to field dress small game. Totally off-topic but I never get a chance to talk about my rad new hobby.

I've heard it said that if you can hunt with a slingshot, you can hunt with anything.

originally posted by: DictionaryOfExcuses

originally posted by: seeker1963
Those of us who grew up with fathers who taught us how to hunt before we were old enough to legally use a weapon, laugh at the city folk who come to our woods with their brand new weapons that cost a lot more than the hand me downs we use for hunting.

But the salesman at Cabella's told me I was a natural!!!

I decided to learn to hunt this year with no background in shooting other than the ranges at Boy Scout camp as a kid. I'm learning now with none other than a humble slingshot. I've been practicing all year and can hit a golf ball from 20-30ft. My neighbor is a 30-year bowhunting veteran and is going to teach me to field dress small game. Totally off-topic but I never get a chance to talk about my rad new hobby.

I've heard it said that if you can hunt with a slingshot, you can hunt with anything.

Get a hunting license and get to know your game and security.

a reply to: Lagomorphe

I'm having a lapse of comprehension - could you please clarify what you mean by "get to know your...security"?

originally posted by: seeker1963
This is the most IMPORTANT thing you are taught in hunters safety. "NEVER TAKE A SHOT IF YOU ARE NOT CERTAIN OF YOUR TARGET.". In other words if you think your target is a deer but not 100% certain, put your weapon down.

Even if you are sure your target is a deer, and you hit the deer, you might still kill an innocent bystander, has happened more than once. This is one example:

Hunter kills cyclist after bullet went through deer and carried on for another 984 feet

That was in Poland but I've read about a case like that in the USA too.