Abiogenesis - The Impossible Theoretical Miracle

a reply to: Puppylove

I am going to guess you are not a Christian, but I can tell you are preaching your version of Christianity, your assumption of what Christianity is
Do you realize how stupid that is?

And hummmm, read my history, I have said many times, over and over, I think atheists act more Christian than Christians
You are just winging for winnings sake

Something else funny, I have atheist friends who don't get all bitchy at me because my sky daddy says I should treat everyone like they are created in my sky daddies image

They know better than to preach their versions of Christianity at me
I respect and understand atheists, I was one, I get it, logically, it makes sense, atheism that is
I just don't get winging bitching atheists who are all preachy and fundamentalist about atheism

a reply to: Puppylove

And that's your sad reality, you see a squirrel crossing a street and observe it, then what, nothing
Some people ask questions

Science haters don't ask questions, they just observe and then nothing
Why hate on science, why hate questions?

originally posted by: cooperton
Wouldn't it make more sense that the initial act of creation of life from non-life, given that this Being has the capability of producing life, would be a complete act of creation, forming all necessary life, rather than just leaving a primordial archaeabacteria to forego random interactions to culminate a human?

I was under the impression you were Christian.

Are you actually pointing out problems in the Genesis story in the same thread that you are dismissing Evolution?
The Bible clearly states that Sea Monsters and Man were created in separate acts.

LOL! The very first paragraph is a straw man. It's irrelevant what the modern bacteria looks like. Abiogenesis is about the very first bacteria, not one that has evolved for almost 4 billion years. Creationists are funny. If something disagrees with literal biblical texts it is automatically impossible. It's funny how close minded they are. Even scientists today don't call creationism impossible. The word impossible means it can't happen nomatter what and that has not been proved in the slightest in regards to abiogenesis.

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: Krazysh0t

If you see them as atheists sorry, just men who thought people evolved
Never mentioned atheism

Seeing as you brought it up though...

Don’t act like you don’t bring up this comparison in every thread.

The very first bacteria were cyanobacteria. But even then, they have components like a DNA/RNA strands, cell membranes and sheaths. They operate using the Calvin cycle, a process to perform photosynthesis using ADP.

We know that amino acids can form naturally, and that they can join up to form strands. The next step would be to have something that could replicate by cutting apart strands and pulling out the amino acids that it needs.

This has been demonstrated using self replicating DNA rings:

phys.org...

That would be useful to form pores and cell membranes. It's also possible to get DNA strands to form basic enzymes:

www.the-scientist.com...

So once you have all those things just floating in the oceans as if the Earth were one giant cell, it would be easy for some enzymes to get trapped inside a membrane capsule with pores and have an evolutionary advantage. All it needs to do is keep swelling up with raw materials and building new cell membrane. Any holes that formed get sealed. If by misfortune, it gets cut in half, it would replicate. Then just let random mutations, additions and duplications of genes take place.

This can be modeled using software genetic algorithms, where the worst performing 10% are removed, and the top 10% are randomly mutated.

a reply to: cooperton

The educational brainwashing that crams evolution into kids at a young age totally strips them from having any meaning in their life. Seriously, if you think you are the meaningless ancestor of mutants, I don't see how you can extract any meaning from life besides concluding that you are an erroneous blip that eventually fades away forever. If that's the case, nothing you do matters, ever. Boy do I remember when I believed that, hook-line-and-sinker during my 8th grade summer. I thought I knew evolution was true, so I therefore contemplated the perpetual nothingness that awaited me. Such is the logical dead end of evolution.

so basically you are telling us that kids are too lazy and dense to spend their lives hand crafting their own sense of purpose and self esteem. which is actually a direct reflection of how they are raised. which implies that your objections are more concerned with modern parenting and less concerned with standardized curriculum.

a reply to: TzarChasm

Seems to me this rejection of modern sciences as of late is a direct result of upbringing.

Those that were brought up in a religious world are noticing that science tends to disagree with religion more and more as we find new discoveries. Thus the truely dedicated "religionist" fights against logic and reason because their holy texts are slowly becoming less relevant.

That is always the one common factor in all of these threads...

science is wrong because God is right

I've rarely seen athiests write such threads... if ever

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: TzarChasm

Seems to me this rejection of modern sciences as of late is a direct result of upbringing.

Those that were brought up in a religious world are noticing that science tends to disagree with religion more and more as we find new discoveries. Thus the truely dedicated "religionist" fights against logic and reason because their holy texts are slowly becoming less relevant.

That is always the one common factor in all of these threads...

science is wrong because God is right

I've rarely seen athiests write such threads... if ever

the truly clever subscribers to religious dogma will find room in their scripture for the possibility that god invented science so we could confirm the existence of divine oversight rather than refute it.

i am still waiting for a "divine meddler" hypothesis that is falsifiable and therefore readily tested by experts.

I belive in god aka the creator and i also believe we are in a complex system of matrixes. So complex that human beings are amongst a select group of species that can interpret this information.

originally posted by: MolecularFusion
I belive in god aka the creator and i also believe we are in a complex system of matrixes. So complex that human beings are amongst a select group of species that can interpret this information.

sounds like ego, but that is just my impression.

a reply to: Raggedyman

So, You're one of those people that thinks that unless someone believes in god, and follows the bible, then they are capable of murder, rape, theft, etc, without guilt because they don't know right from wrong?

That's what I'm getting... and to that, I repeat, it is YOUR failing that you need a book and a sky daddy in order to know right from wrong, and not something inherent to you as a human being with a brain.

originally posted by: howtonhawky
So some people still believe that life came from nonliving matter all on it's own?

Some ole wives tales diehard.

Where did it come from?

An invisible magician that only talks to people who believe in invisible magicians?

originally posted by: SummerRain

originally posted by: howtonhawky
So some people still believe that life came from nonliving matter all on it's own?

Some ole wives tales diehard.

Where did it come from?

An invisible magician that only talks to people who believe in invisible magicians?

Sounds right to me.

I am easy to please though.

It came from the word...

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: Puppylove

And that's your sad reality, you see a squirrel crossing a street and observe it, then what, nothing
Some people ask questions

No they don't, they don't ask questions. They create a cult of the holy nut tree that no one can find, where the immortal invisible magic squirrel sits atop, and watches over his squirrelly creations crossing the street. And then they go on about how they have proof that looking for the tree on earth where the squirrel came from is pointless, and to just believe in secret squirrel and you will enter the tree of holy nuts.

Science haters don't ask questions, they just observe and then nothing
Why hate on science, why hate questions?

Who is asking any questions? You're not, you're supporting the OP. And the OP certainly isn't.

Questions are not worded as "If you wish to argue the above conclusion, you have to find some flaw with the science that I presented, but to the best of my knowledge, it is all empirical, undeniable scientific fact."

He is in fact, attempting to be a teacher, thinking everyone else is a stupid child who has never spent a day in their life pondering the nature of things. Some of us have, and have seen religion for what it is. Something to keep people who lack the ability to think logically, in a big pointy house. And we have pondered the nature of evolution, and can entertain this even if it must involve the imagination. We can't build time machines, never will be able to, so we will never actually know, and all we can do is imagine based on the facts as we find them.... not making up completely deluded invisible wizards who love us so much they plonked us down here in the midst of suffering.

a reply to: howtonhawky

but but but... you have birds in your profile.

Are you... are you, h.h.h..him???

a reply to: SummerRain

also a crayfish in case i need to back track...

back tracking in 3.2.1.

originally posted by: Puppylove
a reply to: cooperton

You need an invisible sky daddy and the promise of an eternal soul to find any meaning in your life? I can't help but feel a little sorry for you.

Cooperton made no mention of an "invisible sky daddy" nor an "eternal soul".

You don't seem to have any rational refutation for the OP or their subsequent posts and are trying to argue something someone else has said and that is irrelevant to the topic.

"I can't help but feel a bit sorry for you".

originally posted by: Puppylove
a reply to: Krazysh0t

You know full well Creationists... or um... Intelligent Design Theorists refuse to allow the Abiogenesis and Evolution to be treated as separate theories. Is all or nothing for them.

That is plain rubbish and a vast and ill-informed generalization.

It is like saying that Biologists embrace Darwinian Evolution as the only possible path to biodiversity. In reality, there are a few evolutionary theories and there are things now known in genetics and biology which fall outside the remit of mechanisms of evolutionary theory.

While many people confuse chemical abiogenesis with evolution, they are entirely different.

Chemical abiogenesis posits that life can arise from chemistry and physical structure by natural means.

Evolution is a description of how life, once it exists, may diversify over time.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: Puppylove

Not everyone does need a sky daddy but
Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot figured humans were just animals and slaughtered tens of millions, men women and children
Your argument about needing a sky daddy is stupid

Equating atheism to despots is extremely insulting and a HUGE slippery slope fallacy. It's not like religions are totally innocent of abusing citizens when put in charge of governments.

Would you like it if I equated all Christians to pedophiles because the Catholic church hides pedophile priests?

But you have just done so.